Good  morning, welcome to this June 4,  2019 public patient  portion of the Lussier Council meeting . We are going to hear from those  of you who have filled out a card  and would like to share something  that is on your mind. We welcome your participation,  and after you  have been recognized, please come forward, state your name and  address for the record, and be courteous  and respectful of the views of others, personal attacks on councilmembers,  county staff, or members of the  public are frowned upon. So, the first person who wishes  to speak is Morton Colligan . 

In morning ladies and gentlemen . Morton Colligan  66 Tanglewood 66 Tanglewood Rd., a question for  the council to think about, concerning  this recent sales tax failure, did  you even consider the actual on working people when you have this extensive tax vote, $500,000. This can be also offered local  cities self-serving cut of the action. Don't limit us on the cities, you  had voted for this. It cost us $500,000. Brown and brown insurance company  and PNS paving were part of the political action committees that  got multimillion dollar contracts  during the situation on May 7. And  will get additional contract money  during this very meeting. Both contributed  to these, another  tax dodging corporation, team Volusia  supported  this after they soaked the county  for a $250,000 and up to get every  year. This is an untaxed, yet money  funded company, supporting a tax  increase. You cannot make this stuff  up, they don't pay taxes. The taxes are supported yet they  want a tax increase, they support  tax increase on people that actually  work for a living. In case you don't  realize, most people are broke.  They can't afford the cost of received  County corruption and corporate  giveaways. Your job is to defend  us, and you are doing a bad job in the  eyes of many. A recent $4.5 million  ECD contract on October 17 of 17  I think it was, he said  he recently wants 10 million more  for his art center. Are you going  to give and not too?  Just open  the wallet and throw in a safe.  The Imperial France family, billionaires, course Katie got their $20 million  for the Daytona one project, do  you think we really care about another  lousy shopping center?  Do  you think that is going to do us  any good?  No, it's not. This is  why , this is where, some of  these million-dollar tax incentives,  that is where your money goes and  should be going to better roads,  should be going to clean water,  it's going to the wealthy. Many  of those people have contributed  to your campaign contributions.  They are all there, whole bunch  of them .  All of these different companies,  to get these contracts. They all contribute to your campaign.  You should at least have the decency,  before you vote, for contracts for  people that you've got campaign  money, you should at least say you  got the campaign money before you vote those multimillion  dollar contracts. I think this counsel  deserves to apologize for being  out of touch with the people on  this $500,000 scam, and you will  get defeated next time, you can put it back on the thing  and you will get defeated next time. They deserve less money, thank  you.  

Thank you for your thoughts,  Morton. Next speaker is Norman  Dixon. 

 Norman 15 Azalea  Dr., DeBary, Florida. The  sales tax and this conservation  land, coming up later, to me and  I've got my nose, but I think I  will just go off, the sales tax,  the half sent is because our development , our Conservancy level service, we shouldn't be,  we should stop development, because we  are behind, we are behind in DeBary,  the County, the state. Concurrency  is in the Constitution. The conservation easement that you will be  talking about , in state statute 704, I mean you  are prohibited from construction of buildings, this  is an intersection , you're probably going to have  commercial there, I don't know.  But it's an intersection, you're  going to have a road. 
     In a conservation easement, that  is all prohibited, removal of trees,  vegetation. My point is, we are  not following any of the stuff.  I mean, for and in, all of this  land is protected. The land in DeBary  is protected.  You are not supposed to be doing  this. You are not supposed to be  developing beyond your ability to  provide level of service. But we  are. We have been, for decades.  This isn't really directed at you  so much, this is how we got here. The 2 acres is just a principle  of it. We have outstripped our level of  service and concurrency, now the  big thing is deceptive tanks, 80,000  septic tanks between 2014 and 2018, according  to Ms. Pulver from the news Journal. 
     I am just generally opposed to the  mitigation banks, which to me is  basically because I drive 10 miles  an hour slower in DeBary, I should  be able to drive 10 miles over the  speed limit in the city, that is  what you are doing. I am doing something  here, that I'm not really supposed  to do. But, because  I'm going to do something over here,  it's okay. In Tiger 280, Dirksen in DeBary, that's a county road, the traffic impact, this is that  my city meeting tomorrow, the traffic  impact our city, so we'll just  stroke a check and we will build  all the homes, and do Dirksen later. Shouldn't build the homes until  Dirksen is widened. This is how  we get here. The real thing here  is the tax. Mister Kelly , we will vote on it again.  I am sick and tired of that. I mean, if voting meant anything here,  they would make it illegal. We voted  on it, it was $500,000. That is  it. No voting on it again. Overturning  57,000 votes, of the people who  voted on it, and 11 point disconnect, that is  why people don't trust. We  voted, a vote is in agreement, we  will vote again. You are your own  evidence as to the distressed.  

Thank you, Norman.  Barbara Sizemore. 

I  am here to represent all the animals that cannot speak  for themselves. In my neighborhood,  there are hundreds of dogs tied  up 24/7. And all kinds of weather, with the insects, some have no  water or food as needed. And I  would like a law passed that they  cannot be tied up that long at  a time.  That is all I came for. 

Okay, thank you. John Nicholson. >> John  Nicholson 413 North Grand Avenue.  I know I'm not supposed to say this,  but I told you so. But I'm asking  you guys is to put on your big boy  pants. And to go back, the gentleman  says don't do it, I am asking you  to do it. Go back with one penny  sale increase. Because when you go with a halfpenny  you are saying okay, we have all  of these things that need to be  done, but we are not going to do  them. We are only going to do a  little of it and you are still going  to be screwed up. That doesn't say  squat. Secondly, if you read the  paper, the number of people that  said we got it, we understand we  need this, we kept pushing and pushing  you have to understand, what they  understood, you just didn't make  the case to trust you guys. That is what went through. We don't  trust you guys to do what you say  you are going to do. When I ask  questions, I would get one answer from your chair, I get another  answer from the staff, I would double  check with Jim Chisholm, get a  third answer, and then I would go to our staff  and get a fourth answer, which one  is correct?  You can't constantly  get different answers. It is either  one or the other. So, I am asking  you, to make the case, not that  we need this stuff, I mean that is obvious. Make the  case that we can trust you guys  to do what you want to do. I said  this six months ago. The biggest thing is, we don't  trust you guys. The lottery, echo,  remember?  That is the problem, we don't trust  you guys. Now, there are four of  you that are new. You have none  of the baggage of the halfpenny  sales tax, the impact fees, those are not tagged to you guys.  So there is a super majority here  that the public can trust. And I  hate to say this, but Heather, I  love you to death, but you make  your case, but then it gets lost. You get interrupted, and you lose  it. Now,  hate to point you out, when I look your face and see the  reaction, it appears that you understand  what's going on, and that you have  a holistic look at the county. Really,  you do?  You do?  Okay, I am asking  you guys to get together, and be  truthful. All right?  Tell the people one, everybody gets a little piece  of the pie, that doesn't help the  paper and the sewers, because they  cannot afford the little bit of  money they will get to do the solar  system. Neither can DeBary. All  right?  I hate the idea that DeBary  was considered the same  par as Daytona Beach in terms of  tourism. Not even close. But, we  have to fairly allocate  the funds. And it is  better we do it on the knee, to  say okay guys, it's going to be  $20 million to do a kill , that is a need. Here is 20 million,  it will get done. We need to literally  tell people we will do this, elaborated. 

 Thank you John, appreciate your  thoughts. There is no other comments? We will close the portion of the  meeting and be back here at 12. 

12?  

I am taking a break this morning. My brain took a break, we will  be back at 10. 

[  Captioner Standing By ] 

Good  morning, just to give you a time  morning, we will begin the meeting  in 3 1/2 minutes. We will begin the meeting in 3  1/2 minutes. >> I got to use that, that is kind  of cool. A hammer makes a lot of  noise sometimes, doesn't it?  Welcome  to the June 4 meeting of the Volusia  County Counsel, thank you offer  being here.  We have a lot on the agenda today.  So, hope you are here to  participate, we are here to listen  and to learn. We start the meeting  this morning, we will have the invocation  given by  Pastor Scott Smith of the First  United Methodist Church, who also  happens to be my pastor. 

Let us pray. God, I give  you thanks for these men and women  who feel called and are passionate  about leading Volusia county. They  gather here today  to intend on  doing good work. They seek to represent  those of us who given the task to govern. To God, guide their  efforts, may they be blessed with  insight. May they be guided with  understanding and wisdom . To use our resources  wisely and well, and to represent  all members of our community fairly.  Grant them grace to make decisions  that promote the common good. God, I pray for the  leaders here today, that their actions  and their words might be filled  with truth and inspire us to hope.  Made their words build each other up and not tear  down. May they encourage and not  discourage. May Volusia county show  the state and the nation  how to govern in a way that makes  us all proud to be Americans. More than anything, oh God, watch  over us, bless and keep us and grant  us peace. Amen.  

Amen. Please join me in the pledge.  

I pledge allegiance to the flag 
     of the United States of America,  and to the republic for which it  stands, one nation, under God, indivisible,  with liberty and justice for all.  >> 

He did say Sunday he was going to pray for us, especially  me. You did dress up, he's got a  jacket on. Think  of you thank you. For those of you  listening, please contact Marcy  Zimmerman if you would like to have  the faith leader for the invocation, open to all.  Take a personal policy, if I may, a tragic senseless incident involving senior deputy Frank Schofield  last week, I think we need to take  a moment of silence to recognize 
     the situation. Amen.  Senior deputy Frank Schofield U.S.  Navy veteran served  his country well, serve our community  well, served our county well. Began his career in 1995, most  of you know that better than me.  Served in several different apartments  with the sherriff's office. Not  only was he a great dedicated officer, family man , friend of many of  you here, and friends with your coworkers. Just  wanted to, I think this tragic , senseless situation  happened, it tore me up as I am sure it did  anyone. I couldn't believe something  like that could happen. I didn't  personally know Frank, but  from all of those who you've heard  from and the comments, just need  you to see why he was so well  thought of. Any of you  who would like to make comments,  please do so. 

I had the pleasure and honor of knowing Frank since the day  he started the sherriff's office. And what a great  guy Frank was come all the way around.  A big man. But not a  man that used that type  strongly.  He knew how to work with people,  how to take care of people, how  to help TiVo. But by the same token,  when you needed a backup, you sure  were proud to see Frank Schofield show up on the scene.  Frank Hattaway of diffusing things,  just by his mere size and his ability, you can look at  him until he had the ability to  back it up, and if necessary, he  would back it up. It didn't matter  what it was, for the sherriff's  office and for the people. Frank  was there. Our hundred deputies, hundred kids  program that was started by Sheriff  Bogle was such a good deal, where  he took care of the kids every year  and Frank was always there. With the kids, to make sure they  had Christmas. Didn't matter what kind of special  assignment you needed out there,  whether it was the middle of the  night on the river, or whether he  was on the S.W.A.T. team when he  was on motors, he was always there.  You never heard Frank complain.  He would review. He was good  at that. But he was just one of  those people. You could not help  but like him and respect him. The best thing you can ever say  about a law enforcement  officer is actually two things.  He was standup, and he  is known what is a cop's cop . And believe me, when a law enforcement officer  refers to somebody as a cop's cop,  you just can't give them any higher rating than that. Frank  will be missed by the men and women  of the agency. And he will be missed by all the citizens of Volusia  county.  I personally will  miss Frank, he was always good to  me. Good for me, and there when  I needed him. I  guess he is one of the reasons that  I took the love for air boating,  because he took his time as an airboat  instructor to help me  get to where I was, so I could safely  run airboat. That is the kind of  man he was. He was there for everybody. And the citizens of Volusia  county have lost  one fine individual , somebody we will  never forget, thank you. 

Thank you, I think you echoed  the feeling and sentiments of each  of us up here.  Miss post?  >> There have been lots of  comments about Frank since Sunday. 
     I think  that the outpouring of support at  the hospital really shows the kind of man Frank was. The second everyone heard what  happened, you know , the first thought was  it's Frank. He will bounce up off the bumper, dust himself  off, no problem. He is going to  be fine, no problem. And I think that was everyone thought. But, the response and the  outpouring of support at the hospital,  the outpouring of support , I'm sure a lot of you felt the procession, there is a video  and everything, or saw it if you  were out . The people that just came from  everywhere when they heard that  Frank was in the hospital, to  follow the ambulance. It was just phenomenal.  I think that is a great tribute  to Frank. He was one river 11.  I can't tell you how many people  who have talked about you know,  being on the boat on the weekend , going out of his way to help  them and with their boats, when  they break down or whatever it was. He worked overtime, worked a lot  of overtime at the airport. Everybody  at the airport knew him. Just a  wonderful, wonderful guy. There is a  huge vacuum in this county with  his loss. 

Inc. you, miss Post.  We will now move  to the comments on the consent agenda,  I have two items that wish to be  pulled, item M.  

Sorry. Rollcall? 

I thought we were all  here anyway. I am still on central standard daylight savings  time. So, let's have the  rollcall please.  

Miss Post?  

Here.  

Miss Wheeler?  

Here.  

Miss Denys?  

Here.  

Miss  Denys five ?  

Here.  

Mister Lowery?  

Here.  

After Kelley?  

Here  Mathilde you were all here. On the agenda, I have  two items I was to be pulled, item  M and DD to be pulled. Any other items?  

Mister chair?  

 Oh, sorry.  

Item B just for discussion.  

To comment on?  

Correct.  

Item to be for comment. Absent items M and  DD , motion to approve by Wheeler?  Seconded by Lowery, any additional  comments?  Any objection to the  motion?  The  path is an unanimous, and item M and item M .  

That was me. I just  wanted to pull that for some explanation.  I have had some constituents ask  and we had it addressed this morning. I asked the staff if they would  expand a little bit on the way all  of that works with the conservation,  thank you Sir.  >> In mourning, director of growth  and resource management. Today as  we are trying to transfer land from  Volusia County to DeBary, the 2  acre parcel is located right on  U.S. Highway 1792, across from where  --  

Can we limit  conversation in the audience, please? If you  have conversations, if you would  just take it outside 
     or wait until we have a break, thank  you.  

So, we are talking about 2 acres  located on U.S. 1792. They are part  of what is been known as the Gemini  Springs addition. The 2 acre tract  is right there on the highway. 
     It is upland, it is an area that  is needed in order to ensure that  Florida is able to contact , to move over and to be able to  make contact and access.  

Excuse me.  

Can you point on that? We've got the ability to delineate , can you do that?  

Trying to do that right now,  ma'am. There we go. That is where it is, this is the  2 acre tract we are talking about.  The 2 acre track is upland, it's an area that's needed for Florida  to make access so we can have a  signalized intersection. To provide  some past history, the subject property  right here is known as  the DeBary transit oriented  area.  It's something there for considerable  amount of time.  It was basically put in place to  address the issues that were associated  with  son rails. One central station was  put in place, it was important to  make sure that the local land-use  plan and zoning encouraged transit oriented development to  occur there. Also, this is an area  subject to a taking bay D.O.T. for a lighting of 1792. When the  taking occurred, the property owners  were granted access points on 1792,  with full  access. In other words, they could  come back at a later date with excuse  me, a signal. Either way, they were  going to be allowed to have full  access from that property on 217  92. Now, 
     you've passed forward to the actual  development occurring out there,  D.O.T. has indicated that they cannot  have what. Even though it was part  of their settlement agreement, because  it does not match their access management  for 1792. So, D.O.T., the city of DeBary  has contacted the county to see  if there would be a way to resolve  these issues to ensure that the  transit oriented development objectives  are contained in the city of DeBary's  comprehensive plan could be realized.  When we looked at it, obviously  we were concerned because the Gemini  Springs addition is a valuable  part of our conservation land and  something we took very seriously  when we actually took over ownership from St. Johns River water  management District. I know back in 2016, there was  considerable amount of concern about  102 acres that were subject to the  city trying to get it from  then St. John, that 102 acres  is basically this area and here. 
     That contains wetlands and critical  parts that are necessary for the  protection and preservation  of Gemini Springs. As I said, the  area we are talking about today  is not that area. It is  a small 2 acre tract that is immediately  adjacent to 1792. 
     Mister Watts is here, he is the  attorney for the developer of the  transit oriented developing occurring  in there. If there are any questions  for him, he is available. If there  are any questions, I'll be glad  to answer them.  

Mister chair, may I please add  something?  

Sure.  

This property is mitigation property  for the ultimate project, it was 
     bought with money from the D.O.T.  to pay for mitigation from widening  of I4, and the Lake  Monro bridge. In order for this  property to be released, for use other than  conservation purposes, the developer  has to go to the Army Corps of Engineers,  and get a release from that mitigation  bank requirement , and a release from the DEP  from the state mitigation requirement. Once that is  done, and no longer serve the conservation  purpose. It is up to those agencies  to determine what that mitigation  trade-off would be for this 2 acres. My understanding of the Army Corps  of Engineers has already tentatively  agreed to a payment into a mitigation  bank and will do to offset  the impacts under the Army Corps permit, and  they are still working with DEP  to offset the impacts under the state permit. I want  to make that clear, this is not at all like the 2016 sense where  they wanted it to be handed over  for another use. The developer in  this instance is actually being  required to go provide alternative negation, in order to have the  conservation requirements removed  from this property, before  it would be transferred.  

Okay, thank you. Ms. Denys.  

Mister Irvin, something you said  at the beginning, so, D.O.T. had agreed  to this, go back to what you said  about that?  

The frontage along U.S. 1792,  when there is a widening of that  road, there was an agreement  that D.O.T. entered into with the  property owners as part of the settlement  agreement. But of that  settlement agreement was that they  would be able to have a full access  point along their frontage of 1792.  That was prior to several different actions by the  D.O.T. in regards to access management  and other things. So, now, they  are coming in for their development  permit over the last several years,  that is where D.O.T. has identified  that they cannot necessarily honor  that requirement, they are willing to work with them  on alternatives. So, this provides  a methodology to get to the ability to have a signalized  intersection praxis for the  area.  

So, are we in the situation because  D.O.T. has said  that --  

In part,  yes ma'am. This is a D.O.T. permit.  That is why they are signatory to  this agreement.  

I bet they are.  Yeah, so, my frustration is we are in  this situation, because there was  an agreement made with F D.O.T.,  but the red flag on that. 
     From F D.O.T., now here we are in  this situation.  

Looking like the bad guys.  

Looking like the  bad guys when all we have done,  we are trying to do is comply with  a request from an agreement that  we didn't enter into, but that requires  access, and TOD that has been determined, correct?  

Correct. 

So,  there is nobody from F D.O.T. today  here is there? I am  just putting this one on the list. So, it is frustrating to  me that as the local government,  we do everything that we are required to do by the  state agencies. And then yet, within  our jurisdiction,  we have to be the ones to oversee  this. This is what is going to be  happening more and more, especially as legislative  things turn around, there will be  an adversarial relationship created,  unfortunately between the county 
     and our cities statewide, that we  have no control over. We didn't  do, but we have to walk out in  our position. This is part of that. This is the  beginning of that. One of them.  Going to be many more. So, this is your district, Doctor  Lowry.  This is my comment.  

I just wanted to echo that. You  know, I feel bad for the folks who entered into  the agreement out there, then had  the road pulled out from underneath  them, now we are trying to solve an issue, but I  just want there to be clarification.  You know, I was out of town so I  got caught up to speed really quick  here on all of this. But, we are  solving, trying to solve a problem  that the state created. I also wanted  to note, let everybody know, this  is upland area, this is not, it  is also not that controversial land  that a couple years ago, that was dealt with, I will just  leave that alone. But anyway, with that explanation and so forth,  I moved to approve item M please .  

I will second.  

Motion made by Lowry,  approve item M, any additional?  Mister Johnson , still have a comment? 

Yeah, I will make it short.  Once again, where the state steps  in and steps on our home, I want  to echo what I heard down here.  Makes us look like the bad guys when they are taking away our right  to help out or do what's right.  And for them to renege on an agreement they made, then put  the landowner into a bind, I've  got an issue, once again with the  state, we are from Tallahassee,  we are here to help you, that bothers  me.  

Thank you.  

Did you have another comment? >> My only comment is, I don't know if  this is time sensitive but, do we  want to approve it today? Or pull  it for later, Dr. Lowry? I know  there is a motion and a second on  the floor.  But there appears to  be some concerns over this. It is  your district, I will defer to you. 

You've made the motion.  

This Denys? The facts are not  going to change . The facts  are not going to change, this is  the situation we are in, we think  we have done the best we can to  preserve the conservation obligation,  by requiring the developer to go  on lease from the permits, and it is not going to change, even  if we postpone it, there is no new  information to unfold, nothing more  that we can provide you.  

Okay, this post?  

I think this is a good example  of you know, the issue is what it  is. This is where we are at. But  we really need to take note of the process that these things are happening.  And, work on the  process. So, if the process with  D.O.T. that we need to work on,  a process with the city we need  to work on, that is really what  we need to be focusing on. But,  I think the issue is what it is. So obviously I am in favor.  

Thank you, look at it this way,  the issue was created by F D.O.T. on their commitment. We  are put in the spot of being the  ones that are having to take it,  there is nothing that we can do  to affect this process, because  we cannot change what F D.O.T. is going to do or say. The only  thing we can do is to try to still  do more for home rule and this issue is  going to come up as we are going  to be seeing some of the presentations  that we have seen the overreach,  we will see this on some of the  issues that we are facing, this  is a process we cannot fix or change,  because we cannot tell F D.O.T., as much as we would like  to, how to run the F  D.O.T., did you have another comment?  >> Mr. Irvin, I have one more question.  You mentioned 102 acres,  is that 
     2 acres of the 102?  

Yes or . back 2 acres of the  102, I wanted to clarify because  I stated that wrong earlier.  

We have a motion, second, we  have had discussion, are there any  objections to the motion?  No  motion, the pass is unanimous. We  will moved to item D, D. Mike? 

Mike, resources utilities director. This item here  to give you a little bit of background, this resides within the city of  DeBary, these are the two city  of DeBary developments, we  are the water and sewer provider  for the city. So, to give you a  little bit of background, and a  little self-explanatory in the agenda  item, that the first development  of Integra 289 had come before  a/year, we executed utility service  agreement, to provide the service  to that area, under certain terms  and conditions, which that development  had brought to us at that time.  Initially, it was a private station. Subsequently,  several months later, additional  development adjacent to  Integra 289 started coming forth and rather than consider  building another station, the concept  was to create one primary lift station to serve both developments.  The agreement that is  before you is kind of crafted in  cooperation with the two developments  down there and of course, County  legal to put together this agreement,  ultimately, the larger  station also benefits additional  development coming down the line. So, trying to make the , I think we  have made a good situation out of  this, if I can answer any specific  questions, I would be happy to do  so.  

 Questions, Mark, are you okay?   Okay. I will entertain the  motion to approve the  First Amendment to utility service  agreement with Integra 289, the  interchange.  

Moved.  >> Wheeler, any further discussion?  Any objections or motions?  Hearing  none, they motion pass is unanimous, thank you. We will moved to  item 2. And less again  I missed one somewhere.  

Item B, Sir.  

Which one?  

Item B.  

Item B for comment, I  told you. 

I pulled this because, it's  about affordable housing. And we  are, it is nothing new for  Volusia County, this is one of the  great things , one of the great products we are  working on. Just wanted to make  sure we highlighted it. And just put it out there for discussion  on affordable housing.  

Absolutely, good morning, Donna  Butler, immunity services director.  This is a great partnership between  the County of Volusia using ship  funds,  and as well, they are using their  own dollars and there CRA dollars  to fund the project, we put  notice of funding availability out  on the street, asking for low income  developers to partner with us. Nonprofit  low income developers to partner  with us in a project, a small project.  And the county is putting in $200,000  of ship funds, and the city provided 
     the land, and CRA provided $75,000.  To match our $200,000. So they will  be building a duplex, one will be  at 50% of the area meeting income,  the other will be at 80% of the  area meeting income, and they have  to hold the affordability 
     period for a minimum of 15 years.  So we are really excited about the  project, small investment on our  part, but it will do well in East Bernard Beach. Happy  to answer any questions.  

One question, did you say CRA  dollars?  

Yes. New Smyrna Beach CRA, it  is within their CRA. 

Okay, thank you.  >> I think what this shows is, it  shows how we are trying to work  for homeless, we are making an effort. So,  all of you who continue to send  us emails, wanting us to meet with  people on homeless, this is an ongoing  process that we have had that  we are continually working on. Doing  what we can, with the funds available  and working with the communities  to help with the homeless or the  affordable housing, which is , might as well be homeless, right? To have affordable housing where we can, so we are still continuing,  we are not going to stop. Any other  comments,  Ms. Wheeler?  

Thank you Mr. chair.  You know,  what concerned me, Donna we are  out there trying to help and  the proposed project  was the only application received. 

That's correct.  >> That is a big deal. That is  the only application received. We  cannot fill things, we cannot try  to meet the needs of people do not  put in the application.  >> Absolutely.  

To only have one application,  that is a sad thing, with the needs  we have. Thank you.  >> 
     I was going to point that out, but  since you did, and that was also,  to those who are actively working  on affordable housing, maybe you  could do a little bit more than  trying to solicit us who are doing  something, and make people aware  of funding that may be available,  so you could apply. 

When we  close this up, I want to think 
     Smyrna Beach and not omit my Commissioner,  Alan the audience, who is a big  proponent of this, just saw him,  sorry, personal point of privilege,  thank you.  

You have used yours for the day. 

I've got more.  

Not surprising. Okay, now I think without objection,  we will moved to item number two.  Which is a -- public hearing, we will open the  public hearing and have the staff  report.  

Good morning.  Tad, County engineer. This  is a petition to vacate a portion  of the two blocks in the 15th division of the de Leon Springs . Mr. Weingart submitted the position  to vacate box 179 and 180 , the  sections north of Spring Garden  as shown in the exhibit. They also would like to vacate  the unopened 50 foot right-of-way  for Ponce de Leon Street. We have  no objections from the neighbors  or from the utilities.  

I have  no one wishing to speak from the  public, we will close public hearing,  counsel?  Any questions?  Is there  a motion?  

I will move to approve.  >> Vacation of portion of the  plot of the 15th division of de  Leon Springs Heights, map book 10, page 62 and 63 in daily on Springs  area.  

Second.  

Motion made by Girtman, second  by Johnson . 
     Any further discussion?  Any objections  to motion?  Hearing no objection,  the motion pass is unanimous, we  will move on to item 3. Donna Butler?  >> Good morning again, Mr. chair,  members of council, Donna Butler  and, coming from the rear of the  room, Mr. Josh Wagner,  who will  also be presenting briefly this  morning with me. So, the first item,  these two really go hand-in-hand,  items three and four. They are in  support of the veterans Memorial  Plaza Park that is going to  be built in Daytona. And at the base of our town, the Memorial Bridge. So,  the nonprofit organization was formed  under the leadership of Mr. Wagner,  and they are doing a great deal  of work to fund raise in the community.  However, we need to also apply for  some grants. So, this document we  have before you is an agreement  between the Volusia County Veterans Memorial  Plaza for the veterans memorial  Plaza, and ourselves, so that we  can apply for the grant funds that  are needed on behalf of those Plaza  or in partnership 
     with, we will had no administrative  capacity, we will build if they  do additional fundraising. So we  had great assistance from Mike from  the legal department, and the two  of them kind of duke it out on the  legal side and got us to where we  need to be.  

Thank you very much . Thank you  everyone, great to be here, Josh  Wagner, 4321 S. cleanup  

Thank you very much . Thank you  everyone, great to be here, Josh  Wagner, 4321 South Cleanup Ave.  

Thank you very much . Thank you  everyone, great to be here, Josh  Wagner, 4321 South Cleanup Ave.  I like using those numbers, easier.  You said it, I didn't. You know,  this has been a great project. Those  that have been by the Memorial that  cars happen to go, they don't  call it the bridge anymore, if you  see it, you can understand why. A lot of county time has been sent  on that, let us daytime and federal  dollars stemming to the state. For  those of you that aren't aware,  what happened was, with the Memorial,  we were able to get the federal  funding, it flowed through the state,  came to us, we had countless meetings  with the board, where we you know, crunched everything to  make sure the residence, there was 
     back in that time there was fight  over how the bridge was set up,  it was going to be high-rise, drawbridge,  ultimately the finances won, it  was much cheaper to do that. The  federal government funded everything  for the bridge  part. It also funded the fishing,  because if you know, going, interesting  in the process, the fishing bridge was low and they  fished a lot, by doing high-rise,  they lost fishing. So County stopped  an excellent job getting funding  for that. It also funded the design of the Veterans Memorial Plaza.  Which was a huge deal. Because that is part of any  project, as you know, getting it  designed and ready. However, that  being said, we could not get the  federal dollars and state dollars  to do the actual buildout. So that  is when I left the Council, the  Council asked me to stay on begrudgingly,  I stayed on as one of the last things I said  I would continue to do. And I'm  happy I did it. We have raised money,  we have been selling bricks, we  have been doing everything we can  to get that part done. We have raised  quite a bit. But going with the  tax law changes, to not bore you  with some of the things that have  happened, the people that want to  you know, a third of third a third  if you look at how we are looking  at it, hopefully an active grant  for a third of it, hopefully racing  and rack, a third, that is why we  need this local and then the next  agenda item, another third of it  to be covered by private dollars.  Part of that interlocal, what you  are reading is the ribbon-cutting  the bridge, it will also be the  groundbreaking of the Plaza. And  a lot of the donated, they don't  want to donate money, it'll be  more of an advertising expense.  Because it will be part of that  ribbon-cutting and as far as the pamphlet, our  organization, the nonprofit, which  I started, which all we do is raise  money for Volusia County, it's been  pretty neat. It is just doing this  so we can have a legal way to make  sure the county is happy, to.the  eyes and cross the tease. It is  very positive, been a great strength  as you know if you have seen the  bridge it's beautiful with the Veterans  Memorial Plaza, it'll be that much more  beautiful. So, I hope everyone sees  this as a huge positive. This is  one of the few items that is there  is absolutely no negativity. I am  sure there is someone, I heard someone  yell outside about something earlier, it wasn't  this. Once again, I am proud to  be here before you, counsel and  I look forward to working with you  in partnership.  

Thank you Josh, Ms. Wheeler?  

Thank you Mr. chair.  Josh, thank  you for your leadership on this. As you are in my position, two  years ago, and you started this  years ago. I just kinda picked  up steam to kind of be on the side as the encourager and  help with the fundraising and all  of that sort of thing. This is so  exciting. We have made some videos  that have been televised and write a  few things, one of the things I  wanted to bring up, and it's been  a question that you and I both have  had several times brought before  us, and they couldn't find the right  link as to where to ask and finally,  Tim Bailey informed me, the Purple  Heart people would like to have a monument,  and I guess this is where we need  to ask the Council for the approval  to also add a Purple Heart monument,  and Rob Phillips has asked for that,  as well as the invisible wounds  the moral, the Goldstar, Kathy Hyder.  And the thing is, they are both  raising the funds for that , their monuments. So it's not us  taking on that also. But, they want  to make sure that they can be included  in that memorial Plaza. I didn't know  if we needed a Council approval  on that , I keep getting different answers.  

I can fill you in a little bit  on that if you would like.  

Please.  >> There was discussion, county staff  can probably remember, been five  years, my memory fails me as I've  been getting older.  

Both sent in letters.  

They have sent in letters but  they came back years ago, there  was off commitments made by the  Council. There is plenty of room in  the Plaza and the location, they  have come before, I don't have it  directly in front of me, of which  ones have come, but there are at  least two, if not three from the  Council. And again, there is plenty  of room, especially along with the  bridge lands on the west portion,  we discussed this. It is up to the  Council obviously. There is some  history with those organizations,  it's one of the things they are  donating, it is not nothing you  have to commit money to. It is very  positive, they are  legitimate veterans organizations.  

I would suggest if you want to make that formal,  bring that later. 
     It is not included in today's material.  

Correct, but I wanted part of  the conversation, so as staff, if  we can bring that so I can bring  it further, if there are no further  questions, I would like to move  approval, can I do that?  Move approval  or agreement between the County  of Volusia, and the Volusia County  Veterans Memorial Plaza for  the Veterans Memorial Plaza.  

Motion made by 
     Wheeler, second by post. Any further  discussion?  Any objection to the  motion?  Hearing none, motion passes unanimous, thank you Josh for your  continued service and work on this,  it is very important. And I know  all of us will be ready to cross that bridge,  and spent some time there. So, thank  you both.  

Thank you.  

Don't leave.  

Item 4. 

Item 4. This is the request from our staff,  to be able to apply for the Daytona  Beach racing and recreational facilities  district grant process. There are  actually going to be  two complete grant years that are  going to be applying for grant funds.  We will be applying for four different  segments, $100,000 for each , each year has  two grant cycles, we will actually  be doing it for times, asking for  the total of $400,000, those funds  would be used as a match for  a potential echo application to the County of Volusia.  

Okay, Ms. Wheeler?  

 Mr. chair, I also wanted to point  out, there was a correction made  on this,  and there is absolutely  no obligation that the county has , this is strictly the fundraising portion of it, and if we don't  get the money, it is going to be  downsize or whatever. So, and I  did want to just throw in the pun  that 4 x 8 bricks are 125 and 8  x 8 or 300. Just going to throw  that in as a little plug. At this point, I would like to  move approval to submit the application  to the Daytona Beach racing and  recreational facilities district  grant. 

Motion made by Wheeler, second  by Ms. Denys, any further discussion?  Any objection to motion, hearing  none, the motion is passed unanimous,  like we are already putting out three, we'll put in item 4. Moving  to item 5.  

Thank you Josh, for all of your  work.  

John Booker. 

Good morning.  

Good morning.  

John Booker, government affairs,  Volusia County. 
     Today is a movement to stay, not  only do we have Josh in the chambers,  but we've got our folks from strategies  here as well. More importantly,  today 100 years ago, Congress adopted  19th amendment to the Constitution,  in which case and the right to  vote. 100 years , although it didn't technically  happen, two  thirds adopted. No comment, just wanted to bring  it out.  

It is a happy day, that is all. You can stop your campaign  for president. 

So this year is my first real year in Tallahassee with the  legislature. I have new governor,  as everybody knows. A lot of uncertainty. 
     Very few bills, I passed a little  graphic there of the bills presented  to the governor's office so far.  He took a trip overseas , just got back last week . that  we expect more and more bills  to be presented to the governor. And the big one, the  appropriations, so my thoughts , miscues used to say if  you are not at the table, you are  on the menu. One of my observations  was that, even  if you are at the table in Tallahassee,  you are still on the menu. And,  that was borne  out conversation, with Oscar and  David, the facts , the folks we worked closely with,  that conferences next week, one  of the forms is talking about the  issue of  retention and home row. They recognized the conversation takes place. Their first to rapidly respond  to numerous pieces of legislation.  Without a clear picture of their  purpose, or whether compromises  would be acceptable to the state.  So, that is the big fight. So far,  the county is concerned, as least from my viewpoint, 66 other counties  are up there, continually some more active than others, 283  cities, 109 pounds, so far as is concerned, and preemption,  it is a group effort. Our folks, league of cities, the whole 9 yards,  one of the biggest issues that I  focused on was the sales  tax revenue that was out there. 
     Mr.  sickly on the outside, so we  worked that fairly hard, the big issue was  enactment date, the second issue  was passing  the legislation. But anyway,  that was a big issue on both sides , lots of parties were interested. The house , our efforts were mainly on the Senate side.  The house had indicated that it  was a high priority , and that they were not really  interested in doing much on the  amendment side or softening side.  So, you've got tree trimming, a  bill that actually passed, our folks,  the league of cities we were able  to get that water down a bit. And then, interesting to note,  also, the group which is the folks , similar to me, meet every Wednesday,  up there 
     during session. And a large part  of it is you know, what if you heard,  did you talk to so-and-so?  So-and-so is not bending on this. There may  be room for some improvement over  there. So, it was really a collaborative  effort. And it goes back to being  up there, and if you are not up  there, having folks like Oscar and  David up there, who are pretty much  living and breathing capital. For that, two months, for session. So, next week, some of you are going  to FAC , some of you will be there, it  might be a good opportunity to have  a sidebar conversation, I relied on some of these bills, some senators  aren't interested in  conversations, so I used to tell  folks when they would come to work,  for me and another position I said, you know  sometimes it is not how many good  things you do, it is how many bad  things you avoid doing. And, and  Aaron conversation with an elected  official sometimes doesn't, isn't  most fruitful of conversations that  you have up there.  My first call is always Oscar and David,  hey have you heard this?  Have you  seen it, have you talked anybody?  What is representative so-and-so  said?  So, the bills that again, that we seem to be most  interested in are the home row encourages and preemption's unfunded mandate . I know our legal staff had  gone into some great detail on some of these  bills, so few bills have been passed,  I am at least waiting a little bit  further to send you some of  our thoughts come of and of course  Clays got some growth management that he  is looking at. But again, we are  waiting for the governor to act  on that. So things autostart folding  really quickly. 

[ Captioners transitioning ]  

>> Things ought to start folding really  quickly. We had 2 appropriations  request Williamson is  in play, funded at $2 million and  that is the last leg from hand to  Strickland and David has been in  steady communication the governor's  office talking about the equivalence  of finishing the project and  our prior success with the legislature  and so again that  bill has not been presented to the  governor yet and we will keep using all of our efforts to make sure that we  keep that appropriation in there.  The other one was Bellevue, I bring  that up, it was aired out pretty  for -- quickly in the process, if  you can recall of federal law was  here couple of three months ago  and he and I  been talking about some opportunities  that we might try to work with representative  walls office in the economic development  agency planning grant, we are circling back once things calm down a little  bit on the stateside and I will  be working with Mr. Wells office and Clarence  at Becker. So while I  was at the Department of Transportation  I talked about lessons learned.  So one of the things that I need  to do and I think I will ask you all to assist me  with this is to engage our legislature  a little bit more during the off-season when you  [Indiscernible - low volume]  Mr. Santiago that is go have coffee  with them at bagel king and I would  like to do that with them with any  of you all, that which to do  so, committee week starts I believe is at September? Mid-September  this year. So we will need to get on that  during the summer months.  The other thing I was really overwhelmed and I think there were 3000  and change bills submitted. 
     That is one thing, I don't think  I was totally prepared for, evaluated  them and sending them out to staff  so I do think that lessons learned  from me, I can be a little  bit better prepared for the  gamut of bills that comes in and how that affects or potentially  affects the County. 
     After Mr. DeSanto does  the toes or passing, David and I and Oscar will get together and  try to evaluate Mr. DeSanto's dispersed legislative session and try to see if there are some  nuances to that. When we go into  appropriations request or bill focus  that we can kind of see and it was  interesting and I was surprised Mr. DeSanto  vetoed the straw belt which was  a preemption from the home real  issue. I never thought in 1 million years  he was going to veto it but that  was fairly quick out of the gate.  Russian out was pretty doggone good for County and city and local government.  Talking about the citizens having  the ability to have their  local folk make these rules of whether  or not to have [Indiscernible -  low volume] not say less  -- yes or no on straws but  the governor vetoed that bill and there was a little  bit of a surprise at least to the  folks I talked to. Oscar put together a  little presentation which is for  the first pages up there and first  page is the statistic item, and you go to the next one,  please, ma'am. Next one. This is the list that Oscar  put together in this when is just  not Volusia County meaning the County  of Volusia but these are all monies  that were approved in the legislative  process for entities in Volusia  County so there is  Oscar  indicates about $150 million to different enterprises.  Okay?  

[Indiscernible - low volume]  

Yes, yes, yes. Denys as of the PowerPoint was  online and I said yes.  You can  talk to Bellevue and Williamson,  one more, again other issues that we were focusing on was library  funding, some of the cultural funds that  are a bump in funds. I know everybody  was interested in affordable housing  anything Oscar conducted that a  little bit more in detail than I. It did  not sleep as much as they normally  do but they still swept a lot and  again hurricane Michael was some  of where those funds went. Transportation funding, it was a  little bit down from prior years  on the work program. But still that  is factor of gas in tax revenue  and nothing really that we would  have any control over. And then  the water bills, they were all topsy-turvy, 50 million at one  point in time and then it got tossed  back and forth and back and forth,  all part of [Indiscernible - low  volume] how they are  made up in Tallahassee. Again we  go into the next slide, one more. One more. So just want to bring this up as  an aside note  Oscar and I talked on a Tuesday  about the cancer presumption.  We had that on our monitor list.  It was going nowhere in the house.  Had not had a hearing,  nothing, did. That was on a  Tuesday, Wednesday even when we looked at Thursday  schedule, and it was scheduled for  a vote instead affairs at it o'clock  in the morning the following morning. Boom, like lightning bolt , it went through, past, and I tell the story just the governor signed it, the quickness sometimes, especially  at the end of session, is truly  amazing to see. And sometimes disconcerting  to be a part of. But nevertheless  that is what it is. So anyway, I talked for my 11 minutes  and I will open it  to any questions you may have of  me of Oscar -- or of Oscar  for David and we will get forward.  

George.  

I was just going to reinforce John's request from  the us season work at -- off-season work  and I think we discussed it and  I need your help. I think it is  apparent when you're out in  the community as much as we have  been lately, that there is a lot  of educational needs in the lot  that we have to work on and I think  our state legislature need  to be out we need to get out and  help them 
     by getting the issues in front of  them early so that they have plenty  of time to research. I think we  can be helpful on so I think  that is a very powerful request.  We also -- we did invest a little bit of software  to help out John who was with 3000  bills coming at him, I will say I want to thank the department  heads, division heads, who responded quickly to John's  request,  and it is always an interesting  time because there are -- they are  still doing their day jobs and is  John points out was the speed of  some of this, we have to drop what  they are doing and help out and  they've done a great job. So I just  want to point that out and again emphasize the importance  of this summer.  >> Denys?  

 Thank you, Mr. Chair, and  to that -- several years ago we  had her legislature and for  lunch, I believe.  

We did do that at  least one time that I am aware of.  

I think it is time and other  no how Council wants to go  through this but maybe a breakfast  before we get started  because it  is kind of difficult especially  -- for them in their busy calendar  -- before a Council meeting that we bring them  in for coffee and bagels or whatever  and have or just talk to them and  they talk to us and we have done  that multiple times. I think it  is time to do that again. While  we are in off-season, is that something -- I don't care  if it is lunch or breakfast or however  we do it or copy, but I think  if we do it before we get started,  we don't break up our day. We don't  break up their day more  importantly and better chance of  getting them all here first thing  in the morning. Then we do -- is  that something --  

I know this is remotely connected  to what we are talking about that  I would rather you are posting comments  for discussion? If possible.  

Okay, item number 7 on my closing  comments I will add that at this  time.  

That is fine.  

I just  want to follow-up on the request from Ellen  on Bill 2189 , if there is any update or any  expectation? That was the when David and I had  spoken about and I know he talked  about the governor's office in that  regard. So again the effort and  the outreach was made, I did speak  to Mr. Santiago's office, and Erik  as well in that regard  and asked them if there was any  stone unturned in regards to supporting that request . Erik indicated that it was in the hands of the governor and that the lobbying effort  was pretty much complete  in that regard. Sometimes you can  -- maybe too  much on something.  

Got you.  

And I think in so far as any other appropriation request out  there, I think we can play just  like anyone else.  

John, just for one quick one  --  

But I just wanted to add for  the record it was the city of Lake  Helen request to appropriate 43,500 to help restore  Lake Helen.  

Okay.  

Thank you .  

For clarification and those listening  online and may not understand the  term sweeping funds, would you just  --  

Yes, sweeping, there is a fund of money that exists  that the legislature has the ability to move that money around so sweeping means moving .  

Or stealing would be a better  word.  

Your words, Mr. Chair, not mine. Yes, moving  funds moving them around to fund as legislature 
     sees fit.  

Thank you for your work on this  I thought we were kept very in the  loop on this this year, appreciate your  work.  

I can do better and I can always  do better and I will be better next  year.  

Was a 4300 bills or so what was  in the total number?  

37?  

Dirty 700 and how many of those  -- 3700? How many of those never  saw the light of day?  

197  bills passed and some of those would've  incorporated --  

Some of those almost 4000 never even saw a first committee  hearing.  

Correct.  

That is important part that I  think of having to try to keep up  with all of those initial builds  that are filed that for the most  part will not see light and like  you mentioned the one that showed  up on Thursday, that was out there  and had been out there before all  of a sudden it pops up and goes  right through so one of those things  where you never know kind of like  we got stuck last year. Shipping  funny on the fourth floor  at the end of the session you see  Senator so and so walking over to  the house chambers and boom an amendment  miraculously shows up 45 minutes  later and just watching this take  place, is interesting. Place so  much defense sometimes on these  issues, you know. I don't follow  basketball that much but Doc Rivers  I have seen him speak and at one point in time his head  if you're not talking you're not  playing defense and so David talks  a lot and Oskar does  too and I try to talk up there as  well so a lot of it is just defense. Making sure that something may not see the light of day.  

Ms. post?  

The one thing I want to give  out a shout out to staff as well  was this year I think that we had  a little bit more and I'm hoping next year we continue to build  the momentum on it and being proactive but our directors because there  are so many couple of thousand bills  being introduced consistently, 
     that each of our directors are keeping  up if there is something or tree  trimming coming up in public works  area or something coming up and  public safety that they are on it  and I know Jim Judge, they are on it and they  are keeping track and asking questions,  but what I appreciated as well was that is also being filtered out 
     and that information is being passed  on beyond those different divisions so kudos to everyone working together  and I am really looking forward  to some momentum and I did just  want to point out we have Justin  with Congressman Walz's office in  the audience here today so thank  you very much for being here and  be part of the collaboration and  again looking forward to this next  year.  

Thank you, John and thank you  for the report 
     and no action needed other than  the fact that we have heard it and  appreciate it and move to item 6  and this is a public hearing we  will open to public hearing and  get staff report from Clay Irvin.  >> Good morning  director of [Indiscernible - low  volume] and before you today  is a request for special exceptions  for a rural event Center at 21.5  acre property located on North Privette Avenue. The subject property  was presented to the PL DCR at the  April meeting.  Stefan forward with the recommendation  of approval. Proposed rule event Center complies with all  the criteria that we have identified  in the zoning ordinance for that  special exception. As you are aware  there is basically set in gold  in regards to setback and buffering, hours of operation, limitations  on noise and lighting, so that that  way folks who live in the rural  areas are not going to be impacted  by the potential use of these things  for things such as weddings or rural  events. Is can see on the area which  is from your staff report on page 6/36, the shows the subject  property as you can see, is in a  vacant position. The applicant Granville Farms did initiate some  clearing on this site prior is  identified that they could not do  so and they working with us to make  sure that is mitigated for otherwise I will have Frank OSSI from the PL RDC that  says this is her first rural event Center that we have seen  come in before that is actually  operating. So the fact is these  folks have worked with staff to  come up with a plan from the ground  up to come in and meet all of our  criteria that we have an art zoning  ordinance. We do have on page 16  and  six test 19 a copy of the site plan  and building elevation that [Indiscernible  - low volume] construction of this  building. As you can see the zoning  is for resource and resource court  on page 6 test 37 and then overhear  it gives you the site plan and the  generalized data that we are talking  about in regards to the area where the access  is going to be coming in and location  of the building and these are wetlands  in this area and the applicant has  made a point of staying  out of the wetlands and out of the  wetland buffers and they are locating  all of their septic and well, meaning  all of the critters established by the health  department so right now we are not  seen any major issues from the perspective. On page 6 test three, we have a  listing of all of the criteria that  we have established for the operation , the applicant is aware of those  and expected for those in part of  the recordation from the PL DRC  and the staff and 
     PL DRC are bringing this to the  recommendation of approval and applicant  is here if there any questions for  me or for me I will be glad transit.  

No one wishing to speak from  the public so we will close a public  hearing. Mark, did you want to speak  of this time?  >> Thank you, Mr. Chairman and I will  keep this very brief, for the wreck  and mark Watts with couple to 31  N. Woodland Avenue  [Indiscernible - low volume] appreciate  the opportunity to be here and with  me are Kenny and Kelly Mullins to  the principles in the Grantville Farms LLC in the owner of  this and I just want to stand up  and give a word of thanks to you  and your staff and we work to the  last year with your staff Susan  Jackson and everybody else in the  planning staff that develop the  criteria for the rural event center  and you guys past that ordinance  back some time I think 
     towards the end of less year and  I think this is first one come into  asking for permission rather than  forgiveness of that ordinance. But  looking forward to moving forward  with those and I think it is a great  location and if you have any questions  we are here to answer them.  

Thank you.  

Ms. Girtman?  

Just want to make a motion and  I appreciate the  fact that it is  on the way it should be and that  you've worked with the staff and  staff has made the recommendation 
     so I will make the motion for a  special exception for rural event  center on the 21 point, I guess, 50 acre forest resource , and resource corridors, zone property  located at 954 North puppet Avenue Lake Helen, is 18 104.  

Motion made by Ms. Girtman and  second by Lowery .  

Any further discussion?  >> Ms. Wheeler?  

Yes, I just have a question not  particularly about this but kind  of. You had mentioned the permission  versus forgiveness, what happened  -- what kind of legal  standard we have went there is like  a clear-cut and you go back and  say oh gosh, so sorry, we missed or  some of these wetland preservation  things that --  

Ms. Wheeler , that is not relative to the discussion.  

I'm asking because he asked on  the special exceptions that there  is some wetlands and what all that  has to be -- what is the repercussion  if it is not done? It is based on the.  

It was done, sorry.  

Can you clarify the staff comment  because I guess you are chiming  in on the fact there was some clearing  occurring on the property prior  to the making final application.  There is a confusion on their behalf  because agricultural properties  have exemptions  [Indiscernible - low volume] tree  preservation requirements. But there  is a standard in place that if you clear  property within three years of making  an application for development,  it is automatically presumed you  will have to do mitigation because  you are clearing the property for  development so that  addresses your concern. They came  out and did some preliminary [Indiscernible - low volume] forced  a resource when we explained to  them that the fact is if you are  doing it within three years of making  application, you have to do mitigation.  So we go back and we do a survey  of the existing trees on site and  come up with in a mess that -- estimate  of the trees and that is what they  will be doing. So I think you, just  want to clarification on the.  

We have worked with staff on  the issues and we will handle that  during this time.  >> Any other discussion? Objections  or motions? Hearing on the motion  passes unanimous and we will move  to item 7 and this is a public hearing  and we will open the public hearing  and have the staff report, Mr. Irvin?  

Good morning this a special exception  for nonexempt excavation that is  occurring on the south side of state  road 44 just west of Damascus Road.  Subject property is a total of 231  acres of the 231 acres applicant is requesting ability  to dig 38 acres from a depth of  around 30 feet.  We have very specific criteria that  are tied to nonexempt excavations  in the applicant has provided technical  information and that it was originally  presented in February PL DRC and  staff have some reservations in  regards to the amount of information  we had and had some concern for  that. At the public hearing, the  PL DRC continued it for 60 days to allow the  applicant to come up to speed with  some of the requirements and some  of the information and in the 60  day timeframe they were able to  provide us with majority of the  information we needed so therefore  we feel comfortable going forward  to it and it went to the April PL  DRC with recommendation of approval  and on page seven test three we  had the recommended conditions of  approval of which there are 19.  You are aware of the applicant being okay of 18 others  19 and we want the applicant not necessarily happy  with is a requirement for fencing.  And that would be [Indiscernible  - low volume] looking forward for  those conditions, 15,  13, 13 states staff applicant [Indiscernible  - low volume]  with a 6 foot high chain link fence  with a gate that is closed and locked  at all times from the excavation  pits are not use. This is again not a mandatory but  we are making it a recommendation  because again main concern is this  is a relatively remote site and access is going to be something  that we are concerned about. We  are worried about safety and security  because you are going to have open  bodies of water now and those types  of things a we are concerned about  potential impacts resulting from  those who are not necessarily allowed  on the property. So therefore what  you are seeing is at the applicant  is going forward to the PL DRC   in April, there was one person speaking  and there was going storage representing  F PNL who was in over of an easement  adjacent to this property.  And actually I believe incorporate  some of the land owned by those  people. What you see is that they  were having concerns with them utilizing  that for access. The applicant's agreed to not utilize the FPL  access easement from state road 44 and the conditions  that are contained in here consistent  with the similar excavation  what you approve for the contestable  property which is a little bit further  east on State Road 44, and that we do have monitoring  wells in those types of things to  ensure we are not going to be having  severe drawdown on the adjacent  property owners. Now this property  is a little bit different than that  and that you do not have as many  people with development or homes  adjacent to it right now. So we  want to make sure 
     there was no further impacts for  any future use of property surrounding  and that is why we have similar  conditions for the monitoring of  the ground water level. As I said applicant has gone through the  technical review of staff and staff  was able to come forward with recommendation  of approval back in April. PL DRC  heard from the staff and from the  public and from the applicant  and  made a recommendation of approval  subject to those conditions and  identified starting on page 7 test three. If there were  any questions I will be glad to  answer them.  

Missed Denys?  

  Thank you Mr. Chair, first of all,  Clay, you touched on our agenda  package seven test three  and 4 with the gherkin the condition of approval. How do we  go from recommended to mandatory  on that ?  

That would be part of your motion  in other words approving the special  exception subject to those conditions.  

Subject to intersection -- okay because that is not on  the subject but I will make sure  that that gets added.  

So my question then is how  do we go from monitoring to  enforcement? I'm looking at item  number 9, recommended conditions,  parameter landscape offers, did we have this innate  -- you brought it up so I am going  there. In the contestable agreement.  

Yes, 
     I want to clarify, they have to  go yes, this does not give them  permission to go and start development  on their site.  This is only for the special exception  being approved here. The still have  to go through the technical review  of all of their documents for development  that incorporates landscaping and  incorporates  article studies that includes reclamation  plants, all of that is part of their  final site plan that they have to  be or submit and go through the  technical review and get approval.  For that we  are just clarifying to them is that  we may see something on their conceptual  plan that indicated they need to  come in compliance with it so they  are going to do so as part of the  panel -- final site plan.  

My question when agreement, sounds  good, it is in here and real life  happens, --  

But my question is not monitoring,  but it is enforcement and I'm going  to refer back to the contestable  operating where that fell through , to get started and the buffers  were not put in and out we have 
     hood enforcement issue but at this  stage couple of months ago, counsel  said oh yes, this works, we said  yes, good faith was not exercised  on the opposite end of the contract  and now -- and I know the contestable is  not an issue for today but yet it  is. Because I do want to  be back here. My question is, how  do we monitor -- not just monitor  -- I want enforcement at this stage,  I am not comfortable for multiple  reasons --  

Page 7  test for an and 15 Reese applicant  shall post acceptable performance  bond revocable letter of funds in  escrow account  an amount up to 100% of the estimated  reconditioning cost  as estimated by the developers engineer  and the proposed plan recommendation  in a format approved by  Volusia County so we require them  to give us a bond to cover the cost  that we are restoring the property. So wet we would require --  typical process as it applies to  this  -- and all other special exceptions,  dealing with excavations, that have  this condition, if they cease to  find out as temporary  or is a permanent? If it is permanent  sees of operation property owner not  willing to cooperate we can pull  the bond to basically do the reclamation.  

And that is normal?  

Well unfortunately yes, I mean  --  

No, no, I mean this is part of  the requirement?  

Yes.  

On our and and as we go contractually through  this process it is the same the  same template?  

Yes, yes ma'am.  

That is what I needed to hear  and we will deal with the other  one yes,  

And the other aspect in dealing  with the timeframe, one of the conditions  is that it is valid and the special  exception which grapples with the land and that  with the prison, is valid for a  period of six years from the date  of approval. So the date that you  all approve the special exception,  the clock starts rolling so they  have  secured -- six years from the days  of you approve this it would be  six years from the state to get  yourself complete.  

So  I'm going to use this project because  this is the one we are on, the have  to put up the perimeter landscape buffers before excavation . How does that get  monitored?  

They are calling us out for site  plan inspection. We have staff that  when they initiate site -- we go  out there 
     prior to initiating instruction  and after they have initiated construction,  we verify before they go on to the  next step. They would be required  to call out for the staff in the zoning area  and land development and you go  out and verify what was required  was in place before they started.  

If we have a project that goes  south, we did not verify it? We  did not do it?  

Or they initiated the work without  -- no code enforcement issues. Again  where --  

I know, but  because I do want to be here again, George , I want to be here again, so  we need some teeth in the enforcement and I don't think we have done  that. I don't think we have done  that and we are not monitoring it,  I don't believe, so I'm not going to  cross projects. I am  speaking -- George,  do you want to step in on this one ?  

Well, just to say, in most cases  I hate to say it is usually that  they start without calling us. At  the part of us --  we need to do a better job of education  right up front, if you pull this,  if you do this, we are going to  come after you with guns  a blazing. Not part of the question  is what is the ammunition in the  gun? And we will work on that but  at the end of the day, if you see  -- some of these are the same people,  so we are going to work on that  because if they are going to do  business in the county, I don't  think they want to get in that kind  of a reputation. So  we will work with them and we will  work with the owners, the representatives,  to impress upon them how important  it is because otherwise we can look at adding  more teeth if we need to. And I think that is probably something  that would be supported by staff , because again we have good staff, they go out and they tried to do  the best they can. If they know  what is going on, and we have a  huge area to cover with a few people,  so do  -- we do depend on people who make  an agreement with us to do what they are supposed to do  in terms of giving us a cult come  look and I think that they will  if we are --  

I can tell you in this case and  in the other case we are talking  about, staff has been involved with  it and we have already identified  code enforcement proceedings before  them to ensure they are identified  as potential repeat offenders so  we can eczema is the fine in the future if they do anything  that is outside the appropriate actions based on special exception  and also the fact is that we have  the ability to potentially revoke  the special exceptions if they don't  comply. So those were all out there , it is just that you have to follow  proper procedures established by  code enforcement.  

It is a process and I get it  it does not happen but I just --  I want the enforcement or the teeth  or the bullets big enough that we don't get there and when  we need to enforce, it  mean something. We are keeping --  well, okay. So with that I will  move approval of the special exception.  For the nonexempt -- are you ready?  

No, we have 2 --  

Sorry.  

That is okay. Michael would you  hold that my the motion that is  starting to happen and you want  to come forward with I guess you  do, okay, and we also have --  

The morning for the record [Indiscernible  - static] 
     cup cold 31 N. Woodland Boulevard  here in [Indiscernible - low volume]  applicant and thank you all for  your time today and thank you to  your staff and this has been a long  time coming. I think in part because  of some of the concerns the your  resume with other instances and  I would tell you certainly in the  last couple of months, very fine  tooth comb going to the what if  and what have you and I would tell  you as well that globally speaking  and this is a special exception  that identify certain number of  concerns and we have those concerns,  as an applicant, if we are seeing  there is a problem coming up with  that love to have those standards  we addressed every updated to reflect  the new concerns that we have, with  a challenge for us has been, accommodating as possible, on-the-fly  trying to take the lessons that  you learn from other applicants  and applied in the current case  is we're going to the application  and that is one of the reasons why  we went through the planning board  and came up with more information  earlier on in the process. All that  being said, happy to have done what  we have done here and  to have resolved because the unique  issue we had with SGML and got that  ironed out in the report. The one point I  want to talk to you about is that  one condition that we are concerned  with. And I do want to make sure  as I told Glenn, there is a set  of conditions listed in the staff  report deepened the staff report  want to make sure we are looking  at page 07 test for the last one there we agreed that  there is an easement on a property  that we only see that a P&L using  and we agreed we are not going to  use that easement for this facility  for this operation. Very clear and  very important for F P&L and have the trucks on there  and we have our trucks on there  and they were worried about 
     a traffic jam and we are okay we  redesigned to accommodate that so  we are good with that's want to  make sure that is on the record.  Our concern is dealing with defense  issue and it originated from the  planning department [Indiscernible  - low volume] objection at the plan  board and we told him we would come  here before you as well and the  reason for that is that a kind of  disrupts the liability that would  otherwise be in place for us [Indiscernible  - low volume] if we have people coming onto her  property that we know are coming  on whether workers or property owners 
     or consultants or whether they are  licensing IT and someone coming  out there to do inspections or even  with a shotgun or rifle would have  it we have a certain duty and obligation  to them to allow them to know what  is out there and what is safe and  what is not and we basically put  them on notice of the operations  as they occur. So the general  public, we have a duty to post no  trespassing and keep that safe and  sound and that is pretty much it.  So if something comes in trespasses on  a property and the closest that  upon gets to the general public  read which is 150 feet, someone  comes out there and  hurts himself and basic lability  standpoint, we have no obligation  or duty to help, and it is notorious was done in the fact there is equipment  out there and whatnot but the lability  is savagely there to protect the  property owner because of someone  coming onto your property, get sued  for their misbehavior. The problem  with the fencing is that now that  puts a duty upon us and becomes per se negligent if we have that  fence up there in the worst-case  scenario we have is that putting  the fence up, entry blows down  a branch and the branch falls on  the fence a we are not aware of  that, so -- this is very broad hypothetical  and now the person comes in and  defenses now failed and they fall  in and that is a trespass. Previously  had no claim against us or  -- anyway the claim but we had no duty to  them but now we put a fence another  issue is not whether or not that  guy should be on a property and  the duty is whether we maintain  the fence properly so we just think  from a lability standpoint, we are  in a better condition and better  position to deal with pulse the  property and saying this is private  property and do not trespass, whether  that we go into that process and  kind of changing our liability.  And it really comes down to a simple that and the comment  itself requiring the fencing is  coming I think out of the public  percussion and planning department,  and we have to prevail on them to  change their thought process, and  happy to entertain any conversation or discussion there.  The equivalency would be and I said  this kind of tongue-in-cheek at  the planning board but you have  a bunch of stairs in the back of  this and most likely that a kid  will come out there after hours  and step on that and break his leg than anybody coming onto our property  but we do not sense this building  from the general public [Indiscernible  - low volume] it is kind of an over  abundance percussion against the trespasser that we  are really providing for because  we have other obligations and duties  so we asked that you drop that condition if possible. Everything else we  can deal with.  

Thank you for that comment. I'm  sure there are attorneys throughout  the United States that would take  that argument and punch holes in  it by not fencing reducing  your liability, and  that to me the better reduction  of lability would be a fence then  posted but that is just me not being  an attorney but one that plays one  every now and then and I think you  will agree you're not going to be  released from the liability necessarily  by not fencing, but I  accept that --  

Is a absolutely common sense a make  sense but just appreciate that.  

Glenn, do you have some comments? And if there are other comments  for you Michael,  then --  

Name is Glenn storage represent  [Indiscernible - low volume] light  and I just want to clarify first  of all two things in one is power  and light based on the condition  that we placed here regarding the private easement fully support  special exemption and that is one and I also want  to explain the reason why we had  a concern because if we built this  road to a major regional substation, this price power, thousands  and thousands of folks in Volusia County and it  was a homeland study issue when  we built this road it was for that  purpose of providing access  to  the plant. Materials for the workers  etc., and any impact to that, any break and allowing for that to happen,  could have drastic impacts to the  entire power for the entire area.  So we greatly appreciate the concession  that allowed us for or for them to have alternate access  and we recognize the tremendous  need for the fill in this area . If you do not have  filled for projects, you have no  projects, that simple. It is foundation  and everything if you do not have  the field to get you out of the  flood plane in Volusia County you  cannot build  so that is way there  is a need for the fill and if you  can meet all the other criteria,  we are happy. Semi okay, thank you.  Going back to you, Ms. Denys , you have a question?  

I do. I wanted to know, is there  a policy regarding fencing as  far as some status or  some standard? 

As far as mandating it around  that?  

Correct.  

No ma'am.  

Aside from recommendation.  

Thank you.  

Other than the applicant  we will close the public hearing. Now going back to you, Ms. Denys.   

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I hear you on the fence , I guess we are on the fence [Laughter] and I'm going to make  the motion, but if the PL DRC and that was   PL DRC recommendation  Mr. Ervin said with a came from?  

Staff drafted the original liquidation  and  reviewed by the PL DRC and PL DRC  incorporated and that is what you're  seeing in front of you at the 19  items on page 7 test three, 74,  recommended conditions based on  the motion by the PL DRC.  

 And then to just piggyback off Ms. Girtman question what makes  this project unique that we will  require fence where we have never  done it before ? What makes this  unique? What is a risk or liability  we're going to require here that  we have never done ?  

There is exceptional you can  do which one.  

Basically we were looking at  was a isolated nature of this property.  You have an area that is out in  the middle of nowhere, relatively -- therefore you have some  concerns from that perspective. 
     >> My paws  --  

You have a three-minute window .  

You are on the fence, onto?  

I am, literally on the fence.  

Let me share this --  

Mr. Chair, take it.  

When you have a special exception,  you can require certain things to  allow the exception that a special , so requiring offense would not  be necessarily something out of  the unusual , staff recommended -- and I guess PL DRC , and I don't Michael, I  know your position, Clay clarified that  --  >> 
     Offer a compromise because I can  see there's consternation by other  members of the Council here on how  to deal with this. If we are able  to put a gate in the front especially  if there is adequate staffing so  vehicles will be out of state road  44 but still have a barrier to prevent  the general public from being accessed  on this site .  

I think if you would be willing  to put the fencing along the frontage  where the access will be because  the rest of it is not that easy  to access. And you still will posted  for your own protection, I'm assuming,  no trespassing, which will allow  you a certain amount of indemnity , not a whole lot but a certain  amount, though if you're willing  to do that, and understanding if  you want to include that?  

Yes or.  

-- Yes , Sir.  >> The  question was to clarify, we have  no problem with the fence  and lock in there but the question  is the  level of the fencing along the front,  are we talking a barbed wire, kind  of ag or kind of --  

Maybe at the stage we need to  bring this back for clarification,  or delay this until after lunch. Item after lunch until  we can get an exact legal equivocation  what this will look like?  

Leave it on the agenda for  today but until we  can define this for both parties,  for them as well as for us, --  

Can we just have the staff work  through it?  >> Ms.  Girtman, wait. Semi okay.  

You want to be clear that. I  think we have no problem with ready  for the gating  and stacking it  we want to make sure with a clear  expectation is --  

No, staff compromise here today is basically providing such that no one can  driven on the road so what we are  looking at  as a gate and sufficient fencing  to block people being able to utilize  the access road into the site.  

Gait and sufficient blocking,  okay.  

Of the access road.  

It makes more sense.  

I think that will work, Jamie, adding that to it, those  particular wording to that, if that  is included in your motion.  

Got it.  

Make a motion that we don't have  a second.  

Help with the motion.  

That would be a modification  to condition number 13. That  the applicant has to provide security  gating to prevent the access road and that the gate  shall be closed and locked at all  times when the excavation fits  and is not in use.  

There you good.  

What he said, and I will make  the motion to approve the special  exception, make sure that I am  on the right agenda item, okay, special exception for  nonexempt excavation on 37.99 acres  of residential [Indiscernible -  low volume] look [Indiscernible  - low volume] west of intersection  with Damascus Road to land case  is that 17 Tash 046, to include the recommended conditions  of approval on page 07 test three and 074 with the  exception of the change in item  --  

Amendment.  

Amendment modification to  item 13, that will --  

Provide for security gate,  and limit access at any time that  are not in yes.  

I will second that.  

Okay.  

Motion made and seconded and any further discussion? Public  hearing closed. Motion is made and  seconded. No further discussion.  We work through this one, much better  than the delay and I think this  will be the out come that  would've come, any objection to  the motion? Hearing on the motion  passes unanimously. -- Carry none , the motion passes unanimously.  >> And Clay, I think we  are seeing people leave so we are  going to take five minutes, six  minutes, recess.  >> 

[ The event is on a 6-minute  recess. The session will reconvene  at *Eastern Time. Captioner on stand  by. ] -- 

[ The event is on a 6-minute  recess. Captioner on stand by. ] 
     Hello ? Good morning, we will go ahead  and reconvene the Council meeting  and councilmember Johnson.  

Trying to line your TV tying  up. We will reconvene at 11:45 AM and  go to item number 8 . I guess Clay, you are back .  

Good morning, Clay Ervin director  of growth and resource management  and before you today is an appeal  of the DRC upholding of the development review engineer  denial of Ms. Gray's finding as a vested lot. As you  are aware Volusia County ,  they put in place serious subdivision regulation 72,  76, which identified mandatory requirements  for subdivision of land. On that  was implemented, back in 1976, there was question as to what is  a vested lot, what could be developed  without having to go through subdivision  standards that we then approve?  So then engineering staff today review of some of the roads  throughout, and identified if they  were open and passable, open and  passable within define and interpret it as a  passenger vehicle being able to  safely access and exit so therefore  if you had sufficient with insufficient  base of the road and would be able  to come in and out. And there was  other criteria in the amount of sales in the area  and the amount of ownership met  certain criteria so if the aerie  had been  actively being developed for that  residential subdivision and there was clear axes that could  be easily traversed by a passenger coming and going it was identified  as being vested or exempt subdivision. Those subdivisions  which did not meet those criteria were considered nonexempt so therefore  if someone wanted to develop them they would have to come  in and meet with staff, identify  what was required in order to comply  with our subdivision standards,  do the work and they would be considered  just a. Being able to develop for  that particular use.  Ms. Gray has acquired a property  that is addressed to 32 Camden Street, and be part  of the enterprise North subdivision  plat and that plat was approved  back in 1883 and  so therefore it kind of has a little bit  of a history and that way before  our subdivision standards there were all kinds of different  standards that were in place in  regards to what was a vested or  not vested or those types of things . And so in her appeal she is concerned that staff is not necessarily looking  at the full picture 
     and that we need to go back into  history and we have to look at not  just pictures from 1976. We have  to look at the full mosaic of what  occurred since 1883 in regards to  this particular property. And candidly, we at staff try and do whatever  we can to assist those who have  property and face a situation where  they may not be developing it as  they would want. In this particular situation, she  is also facing some delays unfortunately  in trying to negotiate  with the school board to address  some of the issues that were identified by the  staff. And I will kind of go right  into the main issue. As you can  see, here is a generalized location  and this aerial kind of reflects  what we are talking about. These  large rectangular blocks are  the blocks that were part of the  enterprise North subdivision back  in 1883, these newer subdivisions  are we plat  of those specific blocks that were  in the enterprise North subdivision. The reason why  they had to go through that subdivision  process is because they were not  vested. So what you are seeing is  that surrounding it , you see residential development,  they had to go through the platting  assess to bring it up to process  with her current code. Get that  cleaned up. So when she made an application, for termination vested rights, it came after we had received  a standalone tree removal  permit for her property. She was  able to acquire the property. She  was coming in to get a tree removal permit and when we went to it Everett -- review that we determined it  was not a buildable  lot and let her know what a process  was. She made an application for  that. In that case our engineer  reviewed it. Looked at areas from 1976. Determined  that there was not an open and passable  road that met our criteria. Determined  that it did not have the sales requirement  that it also meet our criteria and a number of  other developed areas in there.  So consistent without we have done  all these other -- how we have done  all these other rectification's  -- applications  did the denial. She [Indiscernible  - low volume] much of it is contained  in your staff report. She provided  us deeds,  she provided us a great deal of  information. She pointed out some  areas from earlier and 76, that  she felt so that there was an open and passable road. She  also brings in -- and on page zero  8 61 -- you will see the notecards from the property  appraisals office that she has acknowledged  the that look, you are on property 
     appraiser says there is excess.  We need to kind of clarify something.  The property appraiser is talking  about I can  get onto that property and there  is a subdivision standard for a  road there, it does not necessarily -- he does not interpret and does  not implement the land development regulations and so therefore when he has this  axis, it is not the same thing as  test case was saying that they are legal access. So I just want  to make sure there is some clarity  because a property appraiser is  not necessarily looking at the same  criteria that your County engineers  going to be looking at. So we went  to the hearing at the DRC, there  was a series of questions that he  brought up a very good point of  how do you make it open and passable? Please clarify  to me what you mean by open and  passable. These are some of the  pictures that show the road that  she is referencing saying it is  open, I can get a card through there.  Show me in your code where that  is not considered open and passable.  And what we were trying to reference  to her is that this is an emergency  access issue and the fact is that  within our public right of ways,  been able to put in a row to make sure that 2 passenger cars can  safely traverse that we have access  to emergency vehicles is our litmus  test. We felt that that looking  at that, trail,  it did not meet that criteria. She also provided us with a series  of deeds. To try and provide the  justification that met the 25% of  the area had been subdivided  and sold and under different ownership. Our staff went through and reviewed  it. And determined that 8%, and  she is arguing also that -- and  to a certain point you can understand  where she is coming from -- and  that the development of the middle  school , Delta middle school there, should  count towards that 25%. And what we are explain is  that that is not a residential development  consistent with the subdivision  standards. That is the school board  development of a public infrastructure  there. And so we  understand her frustration. There  has been an  exhaustive time and I will not lie with you at all that we have  got a situation where stuff has  been trying to work with school  board staff at coming up with a  solution where we could potentially come up with additional right-of-way, along the north side of the school,  the sell side of her property, to  get the minimum right-of-way to  provide it.  The other aspect is she is feeling  slighted. Because she has seen that  other appeals 
     to the DRC have not necessarily  been treated the same. She references  these in her appeal saying that  you look at the case for  Dennis and others, and I could say  we have equitably treated everyone of  these applications the same. We're  looking at them. We are making sure  the critical parts of these other  applications that are found up in  front of you were staff in the DRC  had denied it, have resulted because they  are either meeting some of the criteria  but they do not want to necessarily  build a paved road. The one that  is most similar is the Miller subdivision  that occurred with the Daytona West project of theirs were gentlemen acquire 20 acres inches simply  wanted to put a driveway in and  we could not have it meet the criteria  from the technical perspective so  your County engineer could not approve  it and went to DRC and same situation  with your see and ears he could  not find anything that they needed  and they appeal to you and at that  point County Counsel had a very  tough decision but they upheld the  deer seat denial. Because again  what we are dealing with is containment  of growth in our subdivision  standards were put in place so that  way we can make sure that anyone  was developing property has adequate  role -- Road cents sewer water and  can meet the [Indiscernible - low  volume] and if we don't do that, we are  contributing to some of the sprawling  issues that we face.  

We believe that there are alternatives . For example her property could  be subject to the 2.5 acre exemption that we have  if she is able to secure an easement  from the adjoining property owner.  And all that is been difficult.  The owner is D Morgan LLC which  is a corporation that is an active  according to [Indiscernible - low  volume] and probably being some 
     difficulties getting to that corporation  but there are alternatives. There  is right-of-way in front of it and  the could be a potential approval working with the adjoining property  owners. Unfortunately we cannot  make a recommendation of approval of the appeal. We are going to have to basically uphold  from atop -- staff perspective denial from  your County engineer and your development  review committee. At this point  I would be glad to -- Ms.  Gray has every right come in and  provide you with information  because  you all are acting and it was  a judicial situation here where  you are going to be reviewing all  the facts and making a final determination.  

All right. Any questions of  Clay? Otherwise I will have Ms.  Gray  come. 

Good morning. I'm Annette Gray and this is my  husband we are the property owners  of 232 Camden Street in Belle Tona  and as you just heard he kind of  explained to you the land development  code. And I disagree with their decision to  deny my vested rights in one of  the first things that I do want  to point out, is a first criteria  of the land development code is to show substantial physical  on-site development prior to October  29th 1976. And I believe I can prove  this by -- like he said -- construction built in the middle  school. If you can pull up -- I handed out additional pages and it should  be 1976 aerial photograph. You will  see while they were building Deltona middle school they completely opened and cleared Hampden Street, which is located approximately right here. You can also flip to the 1971 aerial photograph and this also  shows a picture of how the street  was cleared before 1976.  But since we are talking about the  on-site physical development, while they were building the school  they also created a long drainage canal that rents  to the south of my property. They also cleared a  portion of my property and erected  a fence on it. On my property which  existed to state so that should  be considered a substantial on-site  development.  

And in the code it also -- excuse  me, we will take one of you at a  time. Otherwise we will do the records and so forth,  we would not have him interrupt  Dean if you can do that please.  

Absolutely. Also I wanted -- one of the handouts I provide  it was late 1800 be I highlighted in pink where  it does show the sale of property  located on Elisha Street and not  only was this this belt  of a piece of land but also includes  a house and three trees and timber. It shows that Elisha Street was  being used as a road during that  time period. When you pull up the  1800 site you will see in its Camden  Street -- its name Camden Street  but in 1800 it was Elisha Street and Elisha Street  was put there and dedicated for  public use back in the 1800s to  prevent landlocked properties as  in my circumstance. So I meet criteria  number 1. By meeting that it says or so I  should not have to meet number 2.  But I do meet criteria number 2. I obtained a different 1976 aerial  photograph from Department of Transportation,  different than the one Esther Thompson  included. It shows an expanded view,  not just the close of you and you  can see the entire road. You can  see that it was cleared and open and that  you can drive an ordinary passenger  vehicle. Not only was it back then  but it continues where you can still  use that. In fact when the school  built the new Deltona middle school, they do  plan on using that road for their  construction vehicles and equipment.  During a meeting with myself, is  Martin and Miss Marcy  with the school board, and Mr. Panton,  they sated they would be using  this road and you'll see in my handout, they also stated how their construction  vehicles will come back , the dirt, this should be a page which  is a Deltona middle school schematic  plan. Thank you, that is perfect. To the lower left corner, right  on here, it does show site access and  that they are planning on using  this road that I am requesting to  use. If the school board  is allowed to use this road, I do  not understand why I should not  be allowed to use it. Otherwise  it is discrimination. On who gets  to use a public road.  As far as 25% of the lots having been sold by  bona fide contracts, what is not  included in that packet is the numerous deeds that I emailed Mr. Thompson.  Had to do it separately because  of the County firewall. I do have  them with me and have a total of  64. I don't know if he pointed that  out but some or uncertain pages there are two  and three transactions on one page. You have to be careful and look  at the dates, but those 64 deeds,  lesson 1976  tax rules, does meet the 25%.  It brings me over. I had to show  74 transactions and I showed 78. There is plenty more . This whole time it is been back  and forth, whether it is as of October  29 1976, or prior.  I believe that it is one and  the same thing. It can be prior  and that is why I ask is those 1800 deeds but I was informed that  no, they do not count and that is  why only the 1976 roles were use  and that is an accurate. I have -- he was accurate I have  been going back and forth with the negotiations with Volusia County school board and  initially was study out that  they  were going to go ahead and grant  me easement and exchange for me  to use definitely the fence of my property  and there was can indication between  Miss Marcy of the school board and  planning development staff. So that  that communication influenced it  and it ended up  -- we are going to swap properties mutually. I would give them 50  feet of my property in exchange  for 50 feet of their property.  If you can go to that  next page,  it shows this one right here, it  shows the potential slot. Does a 40 feet on there and  we later discussed 50. What this  is supposed to do was they would  get the yellow box , my 40 feet of property in exchange  a look at the blue box.  This would have eliminated the road  issue altogether. I would've had  a private driveway. I  would not have even had to use the  road. However Miss Marcy informed me that she was communicating  back and forth with planning and  development, and they advised that  they would not agree to this and  instead I would have the deed over  my property to them and they would  deed over their property to the  Volusia County  -- delete County of Volusia, I did not think  this was fair I was giving up my  property and we would still have  to face the road issue instead of  me having a private driveway. And  then that evolved from them  offering  me -- they took that offer off the  table and change it to where they  offered to sell me that portion,  but they made sure to clarify that  that would be at a significantly  higher rate than fair market value.  I do not believe that was fair either. Mr. Thompson was accurate that  I found numerous other cases where other property  owners have been allowed to use  the 24 road. Yes, 20  foot road in the first one I listed  on my field I did obtain the 1976  aerial photograph from Department of Transportation, it  was not cleared, it was not open  impassable whatsoever. And there  were no homes that it was providing  access to. And she was still allowed  to use the 20 foot road. I  am here to ask you to overturn the  RC decision for denial.  I'm simply trying to access my property  and build the house. For myself.  I'm not trying to post a subdivision in but  went to build myself a house. So  my okay, thank you.  

Ms. Post?  

 1024, can you  explain to me again the agreement that you try to work out with the  school? Should make sure --  

With regards to the property?  

Initially started out like I  said they have a fence on  approximately 43 feet of my property. And they agreed that they would  go ahead and grant me over a portion  of the property as an easement in  exchange to keep that fence on my  property.  

Where's the fence ? Is it  on the picture?  

Yes.  

Where it would be on here?  

It is North  of the pond. Goes approximately  up through --  

The little line in the middle? The little line in the middle where  the arrow is?  

Like right up in here. 

Okay.  

It is very hard to do  it on their but it is in that area.  

You are going way where we started  the line, it is not --  

I'm sorry.  

I think it looks like there  is a pen line in the box and that  is what --  

No, that is not it, I don't think. It is a reddish colored  line?  

No, it is a back -- black pen  lying.  

Ms. Gray, could you approach ?  

Yes.  >> That is what I was  wondering.  

Okay.  >> So that fell through and renegotiated on that with the spool court -- school board and everything  and their engineer came up with  the idea of this slot. You give  us -- a change from 40 feet to 50 and  we will say 40 which is on the paper.  You give us 40 feet and we will  give you the westerly 40 feet which is above Whitemarsh in that way  it touches the paper out therefore  it is a private driveway and you  know longer have to pursue the road  issue.  

But that did not happen?  

That did not happen --  

Is try to stick to where you  are right now with that. I think  that is what we have heard. Where  you are right now  is we are willing to sell you  property.  >> At unfair highly overpriced rate  and I am not willing to do that.  The negotiation with the school  board have  ceased and that is why am here to  ask you to just allow me to use  the 20 foot road because obviously 
     as a progressive, I can go to the  court for an easement however it  is going to affect them taking property.  

It does not --  unless the property just to your -- as we're looking at it -- to your left, as we're looking  at it, to your right, that property  you do not own so you would have  to have access to that adjoining  property as well, correct? Unless  the school board allows you to go  through?  >> You mean Mr. Morgan's property?  

Yes.  

If you guys quit meat vested  rights and allow me to use the 20  foot road no, it does not affect  any road owners.  

That 20 foot only affects myself  and does not provide any axis to  anybody else. I brought up the safety  vehicle and I did clarify  it, it needs based on the Florida  statute the 20 foot wide 13 foot  high clearance meets the  fire code for passable safety vehicles. 

I think we will have to get clarification  from Steph on that because I was  told in my meeting that it did not  -- have --  

I have the statute if you want  to see it.  

Let me address my counsel --  I mean might --  

I just want to clarify, there is all different criteria  that goes to public safety vehicles  specifically for fire vehicles been  able to access the site. With an  height is one thing but also stabilize, compaction of the road, making  sure it complies with it and that  was one of the concerns at our construction  or County engineer had is that you  have 20 feet in our standard for  even a dirt road has to have swales and has have a crown and  has to have compaction and all that  that goes outside the 20 foot right-of-way  and that is what we were trying to help her get through with the  school board because the school  board is the one who 
     changed its mind. I want to make  sure I was asked by a County attorney,  did we tell them not to do that  --  

That was a question I had, --  

I think she alluded  to that.  

We were trying --  

That was my question and that  is what I was trying to find out.  Starting with you, was it planning  that then the agreement with the  school board between them would  not be feasible?  

I will let Tad speak specifically  because he was a primary point of contact and primary engineer  and was sitting there but it was  my understanding with the landslide  we were talking about the fact that  the subject area here would be sufficient  for her to be able to have access  on to Hamden and when Marsha be  able to have a private driver to  a property and therefore would not  have to worry but I will let Tad  elaborate what the discussion with  the school board were.  

[Indiscernible - low volume]  

We will give you all  the time you need.  >> County engineer, yes, with regard  to the discussions with the school  board, we had recommended that she contact him  and speak with them about the issue  overall because when you take a  look at what has been done, the  initial plotted right-of-way was  50 feet,  40 feet, and they took and vacated  all of their portion through us,  the school in,  and part of that you can see the  actually put the pond a little bit  further north into her property  a little bit as well. So we talked  to them and said we did not know what their proposed  plan was for rebuilding the middle  school. We've seen the plan now,  but at the time we were not sure what they would  be doing with that storm water,  what they were doing with that area  up there and maybe they can work  out something and I understood they  went to for five different iterations  for that section and apparently  that is the latest version. We thought  that was the best way to go. We  certainly are in favor of working  out something with the school board  to provide access to the pond.  

There is no -- on the County side, the County  is favorable if  an agreement like that were to be  made on the other end?  

Yes ma'am.  

Okay, no negatives on our site,  okay.  

That is not 100% accurate. I  was in a meeting with Ms. Morrissey and she provided me with an email  sent from Mr. Penn center in  which they were communicating and he stated in any melt that he was  not good with that slot and that that property from  the school board had to be deeded  over to the County. I do have that  in an email. So you said that email  was from who?  

Mr. Palmer Panton to Shirley  Marcy.  

Mr. Chair, if I might I think  there is a misunderstanding. If the road  was going to be open to County standards  and needed to be 60 feet of red  wait the 40 feet plus existing 20  feet would be 60 feet of right away.  In that instance, property would  be deeded to the County. However  if it is going to be a private easement, the property could be deeded to  the Ms. Gray.  The understand the distinction?  

Okay.  

I think that was the question.  

Any other questions?  

This  specific issue here of the 2 sites, --  

This would solve the issue if  it was a private issue along the  purple area, then the County  would have to vacate and very small portion of the private wide-awake  to give them access to their property,  which I think staff would be favorable  and then the grays with the the yellow area to the school  district.  

And then they could put a private  easement driveway in and it would  not provide access to any of the  other properties and you could pull  a building permit.  

Would be feasible then if there  is or it sounds like this  might be a possible solution, it  sounds as if there might be some  confusion as to where everybody  stands on it, so is it possible  to delay this?  

It is.  The school district actually has  a new attorney, used to work here  at the Volusia County  attorney  office so one of us could give a  call to Stacy and have a conversation  -- conversation with him and see  if we can come up with a solution.  I definitely do think that is possible.  >> The last time I spoke with the  school board this offer was no longer  on the table.  

You're saying because of a possible  email misunderstanding?  

Yes.  

I would like to take a shot at  it.  

I would move we delay this and  if there is a possibility for some  kind of --  

And my husband have a moment  to speak ?  

We have other people on the Council  who also have questions.  

Okay.  

Sure.  

Look, if he would not have  jumped in  and once he changed it to the 64,  the school board automatically,  they were like we don't -- we cannot  give you 60 foot or trade you 60  foot we don't need so different when  they definitely did not want to  give a 60 foot of the property.  

We understand that and the staff  and nice thing -- I think staff  has gone way out of the way to accommodate  that.  

Yes a no, because that is no  problem. First off started  the whole beginning of this, land  development, prayer, everything  they base their denial on, was as  of the date of 76. Nothing shows  prior. Where is prior in all this?  

Okay.  

Everything has a a prior.  >> That is a question for legal eagles.  

Yes, him to saying if we cannot  show anything that happened prior  before, what good is it or we only  get one day and that is it? You  can prove it on this day, that is  it, wait, we have literature and  all the stuff showing that there  was on-site development prior to  the school went and cleared at this, we don't  know if they were going to use this  road back then.  

I think that was answered, to  me, by staff and that the development -- the school has  nothing to do with the residential  development.  

Yes, but the cleared the road.  

The cleared her property.  

And her property.  

They said they were not going  to use the road at that time and  change her mind and that is what  I mean, bear yes, their determination  on something that happened -- they  were not even there to say yes,  or no, it was [Indiscernible - low volume] where  they going to use the rotor not?  And we get into the whole school  rule, we came to the school and  just said, you have a fence on the  property and we have it surveyed and they were  not like, we want the fence offering  and stuff like that we told him  what was going on and they said  we will work with you on we can  get you in there and get the road.  Okay, that is gray, here we go,  let us start this whole prolonged  deal so now we are trying to work  with the school and then they come  at and said, you know what? We need  some of your property and they wanted  to change input or put this retention  pond on our property we are lecture,  the problem and we will do that  we will trade you all out, our property,  take the trade even slot that we've  been ours, great, like she said  we would not even have to be here.  

I think where we are right now  is something that staff is clarified  and that is to have private access  and not require 60 feet.  

Yes --  

In my print -- excuse me if you  could go back and get the school  board to give you a private access  that will meet the counties criteria, I think you have a situation  where you can have access to the  line.  >> The one thing I would like to say  to that in all of the cases I listed  in my appeal, none of those property  owners were forced to work with  the adjoining property owners. I  feel like I'm the only one that  is having to go to my neighbor,  asking and begging for an easement  just because my neighbor is Altona  middle school.  

On the other one, she  fought the aerials on that --  

Excuse me, just a minute this  is getting way out of control.  

I'm just saying --  

Excuse me.  

Yes, sir.  

Let us all take a breath and  just relax. Each of us talking over  the other is not going to get us  where we need to be. So we have  Council appear who has questions.  Let us get the Council because  we continue to say it is the school  board's fault and staff try to work,  so staff -- we are  trying to help them find a way for  it to work but has to work within  the conditions that are set in our  land development code and with what  we are trying to follow. So what  may have happened or may not have  happened, this is based upon what  staff is giving us. Let us let our counsel have a question to weigh  in and Mr. Lowey  your area?  

Thank you so much, I kind of  gathered a ray of hope , light, from legal there in regard  to possibly going back towards the school board  with the pursuit of or  seen if we can get this worked out,  no promises that it would be worked  out. I kind of feel like Ms. Post,  if we could give us or  give it one more shot there might  be a possibility there and I don't  think it would take a long, long  time to figure out that.  

We went likely know by the next  Council meeting.  

Okay, okay.  

Went Ms. Post is making that's  a Justin, --  

That was more of a motion.  >> How about --  

If you continue until the next  Council meeting, I would know for  certain.  

Let us continue it to a time  not certain. 
     To have them two weeks to have it  worked out, --  

I would at least have an indication  within two weeks, I mean there is  not much for --  

We can continue it again if it  is not ready but if you want to  continue to make a motion, Ms. Post  --  

I will second.  

Continued to the 18th? Donating  to make a motion to continue, June  18th meeting.  

I move that  we postpone -- continue it to the next meeting to allow -- continue --  

To allow resolution.  

The motion is made to continue  this item to the June 18 meeting . Seconded by Lowry and made by post.  

 And then the idea that we will  come back --  

With the school board --  

Either we will work with the  school board --  

That cannot be additional.  Whatever habits on that will happen.  

That is the purpose of it.  

That is why we are allowing it  and if you cannot make that a condition of the --  

Okay.  

The motion was made to continue  to then, will allow time .  

There you go.  

[Laughter]  

Mr. Johnson?  

I echo Dr. Lowry  sentiments on this and we sat and  talked about this and understand  your plight and I think from what  the County staff has said, I believe  everybody is trying to help out. And where it came in is  the confusion of whether that was  a public road or a  private road and that is where it  sounds like it fill out, with staff  in the school board, and I highly  recommend we talk about here, let  us go back, you have  something they need, and they have  something you need, and the County help you out with that,  we need to put this off because  as it stands right now, I don't  think you would get the votes but  I think there is a good chance that  if we come back with issues, we  will have the votes in order to  fix your problem.  

Okay.  

Our problem --  

 Excuse me.  

It is our time now.  

I would not support this as it  is presented today. That is white  we are willing to try to work and  have a go back. The motion is made  and seconded, any further discussion? 

Hearing none, this  motion passes. You have continue to the June 18  meeting.  

Thank you.  

Okay.  

We will move to item number  9.  >> Donna ?  

Good afternoon the item that we  have before you on item 9 is we are asking and seeking direction  regarding the annual audit for the  County financial statement.  Currently the James more, 
     as your auditor, we had entered  into in 2014 a five-year contract  with them two optional one-year  renewals and so what we are asking  is a couple  of things, number 1 do you want  to extend the contract for one year  renewal? Do you want us to go out  for proposal? We are seeking direction  on that.  

Okay.  

Aims more is here to answer  any questions directly, regarding  their audits. The County  directors here is well to kind of  answer any questions that may have  specific -- we can talk about some  -- open this up for discussion so  we can see what you want to do.  

I think the item for discussion is we can only continue it  by what we have for one year.  

You can, you could -- you could actually,  if you wish, and I believe the County  attorney will agree with this, that  you could if you wanted to, you  could spend both one-year renewals  today.  

That is what I  want to clear. Not just for the  when your but it could be for both  --  

One-year, to both one-year, or two years or the proposal.  

Okay, Ms. Denys?  

 Thank you Mr. Chair that is  where I was going, out for the proposal,  and I think now more than ever, we need to do that . We are talking about transparency.  We have just come through an issue  with the citizens in our County. And this is not a reflection on  James Moore, but what has not been  said is yes, we renew that contract  for the five years, with 2, one-year extensions, but they have  been are  -- are out in here since 2002  so we have had them for 17 years.  That is not to say if we rebid it I'm certain they would bid on the  process, but I think  with where we are right now, in  Volusia County,  I would support putting it out for good. And see where the proposals come  in. I think we need to be as transparent  as we can in all of our processes.  And I understand, I understand,  on the other side why there is such  a desire to go before that 2, one years  but just because it is easy, does  not mean it is the right thing to  do at this particular time in our  history with Volusia County.  I  am going to make the motion to put it out to bid, to put  it out to extend RFP for professional auditing services.  

I am going  to second.  

Motion made by Ms. Denys and  second by  Ms. Girtman for putting this out  as RFP for a proposal.  Discussion ?  

I am perfectly happy -- I will say this, if we put it up  for bids first thing we will find  out is it is going to be much more  expensive. That is okay. We will  pay some money. I absolutely have  100% faith in all that they  are doing. It cannot be any  more transparent than a certified  public accounting firm within the  statute that they carry in our community , any more transparent than  it is. When you  give people the information of where  they can find it, they then want you to go printed  for you and you printed for them  and give it to them and they don't  believe it. So that part of transparency  is not believing the numbers, it  is never going to be corrected no  matter who you handle as her accounting  auditor.  Just be prepared for an expense . 
     Dr. Lowry?  

I agree  with you on that , Mr. Chair, I look at the upon  the or the edit in the work that  was done there and it cannot be  more unspent than that people still  quizzed us on that. So anyway, that is just my thoughts on that.  

Mr. Johnson?  

Are you  all rated? As four  public sector? Any kind of like a, B, C, any kind of rating? Quick question  to ask.  

[Indiscernible - low volume] as the accounting director. 

There he is.  

He will be better to speak to  that.  >> Not every CPA firm, but depends  on which membership you have so  we are member of the American pre-certified  public accountants as well as also  member of the government audit quieting  the center that the is CPA as well  so required go through a period  process every three years. We just  completed ours I think two years  ago. We had 14 prior annual reviews and number 1 header  comments [Indiscernible - low volume] years. Which is very  rare.  

Donna?  

One point of clarification that  I think we do need to bring up is  that depending on whatever the Council  chooses to do if you choose to go  out for RFP there is a change in  legislature this year that is effective  July first and it changes the components of the selection committee and  I just want you to be  aware that there are some changes  there.  

And I think you have  down days to be or assuming every -- the components of the selection  committee.  

Would you sure that  information so it is?  

Yes, I would be happy to once  a changes are -- in the past, County  Counsel is a chair, excuse me, as  a charter County, the  bodies, all seven of you acted as  a selection committee so what that  means is that -- and I  can go back a number of years, since  that point in time, we bring before you the request  for proposal the document and  then you look at it and you review  it and we make changes based on  any comments you have, we as a County administrative folks, we send that RFP out and we bring back to you the respondents, as an example  under this last contract there were  seven proposals the came back before  you. We brought those to you and  you looked at those proposals, you  selected down to three that you  wish to hear from and those three  came before you and made the presentations and  then you make your selection from  those presentations. What is changing  going forward is your been directed to follow the selection process  similar to a constitutional, so  what that means is at a minimum  the Council selects one, you know, one member  for a nonemployee to represent them, and the has to be representation  on that selection committee from  each of the public officers which includes  the sure, property appraisers and  selection, supervisor and the clerk  of the court although the clerk  of the court does not have to necessarily  use the alternate that is selected  so they would make up the body  or their representative again a  nonemployee representative would  make up a body that selection committee  so they are the ones that would  actually with of course our assistance  to the administrative function issue  the RFP , select the criteria that will  be included in that RFP and it goes  out, they make the recommendations  of at least three if more  than three  for the Council [Indiscernible -  low volume]  comes back to you for approval so  that changes a little bit. And I  think it is fair to also comment ,  should things change in 2021, should  the form of government, you would then have  a tax collector that would be elected.  So you may want to think about the  fact that if you do go out out for  proposal you may only want to limited  to the two years because he would  have an elected tax collector, and  the actual scope of the audit will  change. [ Captioners transitioning  ] 

>>> We could have major changes this  year. And I don't think we need to stand on this  for another year at least, rather  than change anything in the process,  that's been working with the county,  and ID what's happening, a year  comes fast, this coming year, 
     I just think we might be trying  to take and put too much change  in that process, and we've got a  group that is the outside group,  it is being transparent, and I feel  like it would be smart to just go  ahead, at least for one more year  cut before we think about making  any changes. 

We can go ahead and  at least to the extension of the  contract for one more year, going  through.  We are expecting those changes, so there's a lot of upending going  on anyway. I was literally in  the middle of a sentence.  

I'm sorry. 

I accept your apology, thank  you so much. Thank you for letting  me finish.  

I thought that is what I had  heard.  

I would like to see it  extended, at least for a year, a lot of changes that we've  been making, we know, with proven history, it  doesn't mean that we don't need  to do that somewhere along the line,  but I don't think this would be  the year, I would like to see it  extended for at least another year. 

We have a motion  on the floor, to go for a RFP, so is  dust that will -- that is what we will be voting  on. 

I get it, I'm not removing  my original motion, I think  this is sitting the wrong tone  for going forward,  and is not to say that James Moore  isn't going to bid on it, and win  the bid back the next time, what  we -- we are not eliminating James Moore, we are  adding transparency, and comes next year,  an election year, we are going to  say one more year, because who knows  with the legislators -- what the legislature is going to  do, it's going to repeat,  I believe that this is the time that we exercise the ability we have,  and we put it out to a RFP,   and that is my final word.  Thank you.  

The change, and the makeup, how that would be made up, which is a lot different, this would  be to extend the contract, it would  only extended for the year  19-20.  

Actually what you're doing  is eight teen-19 fiscal year.  That is this year , and that would leave e- 18-19. And I would be 19-20.  All in favor of the motion, the  motion is to go for a RFP,  to go  out for an RFP, all in favor, and all opposed. The motion fails  5-2,  with Girtman and Denys 
     opposing.  

I would like to motion, that  we extended for one year.  

Were you going to second? 

Motion made by Wheeler , extending it for one year, any discussion? All in favor say aye , those opposed, motion passes, 6-1, Denys  dissenting.  Me personally, after the vote,  I would prefer us to do two years,  which is the critical period of  19-20,  and the effect goes into,  but anyway , we will move on to item number  10. 

Mr. Chair -- 

It said that counsel may break 
     an unscheduled time.  

That was going to be my motion.  [ Laughter ] 

It just happened to be on  my list, that we may break at 12:37, I  see someone walking up,  this is going to be a lengthy discussion. And you don't want a hangry counsel, shall we come back -- 1:45 , a recess until  1:45. >>> [ recess until 1:45 pm ] >>> It is 1:46 PM, we are missing one councilmember , we will  begin just as soon as he or she returns. >> [ pause ] 

 It is 1:48 PM, we will reconvene the June County Council meeting. We  will move to item number 10. 

Good afternoon Mr. Chair, and  members of council, what this item  is We are bringing back  to you, as you recall, on March 19, the service-level  update, we had this as part of our  update, to implement a fire permit and fee schedule for fire services, we followed up with that,  in April, with the adoption  of the most current prevention code, what the  fees due, for  fire services, and for businesses and citizens,  and visitors, is it provides a furtherance of what the code  has been established for, fire safety, it  addresses certain construction pieces,  with regards to fire prevention  systems,  and different operations, storage,  processes, that  can affect life safety, and property, and so with  this item, what it does is it brings a resolution to establish certain fire prevention fees that go along with  the permitting process,  and this is in line with other Florida  counties, in particular contiguous  counties with us, and many of the cities in our county  also have adopted fire permitting and fire permit fees. Much in line with what we are doing, or rather we are much in line  with what they are already doing. And to some degree,  our permit fees 
     are more conservative. They are  flat rates. Easy to understand,  what they cover is,  our research, and our processes, particularly in view of  fire prevention, in  particular the systems, and the time that we invest  in the permit and the inspection process, some of  these take more than one ask --  inspection,  it could be for sprinkler system,  it could be the review of the plans, to ensure that they meet the code, and the building code,  and we would also go out and do  a initial inspection, and it could  also require a --  one or two follow-up inspections, as well as a water flow  test.  

 It is a reasonable cost to cover  what our time is, and what our fire  prevention staff would be putting into it, so we are asking  for adoption of this resolution.  

Thank you. Ms. Wheeler?  

 If there are no other comments,  I would move for adoption for the resolution  adopting the schedule, for fire  related functions pursuant to the  section 54-72 B code of ordinances.  

Second.  

The motion is made by Ms. Wheeler.  Ms. tran20 six?  

I would move or second -- Ms.  Post ?  

Hearing none, the motion passes, if I knew it was that?,  we wouldn't have had you wait. Thank  you very much.  We went through that quickly. Thank  you very much. It passed  6-0. Ms. Girtman  was out, moving to item 11. Donna? >>> Good afternoon, Tom is going to  walk through  the resolution, that we are asking  to adopt, the compensation  plan, he will go over the particulars,  of the different 
     positions that we wish to basically  rename, to modernize, especially  in the area of I.T. and a few other  items as well.  

Good afternoon, I am the County  human resources director, we are  asking that you amend and restate  the human resources classification  compensation plan, what we are essentially  doing is updating the plan, for  several reasons, the first item  that we would like to do, in section 1, 4 new classifications  and a new pay grade, these would be used in the Sheriff's  Department, 2 of them are brand-new  positions, the budget and finance  manager, and the human resources  manager, and the other two, the office communications manager,  and information technology manager,  currently is the Esso program manager, that is used  for many titles unfortunately, and  they need to really separate them  out, for recruitment issues, and  retention for the future, I believe  the communications manager will  be retiring in the near future, and we have a hard time recruiting under a program manager title.  

 Secondly, in the previous meeting,  you approved some triage nurses  for us, EMS,  2 positions we are asking to create, the EMS triage nurse in the lead  triage nurse,  -- and the lead triage nurse.  

Information technology, we used  one classification, and the job specifications generally  overall, they are very  broad, and what has happened over  the years, we  put people in titles, the jobs have  overlapped, and we have to break  those down into separate job descriptions, that is really what we did here,  and this for retention and promotional  opportunities, where people are  performing different jobs 
     than the market, pay differently,  we try to come in and correct of  those issues. That is what we did  in those 15 positions,  we have added 15 new titles, and as you can see, in  the next bill, we would be eliminating  six titles, several of those were  the ones that you can  look and see, many of the 15 were  in the 4 that we were deleting.  And so we  are deleting some of the revenue.  

Next, we are also retitling six positions that some of the divisions would  like to retitle, nothing has changed with  the title, one of them is appraisal  activity director, they think it  should be appraisal director. And then, some other building and  zoning directors, using building and code administration  director as a working title, we  are just officially making those  titles, and it is clear, it will  help us when we have to advertise  for those positions.  

Last, asking to move some pay  grades up, to help us, starting  to recruit for the deputy clerk,  County Counsel, we went out in the  market, and saw that they need to  be upgraded, the same with the 2  next ones, I.T. positions, and the revenue, they needed to be moved,  and the beach deputy chief, we  should have brought last time, more in line  with the others that are there,  move that to a pay grade D. Rather  than to 17, and that is now a classified  position. 

Let me remind everybody, when  we upgrade a class, and there is  nobody in it, a lot of the bands  overlap, there may  not be any extra actual cause, we estimate all of these changes  would be about $80,000 across the  whole organization. For instance, somebody, like we are replacing,  somebody's been here 33 years, at  the very top, but we are trying  to do is change the classification  a little bit, for better starting  pay and recruitment, but probably still in the savings,  they probably will not start as  high as the person who has left. But it puts us in  a better position, and as you notice, most of these are in areas where 
     there is pressure across the entire  organization right now, to find good people, these are  areas we have identified that need  it right now. 

Counsel? -- Council , I need a motion for this  compensation plan.  

Second.  

Motion made by Denys,  and  a second. Any objections, hearing none, the  motion passes unanimously. 

Thank you.  

Item 12. 

Good afternoon, Clay Irvin, director of growth  and resource management, a? presentation  that kind of summarizes what has  occurred in regards to growth management  and planning, at a state level,  and the how that has impacted us,  here in the county as well as the  city, I want to kind of point out  and covered my presentation, the left of the screen, a 1967  map. That the County commission, saying  how should we grow. The maps that  are on the right-hand side or from  the latest adopted comprehensive plans. It is amazing how those two documents  are similar. It shows a lot of the  commitment that Volusia County has  shown, protection of national -- 
     natural resources, being able to  balance that Through the planning process. And  how it continues on. And what we are here for  is really to go over some of the  critical issues that have come to  the surface recently. Through March  and April, some discussions, the  County Counsel, identifying growth  management, smart growth is  something they would like to discuss. Held in March, and April we had a presentation  in front of the roundtable, of elected  officials, the smart growth, that  occurred. 
     And a request to bring back the  presentation and discussion. That  focuses on  the critical issues that are highlighted  today when we had public comments. Currency, financial feasibility, and how things are being analyzed , as to whether not to continue  on, providing the service that we  are spaced to.  

[ Captioners transitioning ] 

>> Chapter 163 of the Florida statute. That identifies what has been there. Our original plan was  in 1990 and has subsequently been  amended all the way through. We in the growth and resource management  department comes Pacific the planning  and development services division  have to do in a date. The comprehensive plan is a living  breathing document. It is part of every review  we do for any development application or request for rezoning. What we are  doing from the staff level is looking  at what has to be done. We have  done some quick changes for the  capital improvements element in  the transportation element as presented  to the Council and presented onto  the department of Florida economic opportunity and has been  adopted. We are preparing for the evaluation appraisal report. When  plans were made into law there is  a requirement you had to go back  every five years and in seven years  is what we are dealing with now.  Did you do what you said you were  going to do and if not, why? Do  you need to keep doing it? If you  do, how are you going to get it  done? That is the evaluation appraisal  report and we are preparing for  that because it is not necessarily  an easy step. The original versions  of these things was an earth  shattering process and a very lengthy  one and now changes in the Florida statute has made  it considerably easier. The one critical point we have  is we have to have a comprehensive  plan based on a five-year and ten-year  planning horizon. We are running out of time because  ours is 2025 so we need to go beyond  2025 and look at 2030 and 2040  potentially as time frames for our  planning horizon.  We have to look at what our future  population is going to be and what  they demand as far as land uses  and if we have sufficient lands. Those are the things we are working  on right now.  

Here is a brief history of Florida  planning. This is my tongue-in-cheek and I was there in 1985 as a  grad student when they were going  to the hearings. What I heard was this is a state mandate if you  you have Moses coming down with the tablet saying thou shall  plan. Other folks looked at it the Russians and the Chinese have  a five year and a 10 year plan and  it doesn't seem to be working for  them. Then we heard from the environmental  groups and the groups out this is  the way to put everybody on even  keel.  The people offering a lot of the growth management  are looking for balance. As  you look at any of the discussions  we have about sustainability you  will see you have to balance economic, social growth and protection.  

 I'm glad you explained those pictures.  I was getting concerned.  

The  perception of what growth management had multiple views and in all reality and  attempt to apply for balance. In 72 you had preliminary work  done to ensure anything that had widespread impacts  was evaluated. 85 was the  growth management act. 2009 there  was a series of changes and I have  to highlight. In 85 it was  very much a top-down bureaucratic  process. As a young planner I walked in with handtruck field  with documents for comp plan  for community of 32,000 people. 2009 the economy was in  the tank. We were in the heart of  one of the heaviest recessions.  The legislature and the governor  realized they needed to make changes so they did.  They made a series of changes that  lessened some of the requirements  from the state level. In 2011 the  community planning at made a substantial  number of changes where they felt  they were giving more power back  to the cities. To a certain  extent that was correct but at the  same point while they were doing  that there were certain changes  they mandated we had to follow in  regards to other things such as  concurrency, levels of service and needs analysis that were  taken out but  specific requirements were put on  the local governments. When we first started putting this  together I went on the DEL website and I was going to put bullets  of the changes and I wouldn't have  enough slides for all the changes. 
     If anybody wants to go to the history  of changes in our growth management  laws that is the website. Each one of those bullets on the  left, massive changes to the  state laws. It is available and what we are going to  try to do is squeeze that down.  In regards to Volusia County   we did the 1967 how should we grow? In 72 we created our subdivision  standards. 1980 we realized  we had different zoning standards handled by different groups. We came through with a comprehensive  plan in 1990. 2002 we initiated  the level of smart growth analysis. I am a  planner and guilty of buzzwords. The buzzword of smart  growth has been out there for a  while. It was trying to get into  the idea of let's look at what we  are doing and see what we can do  to make things better so we don't  rain on our resources and we minimize  the amount of trip and all these  things planners strive to do. There  was an extensive outreach. All the  cities joined in with the county and the county paid to have it  basically orchestrated through the Florida growth conflict consortium. There was a report of  how to do smart growth. We took it and  the county took it and created two  committees for the implementation.  We are still working through that.  Many of you may not be aware, when we come  forward with this land development  changes you authorized back in October  2017, the majority are following  through on the recommendations from  the smart growth implementation  committees. We have been  doing a good job of trying to keep  up with what was required and discussed  through that whole process. Again the recession of 2008 on  put a big hindrance on it because  at that point folks  are like I don't need to regulate  growth, I just need growth. We still  persevered.  

 Here are the big-ticket items and  I will go through these individually  and these will address concerns. First of all concurrency then and now. Concurrency when it was originally  adopted in chapter 163 of the Florida  statute said you is a local government could not issue a development order  or project if  it exceeded the level of service and no resolution or solution was  within the first three years of  the five-year capital improvement  program so therefore there was a  hard stop to development. That is  no longer there.  What is happened with the 2010 community  planning act is they said specifically transportation concurrency, you don't have to have a local  government. If you want to do a  mobility strategy which is a little  different and not applicable  to the county as large as ours,  you can do that but if you keep  concurrency, and here is the  critical part, this is how you're  going to do it. It is a paid to  go and doing the analysis of whether or  not there is a level service issue, you can't worry about the traffic  being generated about everybody  else, only the proposed project. They took away some tools  we had in that we could use  that hard stop to come up with ways  to solve these problems.  Volusia County  was  able to do a great deal of adaptation  and that is why you see the pipelining  of these improvement projects where  we take the money paid by the developers  to cover cost and prioritize for strategic improvements to the  roadways that help out. What you  are seeing is the hard stop we had  is gone and as the gentleman was saying earlier  today, just a note to the project. We are reaching a point where we  really can't. It is saying here is your project. Whittier impacts ? Pay us  and go. The next item was needs analysis. 
     I referenced the needs analysis  earlier in my discussion. Basically  the initial idea was you  have this future land use map that  tells us the number of homes that  could be potentially built that  shows vacant that have certain densities  and everything else. If you want  to change and increase that, you need to show us it is justified  and we make that justification based  on the population projections from  the University of Florida  and whatever you have in your comprehensive  plan. That is a complicated way  of saying we are planning out for  2030, let's look at our future land  use map and come up with how many  units we have and assume how many  people are living there and doesn't  match what we have in our projected  population. If it is we can't  allow for more residential units. You have to show me why you need  to change this. It was geared  more to future land use map amendments.  Folks with the get 1000 acres  of land in an unincorporated area and Annex into a city and try to get higher density. Then the Department of community  affairs would  be you need to show us that is needed.  What is your justification for this  change? That was removed. That was our ceiling. What  was replaced was the floor. If you  look at the 2010 legislation and  all the subsequent legislation it  said analyze what you need to meet  your minimum and there was no cap. We no longer have DCA looking over our shoulder. Does  that mean we as Volusia County  think about adding that is a policy  in our comprehensive plan  when we do the analysis of whether  or not somebody should be granted  an increase of density? Yes we can. That does have some  limited impact. Not all development  is in Volusia County .  If we don't have corresponding policies  with your cities you may not be  able to implement it. The other  problem is sometimes there may be  a right way of allowing for density  occurrence in the heart analysis  can create some problems.  

Financial feasibility. I can tell you at one point our  capital improvement element and  our capital improvement program  had extensive amounts of tables  and basically we had to grab the  five-year budget from the school  board, from D.O.T. district 5,  St. John's, anybody we  had to put them in their and then  we had to put it in our own. We  had to show all these improvements  were geared toward making sure we  had adequate capacity in all of  our infrastructure. Roads, water, sewer, stormwater and recreation. If you didn't have something that  was financially feasible you got  dinged by DCA. That was eliminated . That  financial feasibility, the accountability  for level of service. We can bring  it back, and again you need to be mindful  of what you do with that because  of this you have a dedicated funding source to make  sure you can maintain that level  of service, it can be difficult.  We are preempted by 163 in regards to transportation. Realize it is one of these things it is the pay and go mentality. 

 As I talked about with DCA and now  the EEO with the 2010 community planning  subsequently implemented in 2011, growth management  was a State Department and that  State Department was eliminated. Now it is a division within  the department of economic opportunity. There  a was limited to state issues only. They will not  get into any of the ideas I just  brought up here you will not have  state review. That is not necessarily  a bad thing but it does require  an understanding of where their  perspectives are coming from. I  can tell you as we  are here lamenting about how the  state is not involved beyond this  review, if we had talked in 1995  everybody would have been screaming  about  DCA is telling us how to run our  cities or a county. There is a little  bit of a double-edged sword on that.  

Processing. It used to be you are limited to  two large scale comprehensive planning  minimums per year and 10 small-scale land-use. Large-scale the is with goals, objectives and  policies at  any change to the future land use  map that involves 10 acres or more. Now it is unlimited and  processed than any time.  That is not necessarily a bad thing  to be honest with you because it  does give cities and counties a  better ability to respond but if  we did have  a big economic development project  and we needed to change something  we would need to do it quickly.  It does create a situation where again some of the restrictions does help.  Now I'm getting into what is happening  now with the ledges and if session and this is pertaining to 7103. I don't believe the  governor has signed that yet. It  is still on his desk. This is not  necessarily impact 163 as thoroughly but it does impact how we process and handle development. I'm going  to talk quickly to those and I will  be able to answer any questions  you have. First of all inclusionary  zoning was identified as one of  the tools local governments have to help with affordable or workforce  housing. Basically you say you are  coming in in your  going to do a 1000 lot subdivision  you need to make sure 10% is provided  for affordable housing. We have  been prohibited from doing that. Basically it  is a preponderance on us to say  you have to help us out this way  and we can allow for waiving of  impact fees and provide density  bonuses and provide for housing  fund but the ability to mandate  to someone to provide as part of their development  has been removed. The one that is  going to be interesting to implement, the shot clock, we only have 120 days to approve  a project that requires staff approval  only. 180 days if it requires a  public hearing. I don't think that  is a big issue. Our process is actually an expedited process in my opinion  and the fact side plans  our staff approval only. A lot of  the things we have going. Where  it is going to get kind of crazy  is traffic impact. Doing  a traffic impact analysis  considerable timeframe. You have  to prepare methodology and the methodology  has to approve governments being  impacted by it then you have to  conduct the study and provide the  study and review process. We will have to study done as part  of this because we have to have  a complete application. The minute  we say it is a complete application  by state law we only have 120 days or 180 days. The component may create a little  bit of a hick up. The other  aspect is if the developer agrees to extend the timeframe or allow for additional comments  for those things and there is a  written agreement the  state legislature is basically given the development community the right  to say it is okay  to take it on. The critical part at  the end of that timeframe it is  either approved, approved with conditions  or denied. How are we going to  provide any approvals with conditions? 
     Any pre-existing development orders  in place, we have to  honor them. It is not necessarily  as impactful to Volusia County because  we are not  necessarily dealing  with annexation of properties. If there is any existing development  order it has to be honored by the  comprehensive plan. This is kind of a quiet one. Challenge encumbrancer  plan amendments must pay attorney  fees cost if they lose. Now what that means if you are  a citizen and objecting to the fact the property next door is going  to be doubled in size in regards  to density, you could go to your  local government, identify your concerns and provide  your justification why they shouldn't  approve it and if they do you can  contest. Before you  didn't have to worry about paying  attorney fees for the landowner  requesting it. Now if you lose you could be subject to the  attorney fees associated with that. Basically that is identify as a  way to dissuade people from taking  on the this lawsuits. It is all on your perspective. Concurrency, if we go with the mobility, you  must comply with 
     -- it is splitting hairs  but you have to go through and show  the improvements are tied to the  development going on. I have to give credit  dollar dollar for concurrency .  Can only charge actual cost of administration, the impact fees we approved back  in December were based on a 3%  administrative fee and  now I'm going to have to go back  and figure out how much it has to  process impact fees so it's going  to be a little different there.  Cannot require payment of the impact  the prior to issuance of welding  permit. If they want  to pay it they can but we cannot  mandate it. Our current system is dollar for  dollar. If I come in right now and  I know my impact is going to be  and I pay let's say $1 million for a crop share agreement and  we pipeline the money in  $1 million as a credit for that  developer. They wear down that million  dollars based on the impact be at  that time. It is five years down  the road it is not going to be with  they paid, it is going to be  five years in the future. You have  an automatic index that increases  it that is capped at 8% so they are saying no, you can't  do that. It is basically unit for unit and  square foot for square-foot so future  increases in evaluation are lost. We have  a preponderance of evidence in litigating challenges of these  for dollar for dollar credit. It  is up to us to prove they are wrong. Impact fees must be earmarked to  benefit new users. This  is confusing as far as implementation because you may not pay off existing  debt or previously approved improvements unless reasonably connected  to the impact of new development. I'm  going to use the example of timber  Creek Road in  Normandy Beach. That was part of  the bond issue in 2006. You have  the road being built that is been  constructed. Where using gas tax but we also obligated impact fees and that would be the  primary source. As a developer  coming in and we developing piece  of property beach side and has to pay  impact fees, could they argue their  impact fees could not be used to  pay back that bond because they  are not able to show direct correlation . That is  my interpretation of it. I'm not  really sure how it is going to happen. I know Jamie and Dan have looked  at it and have a couple of perspectives  on it and it is one  of the things that the language  is somewhat loosely written in one  of those things we will have to  muddle through.  Before in the past you don't [ Indiscernible ] you transfer  into that specific impact fee. The legislation has said cities  and counties do not have to do that. Impact these are not the same as  water and sewer connection fees. I just want to make sure .  

The next one is kind  of interesting. When you come in  to get a building permit, you have  the option as a land owner to pay  for and have a private provider do your plan review and your  building inspection. That means  I'm coming in to get a building  permit. In setting having a city  or county staff review it, I'm going  to pay this architecture or engineer  license to do this to review my  plans and based on what he says  you issue me a permit. I will start  building my house and I'm not going  to use your inspectors I'm going  to use private providers to meet  state credentials to conduct the  inspections and once inspections  are completed and if they are [ Indiscernible ] that  NC is 60 rule. They have added onto  that site construction so it is  not just the actual building construction, it is the road construction,  extension of utilities, provision  of stormwater so  therefore not only now is my home I am coming in for  commercial subdivision and I'm going  to be putting in a giant shopping  center and out parcel. I'm going  to send it over  to my private provider who is going  to review it and say it complies  with the counties land development  regulations and the inspections  can also be done by private provider. That is not necessarily  a bad thing  but it is something to be aware  of. It is almost self certification. 

What are our potential next steps? As I talked about, we do still have a considerable  number of tools in our planning  toolbox. We can work through a lot of different  issues.  You were going to see your staff  is going to recommend you allow  us continuing to do the update to  the comps map and what we can do as far as continuing the implementation  of the policies from years ago. Look at what we can  do in regards to working with the  cities to do something in regards  to concurrency needs analysis, identify  how level of services can be protected  and improved upon. And we have to  work with the cities. I want to jump to these map because you will understand the  reason why am saying this. We have  larger maps back here so if folks  can't see this we have them printed  out back there. Misdirected walled asked me, how  much of this  is in city and in the county  to control? On the left side you see in 1990 when we had our comp plan adopted  for the first time, we had 108,000  acres in city boundaries. If you look at a currently it  is around 213,000 acres. You have almost a doubling of the  acreage within the municipal boundaries  of our cities and is subject to  their land-use and subject to  their zoning and land development  regulations. Remember the County  does not have chartered land-use  into the cities. All we have are  environmental standards contained  in Chapter 50 of our code. 
     You have to look at the map that  speaks for itself. You can see the  Western expansion of some the cities,  specifically Daytona Beach and Edgewater.  When you look to the west side, Deltona wasn't even a city  in 1990. You can see the  expansion of Dewberry and Orange  city as well as the land. 
     That is not to say we are having  bad growth, the city bought into  a lot of all the smart growth  philosophy as well. We just have  growth and we have been discovered for  businesses and residential. A lot  of the development you see  is already in these future land  use map at the densities they are  being developed at. Latitude was two units per acre at Ormond Beach and we were fighting  if they could be annexed into Daytona  Beach or Ormond Beach.  A lot of this was already in the  plans. You have seen the cities  annexed these areas and it is starting  to develop. That is where our lack of being  able to follow some of the concurrency  standards and level of service requirements  we had for the financial feasibility  have been lost. Just to add to what exactly  Volusia County can do , we  started thinking of all the land that is left over, how much  is owned by St. John's because we bought it because of  Volusia forever . How many  easements are being utilized for  wetland mitigation?  There is roughly 404,000 acres in  Volusia County  that are  basically protected for conservation. This map shows  it in the cities and in the county. I would say a large portion of  this is in the county jurisdiction. Just assume 400,000 acres  in Volusia County's conservation.  Going back to our other map  we have 455,000 acres so there is roughly a 5000  acres available for development  in all of unincorporated Volusia  County.  55,000 . 

And 15,000 are  on farm which is Artie been planned so there is  40,000 acres roughly available for  new development. 
     >> I may be going rogue here, I  don't know but I  appreciate you bringing us up to  date on this. A lot of times in the past I have  looked at conservation areas and I think in the future it is going  to be shown Volusia County  was  so far in the future about having  conservation lands and protected  lands that it is almost a dream come  true for our children and grandchildren . Recently we came up 
     from the mayor's Roundtable and  this came up about the smart growth. There different definitions of  smart growth and urban sprawl  and good and bad about both of them  but it is something that I think  it is time we have to take and start  thinking about all the partners  getting together and working with. This did come up  before so it is nothing new. It  came up at the mayor's Roundtable but I think it is time maybe we  send a letter out to all of our  partners in the city partners and  get the people involved and start  looking to see what we can do. I think we said  55,000 acres and we need to watch  what we are doing. One size does  not fit all. Just like one time somebody told  me to get a canoe but I wanted my  boat and it is the same thing with  this. Some people don't want to  live in a condominium. It is not  for everybody so one size will not  fit all. But we do have to take  and get all the city partners.  We need to get a state legislator  involved in this committee because  that is where some of our issues  come in. They need to see what we're  having. Developers have to be involved. That even says in the smart  growth when you look at up that  the developers have to be involved. You have to have the environmentalists  involved. We have to remember  we can't tell the city what to do.  This is a partnership where we were together to make sure we go for  a common goal for the protection. A lot of  people think, what is smart growth?  They look at it as no growth. That  is not an option. We have to think about jobs for  our children and families. We have  to think about the tax base. Are  we going to leave it on the resident's or bring in and where we have corporations  to work with and bring that back  in line. A place where we can pick  up a lot of stuff to make this County  a better it counted me just office  baseboard. We talk about that on  one and and we have to  make sure we don't kill it on the  other end. I had somebody tell me this  was the quaint town and that is  why I moved here. And I  said it was a quaint town until  you moved here. That is the truth. You cut down your trees for  your house but don't cut down another  tree for somebody else's property. That is their property right. We have to think about  all these things when we do this. Part of smart growth. Consolidated is going to help the  downtown area when they put in this  condominiums. It is something we  look at that doesn't fit  somewhere else. You have to have  the ability of town centers or walking  distances or public transportation. I think some  of these things we were talking  about they say a lot of these things  were planned and in the works. That  is when you bring your developers  and with it and say we can make  it easier let's plan these cities  a little different than when you  build a city and planted out people  don't have the expectation is  not going to be some kind of business  in the neighborhood which right  now if we do this it is not in my  backyard. Everybody wants it in  somebody else's backyard  but they don't want this condominium  in their neighborhood. It is  all going to be an issue  that is going to be tough to deal  with but it has to be dealt with. Once again 
     we need to get all of their city  partners in. Everyone of these partners  has to have a representative on  that committee and I would like  to make a motion we put Deb  Denys  on it from  our County.  Deb, you know the issues and  you are good at it but we have to  have somebody in each one of these  groups and we have to  sit down and start working on it  and we have to work on it as partners. Too often this it is look  at us and say you are trying to  take it away from us and tell us  what to do. Things have gotten better working  with the cities have they not? We  want to keep it that way but this  should be a group effort for all  of us to work together and make  this thing work as best we can  and remember one size doesn't at  all. And  I would like to have a second on  that nomination for Deb.  

This  is not for a second but thank  you for that vote of approval. Councilman  Johnson thank you because were talking  about smart growth  but we need meaningful growth. We  have used the word smart over and  over again. We need meaningful growth and these  maps speak volumes. I want to go  back to that number because I want  to make sure you have got it right.  55,000 acres left to develop in  Volusia County ?  

As far as development  that means those properties have  a land-use rule or resource  along those lines  so they are being used for agricultural  purposes or similar types of uses. Those are the areas that could  be potentially changed for more  intensive development.  

The 40,000 is farm? 

15.  

I had it backwards. And the unincorporated county. Which means our foot print if you  will, our ability to leave a foot  print from here on out is minimized and  the balance is within the city's  jurisdiction.  

Again going back to what we have currently within  the cities themselves, you've got  213,000 acres within the municipal  boundaries. You have areas like  Holly Hill and South Daytona and  Daytona Beach, they are restricted . I can tell you when we  start looking, Ormond Beach has  nowhere to go but north of that  area has been developed for Halifax plantation and plantation Bay. The areas to the south in  Port Orange, Port Orange is relatively  constrained, we have farmers village  land-use plan which  has restrictions on the use to rural  areas. Then the situation occurs  in portions of Port Orange in new  Smyrna Beach because of the local  plan. When  you get into Edgewater those are  areas we have identified through  interlocal service boundary agreements  were some of those and then farms and is the area in here needs 
     litigation [ Indiscernible ] these  are approximate numbers, 15,000 available for their development .  

Going back to  it Councilman Johnson said, I totally  agree with him that going forward  with this and building the partnership is not just with the cities but  with all the stakeholders including  the developers. The mistake we made in my opinion  is we have us and them. It is the elected leaders Roundtable, it  is the Chambers of commerce and  we have Allstate in our own silos  and then to address it we ask you, Mr. developer and fill  out a yellow card and then you have  three minutes to talk to us and  that doesn't get us to where we  need to go. Councilman Johnson, I think you are on target that we need to expand our approach. I guess a regional is the new local  were going to redefine regional  is more diversified partners and stakeholders within this group, but to do  this we can only do this when we  change our comp plan.  Jamie?  

I want to add a couple of things.  Back when County did farm town  a needs analysis was [  Indiscernible ] controlling traffic  was still in place. The county permits population projection  into Farmington for the  unincorporated areas. That is an important point. That is where we put our  population projection. Each one  of the cities in the county handled  their own needs analysis and their  own population projection that is  where the counties went. The other  piece you have to remember is during  the recession, every  development order that had been  issued in the early 2000's put on  hold, those deadlines were extended by  the legislature. Those  still exist. Ordinarily a special exception or  a plat that didn't complete  would expire. Cities and counties have expirations.  Developers know this but the legislature extended those.  A lot of what you are seeing getting  developed now was approved in 2003, 2004 and 2005 and has been  sitting there and they have those  development rights and they were  extended and they are allowed to  start now.  

So were talking about  smart growth, meaningful growth  and development. What comes along with this obviously  is transportation and how  we define that and how we get there.  What is interesting while the population  growth is growing it was growing  quicker is the miles driven per  capita. We actually have a regional report that has that that did our region in central  Florida that shows our population  growth straight up but  so is the miles driven per capita  and that is the real day-to-day  impact of what we are seeing  and what we are trying to address and trying to get our arms  around for the future. I don't know what the answer is  but thank you. I agree with you  Councilman Johnson and everything  you said, and  perhaps take this to the elected leaders Roundtable.  

 It is on the agenda for the meeting  next Monday.  

Does  counsel want to suggest we pull  in the stakeholders group  that has an ability to  do something as a representative?  >> I think having the vehicle we have  which is the elected officials Roundtable  for everybody is there and have us ask  for a solution and  how they feel and  would they be comfortable performing  a separate committee which is what  we have done on every other issue, have a separate committee which  could be made up of whatever is  decided and put the time into it  just like we did on the  beach driving and the other issues and the water issues. Then report back to the Council to see what comes up. You don't want to throw that  vehicle away or at least that  ability to communicate and try to  circumvent that by going outside  and doing it on our own. I think  that would defeat the purpose of  having meaningful dialogue and working  together.  

And include broadening the stakeholders outside of that with  the understanding of whoever is  appointed or however you can figure  that has the ability to speak  for their governing body.  

Also as was mentioned,  some of the stakeholders in the  development people to have them  involved in all of that would come  about from those that would be on  a committee, and I'm sure we have any number of people that would  volunteer and that needs to be included. I think that  would be a good way to proceed and  see what comes out of that because  it is going to take a concerted  effort by everyone with the understanding of what  we are trying to accomplish. Like 
     Clay mentioned, we can't prohibit  the counties and the cities from  doing what they are allowed to do  by law to try to get them to stay in line with going forward  with meaningful growth and sustainable  growth. Not necessarily smart growth because to me that is an  abused term used as a buzzword to  get people excited and to make them think  what we are doing is not smart and  maybe some decisions have been made  that word correct but also  Clay has pointed out accurately  and rightly the tools that have been removed  from the toolboxes that the city  and the counties have. Clay, I took it to where you were at the question  part. We have one individual who  wants to speak on this. John, I will give you the opportunity. He is  awake now. 
     >> I would like to say you've got  more power than you think you have. Yes there have been problems in  the past.  The county and the city don't always  necessarily work well together but  you have the power of the purse  and the power to  do things people may not necessarily  like this sometimes you need to  hit them with the two by four to  get their attention is a group because  not all of us like to make the  same decisions but we are all in  this together and whether it is  new Smyrna Beach or Daytona Beach or were ever, whatever  we decide, we are a group and you have got to look at this  as the Volusia County,  not as  individual cities. This is not just  us the county, it is  we the residents of Volusia County.  I think you  will get more cities on board that  you expect. Thank you.  

 Miss post?  

On slide 12-13 , it  talked about meeting the level of service. I think that is the think we need  to focus on. We need  to have our goal as meeting the  level of service. I am not a  big fan, I understand  the concept of putting a committee  together and getting all the shareholders  on board. I'm not a big fan of committees  in the first place but I get what  you are saying.  I would like to suggest, because  one of the comments made this morning in a previous agenda item was  we have adversarial positioning  with the cities and we are expecting much more adversarial positions and adversarial relationships with the cities . You actually  said that Councilwoman Denys  I  think. The elected officials Roundtable is an opportunity  to get everybody together to talk  and solve issues. What I would like to suggest and  what I would move  is instead of suggesting a committee that we provide  direction to the chairs or counsel, 
     representatives, officials and roundtables, if we  could work toward a joint mission  statement, I sent out the  letter individually to other  counsel people around the county to talk to them about this issue  and get their viewpoints. We do need to talk about  a collectively and I think it would  be a great idea if the  elected officials and staff talked  about it  before bringing in developers and everyone else into the issue. I think the point in the bottom  line goal is to come up with an  agreement with the cities for us  to work together toward a common  goal. If we  can talk with them about it about  all of these other stakeholders  in the beginning I think it would  be more productive if. We normally don't provide direction for  the Roundtable, but I would really  like to move, we have the chair suggest a joint  mission statement that provides  specific focus  towards action. What I also  don't want to see happen is we have meeting after meeting without any  actual action. If we can have that movement  and that Bush and that movement  brought up and then we can brainstorm and  work toward some solution, that  might be a good start.  I think we might be looking a little  too bold in having the committee and the stakeholders on board from  the beginning. That would  be my motion.  

Okay. I think it  is a great idea to try to get a  joint mission statement. I think  the part of having I think what  you will have happened having been  on the Roundtable for years, everyone there that is a lack the is elected to represent their people and I think they all want to represent  the people and hear everyone's voice  and they will do that.  The element we were thinking of  including others, and I think this  will happen, when they were looking  at the beach issues they weren't  just talking about beachside property. When we talked about water issues. We would looked at the  half cent sales tax we didn't limit  it on the scope of where the individuals  on the committees , when we talked about affordable  housing, homelessness,  we didn't limit that. We involved  people in Orlando and a lot of different  sources of people  to develop a process to address  the issues. I wouldn't want to limit and say the committee or whatever  is formed on the Roundtable is limited  only to discussion. Everyone will  be vocal in this I can guarantee  you that. We realize we need to do something.  What is what we don't know.  

That is my point. As  a county it would be a comprehensive  plan that we need to work on the  comprehensive plan. The cities need  to work on their individual plans  so that is what I'm saying. If we  can collectively sit down and discuss  that and discuss even a  starting point, I  think it is going to get modeled  if we start bringing in developers and everyone else to the table. I think if  we do our comprehensive plans, the  developers will get it. That certainly isn't negating not everyone having a  voice or having those conversations  at some point.  

I know you have got a motion  to do something.  I'm not so sure we need a motion  of direction. I would certainly  go back and do what you said and  suggested with the Roundtable which  is next Monday.  

Well we usually don't  give direction so I wanted to make  sure if we are giving direction, I would like us to give direction so you have direction from the  Council.  

I will take that back. We don't need a  motion to vote on it. You have given  me direction  in if anybody on the Council doesn't  want to do that, speak now. I would  take the direction back  to try to form a joint mission statement  that will lead to action that will  come from a committee that  the Roundtable will probably put  together the people who want to  be involved in the discussion of  here is where we are and where we  go from here and that is if they  can incorporate that in their ideas. It will  take some time.  Is not going to take something that  will be solved in one meeting but  I guarantee you the committees that  have worked in the past work diligently on all the projects we suggested but this is probably a perfect  time because the last major issues  we have looked at.  I am hopeful we will be more cohesive  than divisive. I think the divisiveness that was  there will disappear from the  half cent sales tax which is what  kind of divided some of them.  Just like the water issues , the economic  development process, everything  is brought people together. For the first time we had all 16  cities working together and I see  they will be doing the same thing.  I will take that at the direction  of this counsel and that will  be done. You have my word  on that next Monday.  Miss Wheeler?  

Thank you Mr. chair.  You talked about some of the project  from 2003 that are just now coming  forward. Are they under these new rules  of the legislative session or are  they going to be?  

The 2019 have not been signed  into law yet  so we don't know if the governors  going to sign them.  

And if they are these ones  in the process coming up will be  under that?  

Yes.  

It depends on the developer.  For example Farmington. One of the things that occurred  is the county realized the development  of regional impact legislation and rules were on their way out. Reading the tea leaves and what was happening at Tallahassee  was ready they were going to get  rid of it. Your legal staff is wife's  incident the provision even if the  DRI process goes away you will still  follow that same thing based on  this date. 
     There may be some properties that  have those limitations which would  prompt some of these other issues. 

The other thing is I want to  stress the  chair, you and I were instrumental  when Volusia government  was dissolved because of the expense  it was for each city to be involved  . You and I were one of the ones  that make that happen but we were  also the ones that formed this new  counsel of elected officials . Because  of the importance of the communication. It is always been about communicating  with the cities. I don't see  we are getting worse. I see we are  getting better. We are not anywhere  near where we need to be but I hear  it from my district. My cities  are happy. They are happy with  the communications and maybe in  the go-between and  they feel like there is better conversation. George has been instrumental  in changing the conversation and we need to keep that going. 
     I think this has been coming for  several months. We started talking  about this months ago about the  growth and how we need to address  it. It is nothing new but now it  has to be our number one priority . I think  the committees are a sign of transparency when you have more than one person  involved in you have it from different  areas. That entitles people to be  at the table with more transparency so there is a lot of different  stakeholders in their. I do agree we are at the point now to  just get it started because each  city will then have to go forward with the conversation that transpires  Monday and take it back to their  counsel and  we need to make sure they take it  back to their counsel for discussion.  Here is where we were heading. Everybody 
     -- to form  different committees to move forward on projects  and that is with everybody being  engaged. This is an important one. Everybody has  to be there in the communication  process. I think we need to address this  as seriously as we have addressed  other things. We are here and at  that point. It is our position as the Volusia County governing  body with the 16 cities  that we  have to be at the starting point  to say let's pull everybody together and let's have a conversation  and start the process. I am in total support of that. 

Miss Girtman?  

Thank you. I am certainly in support, I'm glad were having this conversation. This was the number one issue was  smart growth and the concern about how we were approaching it. The 18th is  our workshop and I wonder if this couldn't and  shouldn't be one of the discussions we have during that time and has  staff come back to us with some of the top concerns and things they would like for  us to consider in something to  take back to the cities. I also think in addition to having that conversation  I do like the idea of the Roundtable  committee. I also like the idea of a fresh  perspective and approach and I think our councilman large Johnson , I think having  the relationships he has throughout  the county and relationships with  the cities would be  an awesome representative  on that committee. I just think he brings a fresh  perspective and I like the way he  thinks. At  least in regards to that area so  I thought I would share that with  you. Thank you.  

I notice he is  smiling. Jamie ?  

One of the things that might  be helpful from the counsel Roundtable and the elected officials Roundtable, I know Clay has been  working on this data point but he  really needs this information to  help us.  We know how many developments have  been approved in the unincorporated  area and we are working to the process. When we talk about the needs analysis, essentially we are working off 2010 census and  we are about to roll into the 2020  census. The Volusia County home  is 2.2  people per home. Based on your population projections  you divide by 2.2 and that is how  many homes you need. We know how  many were approved in unincorporated  area, we have  not been able to get that data point  from all these cities. It would  be wonderful if you could ask the  cities to go back and bring that  data point forward. I  think that is really important for analyzing where we are going  to the future. And to the extent  they can wear  those development approvals are  on the map.  

 They are all in LPGA.  

Here is what I  would suggest, Georgiana managers  meeting would have that readily  available and easy to access. George if you could bring that  at the next managers meeting so  we could use that and use those  numbers at the Roundtable or as part of the ongoing process.  

I think that would be helpful. You see the maps and boundaries but you don't have the  other piece you can then apply to  the population projections and the  canal you're going to grow going  back to the 1963 map.  

Just to point out , Ben you  mentioned it is not a one-size-fits-all it is not going to be a one-size-fits-all  answer because I don't think you  are going to get every other city  to agree with the new Smyrna Beach  process at any property to be developed, 50% aside right off  the bat. You are not going to get every  city to want to do that. Other cities  is Clay pointed out have little  or no place to grow.  I know Ormond Beach, Orman crossings  is pretty much it. We are  built out. Port Orange is limited. To try to get restrictions or  get agreements but if  those agreements wouldn't adversely  impact the others, maybe we can  get the wording. Clay will be there Monday to present  the Roundtable. I think that is  going to be helpful having that  in sharing this information which  a lot of elect this don't have access to that  right now. By then the latest bill which the governor may or  may not sign ,  that is paramount going forward . I am guessing it  will be signed or not by then. Deb, one last thing?  >> Mr. chair, just a point of  clarification because I was taken  aback accordingly as adversarial  with the cities.  

You didn't say that,  did you?  

I did say that. I want  to make sure my contact [ Indiscernible ] it was used if I recall correctly  in our relationship between the  county in the cities with legislative  reform and issues going forward could put us in an adversarial relationship  between the county in the cities.  Not that it is now that it is something  to be concerned about. In no would do I want that term associated  with this dialogue.  

Thank you.  I think we have several anything  on this. You have a  detailed report at the next council  meeting on what  was accomplished and where we are  going to grow. Thanks, Clay . Go to item  13. Donna? Another good one coming up. 

A good news day today for  my department. Donna Butler, community services  director. Finally after many months, actually a couple of  years, waiting for our funds from the department of opportunity, this is our disaster recovery  grant funds coming in front of  you today.  I have been asked to share a little  bit about what this program is going  to do and how we came to determine  what the need was. We utilized a  variety of resources, DEO sent  the information on a tragedy occurred in the data they gathered but we  used FEMA data and property appraisers  data to determine where some of  the biggest needs were. My staff  visited eight different mobile home  parks located on the east side. Two in Ormond Beach and six  in Port Orange. We have not identified  actual places where the single-family  homes might be located but  we anticipate 45 total of these mobile home units and  10 of the single-family homes. 
     That is $3.4 million back into  our community to help these families  move through the system. We are going to do a press release  that kicks off our housing program. There is a website that has  been created and it will go live  on the same day. The application  will be available on that day and you are aware of the hurricane  Expo that will take place. We will  be there and have information for  folks and applications will  be available at area libraries.  We partner with our library systems  to disseminate information. We are excited about the program and excited that we got our final  contract back and I think we can  make a significant difference in  the community.  >> The County Council approval  to accept community development  grant disaster recovery funds from  the floor department it of economic  opportunity execute a grant agreement with  the DEO and appropriate the funds.  John Nichols wants to speak to this. If you don't want to accept it,  that is fine.  Ms. Girtman.  

Hi, Donna. I  wanted to ask what happens with  funds that aren't utilized?  

We will work  really hard to utilize them.  

Is there a  window?  

Two years. If we went through and there were  no more mobile homes but we still  had single-family homes we  can switch that and use that in  a different way. We will make sure  we maximize the use of these funds.  >> It is just so late, were talking  three years after an incident.  

We understand that. 
     Some of those homes --  

Might've been further damaged. I was asking if we could reimburse the one that had to do repairs  or is this only --  

For folks that have that  did not [ Indiscernible ]  meet the basic qualifications for  reimbursement in another way.  That is Sue we will be serving here.  

Thank you.  

Miss Wheeler.  

I would like  to move approval of the appropriation  of the plot grant disaster  recovery funds.  

Second.  

 Motion made by Wheeler and seconded  by Denys.  Any objections? Hearing none the motion passes  unanimous and we will move to  14. John? 
     >> He is our adjunct councilmember. 

I'm Jessica [ Indiscernible ]  director for Volusia County . 
     Hurricane Irma significantly damaged [  Indiscernible ] and stormwater runoff from A1A as well  as  two adjacent properties. Adjacent property owners sustain  damage to their private garage and  parking garage as well as erosion  at the base of the driveway located  at the eastern end of the rent.  On April 3rd, 2018 counsel approved  a contract assignment with DMC in the amount $58,700 for the design and permitting of  repairs to the approach and store  mitigation measures. On May 2nd,  2019 FEMA approved a proposed new seawall at the end of the ramp  to mitigate future damage to the  county beach approach as well as  the adjoining property owners. FEMA  did not approve the entire project in some amenities  did not provide future store protection. 
     The project was broken up into two  phases to maintain compliance with  the FEMA mitigation approval. As  shown on the screen  page 14-3 from the agenda item.  FEMA has approved a new seawall. Stormwater improvements,  resurfacing and striping of the  ramp as well as a walkover. Improvements consist of phase 1 of the Plaza ramp project as shown on page 14-3. On page  14-4 phase 2 will consist of the amenity  improvements not reimbursable by  FEMA include the proposed landscaping, shower, bike rack, benches  and shade structures. This approach is  not currently open to the public  for regular driving in the proposed  plan would eliminate vehicle access  of any kind to the beach from this  location. The proposed plan would eliminate  ocean storm surges from entering  the beach approach area, deposit  of sand and debris and protect the  adjacent properties. [ Indiscernible ] located less  than 0.4 miles to the south and  Harvard right beach approach is  less than 0.3 miles to the north. Construction for both phases is  estimated at $475,000. The design task assignment  came and $58,700 resulting in a  total estimated project cost  of $533,700. FEMA has committed  to contributing $215,000 in public assistance funding for  the mitigation measures bringing  the county's total estimated project  cost down to $318,700. We are looking for direction to  move forward with the project to  include the mitigation measures  has approved by FEMA.  

Thank you. John Nicholson. 

John Nicholson [  Indiscernible ]. This is unusual  beach approach. It is like being  in a cavern. There is a 40 foot  wall on one side and a garage on  the other side. Very dark and damp and uninviting. I'm asking  you to think about something that  is unusual, something that is creative. When my mother was at Baptist Hospital  in Miami they had a parking garage.  They had the hospital. They put  a glass overhang and made a courtyard  out of it and put seating in all  kinds of things. I'm asking you  to come up with something unusual  and creative that can be used. A couple  of plants is not going to draw anybody  down that ramp. There is an apartment  complex across the street but other  than that nobody uses that ramp. There is got to be a reason to  use it and I ask you to be very  creative if you can think of something  out-of-the-box and see what you  can do with it. Thank you.  

Miss Wheeler.  

It says  the approach is not currently open  is a public vehicle beach ramp,  was it ever?  

Yes ma'am that it  has been quite a few years, probably  four or five years when basically -- that  was the last time it was used.  

Was is a lot?  

No. We have got  some pictures. This beach ramp is specific. What the gentleman said before  me that this is true in a statement, it is very much an  urban alleyway used for service  vehicles and delivery trucks, 18  wheelers. You can see this  was yesterday for garbage disposal staging during major events like bike weeks and  spring break. The  public has lost use of this ramp . To become a maintenance worker  staging area for the two adjacent  properties so it didn't have public  heavy usage because I don't believe  the public could use it.  We sustained a significant amount  of maintenance at this ramp because  if you look at it you can tell the  asphalt is in terrible condition due to the 18 wheelers trying  to get around in that area. Also a large amount of storm water  coming off A1A and the joint a properties.  That is creating erosion. When we get our April storms we have got to go  in quickly to make it safe again.  

So you think with phase 1 and  two that would take care of the  problems we have most of the time? Other than the extraordinary?  

One is purely function . Two is the amenities where we have the new concept that  was brought up about benches and  staging areas and landscaping in  trying to make it [ Indiscernible  ]. Phase 1 includes stormwater. Everything coming up is currently  going right onto our sand and preventing  dune growth and allowing the ocean  to come back in. Were  going to be required to put the  stormwater in [ Indiscernible ]  it will improve the park and approve our joining neighbors  property as well.  

So you're looking for direction  from us?  

Yes.  

 Mr. chair, can I move approval that  we approve both phase 1 and phase  two on this?  

Yes you can.  

Motion made by Wheeler and seconded by Denys . Any further discussion? Any objection to the motion? Hearing on the motion passes unanimously. Thank you Jessica.  >> Jessica, on this particular item, how many parking spaces are we  putting in?  >> 
     13 standard parking spaces and  one ADA compliant parking space. 

Very good, thank you.  >> You are back for 15, welcome back. 

My  name is Jessica and I'm the director  for Volusia County. On September  4th, 
     2018 the County Council reviewed  a conceptual parking lot layout  in doing walkover at the 16 Avenue at Smyrna Beach. Staff provided a disclaimer  that the layout may change based upon the  existing site conditions once the  survey was completed. Counsel provided  staff direction to proceed with  engineering and design. On October 2nd, 2018 County Council  approved a task assignment to coastal  check [ Indiscernible ] the survey is now completed and  the maximum  parking contained due to the existing  site conditions is representative on page 15-3 of your  agenda item. Alternative one includes 10 standard paved  parking spaces, one ADA compliant  parking space  and 80 accessible doing walkover,  a shower, bike rack,  dune restoration, landscaping and  a retaining wall. 
     It will be necessary to relocate  the northern property owners driveway  entrance to Hill Street to maximize  parking. Construction of  alternative number one is estimated at $475,000. Due to large cost of the project compared to  the numbers basis provided leadership  directed staff to look at other  alternatives to provide cost for  Council consideration. On page 15-4 of the  agenda item you can see alternative number two which includes  4-6 parking space, one ADA parking space, and ADA accessible doing walkover and restoration. Number two is  estimated at $230,000. On page  15-5 of the agenda item you can  see alternative number three which  includes a [ Indiscernible ] 
     construction of alternative number  is estimated at $130,000. Discussions have been ongoing with  the adjoining property owners or  legal representatives. Where looking for direction to  move forward with the final design  and permitting.  >> I think counsel we know why we  are here. Over year ago we started  discussing this  when we were looking to try to open every single available beach ramp  we could. When the issue came up before the  Council, we decided based upon Ms. Denys 's  insistence,  demand might be better that  we look at other alternatives and  delay this so that is why it  is back here. It is not something  that is happened overnight. It has  been on the books for discussion  for quite some time. I do have three  individuals who wish to speak. First  is Commissioner Jake Sachs from  new sermon to beach -new  Smyrna Beach.  

Thank you so much. To my esteemed counsel, this is a strange request because you did abandon the  last project and we greatly appreciate  that.  We fear the impact of the neighborhood  would have been absolutely dangerous  and very constraining as we do have  problems with traffic now. But if  I could be brief and read to you. This afternoon I would like to  request you build a beach walkover  without a parking lot at 16th and  Hill on beach side. The Avenue  section of A1A experiences some  of the most erratic, dangerous  disruptive behavior by driving beachgoers. Automobiles speed up and down  our roads looking for a place to  park. They threaten our peace and  quiet while endangering pedestrians,  bicyclists and other drivers. Increased visitation brings  noise, litter, rowdy behavior, crime  and pollution. The neighborhood  surrounding 16th Avenue will also  experience illegal parking when  the lot is full. Further endangering  young and old pedestrians  while these autos are scrambling  down A1A, Saxon and [ Indiscernible ] avenues to look  for parking spot. The creation of  a parking lot will have a devastating  effect on what little dune habitat  is remaining on our beach. Loss  of habitat will remove protections  from storm events and rising seas not to mention endangering animals that live in the littoral zone. I appreciate a new ADA walkover. Meanwhile eighth and ninth avenues were previously designated  handicapped ramps at one time. They  were both damaged by storms and  cannot currently be used by people  with disabilities. Option three is the best option  for local beachgoers. Your increasing  axis to the beach with the walkover. A  walkover will make local access  easier for those that live in this  neighborhood. Please do not cater  only to visitors and motoring daytrippers. We live here and absorb all the negative impact of the excessive volume of visitors. We do not need beach side turned into a parking lot  especially since this beach area is already on the beach where you  are allowed to park. Is simple walkover will ease access  for local pedestrians, bicyclists, 
     improve the quality of our lives  without the negative impact. The  residence on Hill Street, 16th Avenue  and surrounding neighbors should  not have further disruptions with  their ability to enjoy the riches [  Indiscernible ]  please save our county tax dollars and improve our way of life. We cannot create more  gridlock on the beach that may be become a traffic hazard for those  that live there. We do not mind  sharing a good thing but a parking  lot will endanger children that  live in the neighborhood and lower  their families property values. Please make the doing walkover  project into an asset, not a liability. Thank you. I want to think my Councilwoman Deb Denys  for helping create safety projects  for transportation and we hope to  continue that wonderful relationship.  

Thank you Commissioner. 
     Counselor's hours 

 >> James and I served on the Ormond  Beach to [ Indiscernible  ]  

Members of the Council, good  afternoon. James 's hours Ormond Beach on behalf of Ken and Diane Parker. This counsel in Volusia County  hasn't been tested work regarding  beach access and beach parking over the last  few years have made a commitment  to that. That is evidenced  by times where 
     Millsap and seminal with existing  beach approaches would be shut down  years ago with existing attendance  and they were closed down. That  I think those days are largely over  subject to title issues.  As has been said a couple times, one size does not fit all. This is a unique right-of-way area  half of which is an existing dune. There is about 15  feet of his extinct asphalt. The  plan you had in front of you back  in October I will point  out there were four of beach parking  plans. This was the only one that  was not engineered and had no concept  plan. It was no more  than an aerial planted on the site which showed about 20 to 30 feet  of existing vegetation. Alternative  1 removes all that. Today's the  first time in a public hearing where  you are seeing the real impact of  what this proposal would be. For that reason, I encourage you  to look at alternative two because  the first thing it does is it does  include some portion of parking, but it  maintains at least a portion of  that vegetation and that dune system. My clients are supportive  of alternative three as was mentioned to you earlier. The unique nature of Hill Street  which is an existing Sand Street might as well be one way. That separation  in a residential area from A1A makes  this very different from the [ Indiscernible ] project. That gap  and that Hill Street area  is going to create all sorts of  unintended consequences. You have reservoir areas where someone comes to this area and the spots are taken, what are they back up and go? Do  they go north or south or just get  out of their car? This is in a  residential neighborhood as opposed to an urban area. I would encourage you to look at  the cost, the cost for alternative one that  is upwards of $45,000 per space. I think you can bridge that  gap with alternative two if the  policy is we have to do parking. We don't think parking is necessary  in this area but if you  have to bridge the gap I would look  at alternative two and a way to  bridge the gap between six and 11 by doing designated parking spaces  markings at 12 Avenue which is a  designated crosswalk at A1A and  currently a parking area and is  much easier access and adjacent  to townhomes and condos. I think by putting in designated parking spaces every night meet  at the north side of 12 Avenue  I think you could add three to five  parking spaces. I have a picture of what it would look like on a  random day and there are gaps all  over the place.  I know my time is over. This is  12 Avenue. 
     You can see there are vehicles parked, there are no designated parking spaces. I think if you have  to go with parking which again are  push is for option three, but if  you have to go with parking we would  suggest alternative two it is the  cheaper option and you can bridge  in a gap with this.  

Thank you James. [ Indiscernible ] 
     >> I appreciate  the time. I appreciate the  Council's efforts to address the  axis to the beach. We do own a home at 2509 Hill Street which is  adjacent to the property. I drove  down with my son to be here with [ Indiscernible ] my  wife and I in my neighbors also provide option three that provides  access. I think it is the smallest  impact to the neighborhood. I believe  the environmental impact is the  least and easier to maintain for  the county and the city.  That is what we believe. In hearing  the plan discussions and not  putting words in Councilman Johnson's  name but I think option three aligns  with what I heard in that discussion and I think  about conservation in our county. I did want to  point out one or two things in the other options that didn't  appear at least from the options  we were given. That is if you can  visualize asphalt, I don't think  we need any more asphalt near the  beach. They don't show any topography and to give you some sense of that, the elevation difference from our  yard through that parking level  is 8 1/2 to nine feet. They didn't tell us how  tall the fence was but I'm going  to guess five or six feet  so we will have a 15 foot structure which  is about as high as most overpasses  you go down on the interstate which I think is not conducive  to what we are trying to create  at the beach. Number three is what  we support.  The other thing I want to mention  in my last minute , Hill Street, if you get outside your right away  I think you will notice Street is  not designed for that parking act  70. It is a one-way dirt road and every resident on that street  backs into the street to leave their  property. Backing into  additional traffic, the road  can handle the traffic now which  is the resident trash service, mail  service, you  get one car parked in the right-of-way you hear trucks beeping their horns  so we can only imagine what would happen if there is additional  traffic coming that direction. Justin  that block right there we have nine  children under  the age of 15 that live in that  intersection. For some odd reason personally I've had to go out  of that intersection and had to get people at the entrance  to the area trying to park cars. I don't know  if it is how the motor grader services  or how the big trucks turn but the  whole patch is sand and I've been  outer multiple times to make that  happen. I think the neighborhood  is not designed for more activity, not just local residents.  

Thank you Mr. Parker. Ms. Denys ? 
     >> Thank you Mr. chair. I  have several things here. First  of all, this isn't the first time  we have seen this. It has  been advertised for over a week  and I believe you and whom you  represent has seen this. We  didn't see it just for the first  time and we are  not using County tax dollars for  this. This is revenue from the beach  tolls. There is no general fund  dollars used on any of these beach  projects and in fact this has budgeted  and programmed for drivable access when we looked at it in the  budget so the dollars are there. It is not extra expense and the funds are readily available and programmed for this  particular project which ever way  it looks. Ms. Winter, can you talk about  the issue we have a erosion because  that has gone completely under the  radar. Part of this  the way it is designed is because  we do have any Russian problem and  that is what we have created. And  has been exacerbated by  the two properties on each side  of this and again this is not a  got you moment. I have a copy of  the new Smyrna Beach city minutes  where these permits were approved with full disclosure that this  was beach access and  where the right-of-way is existed so I want to be really clear this  is all public record and public  documents and not hidden to any  parties involved but Jessica, let's talk  about the erosion issue we have  which is why we did the switchback  in that walkway, is that my understanding? 

We had to do the  switchback to meet ADA compliance and meet our federal state permit  requirements for minimizing the  foot print. Your slope can [ Indiscernible ] we have a large elevation change. 
     What you have on the screen this  photos taken recently from the property  to the south recently constructed. The photos are really  bad, I apologize but  you can tell on the bottom corner  right about here, you can see where the water is  running off their property owners  concrete patio. He is starting to  have some undermining on the bottom  corner were eventually his concrete  slab will start cracking. It exacerbated a problem we previously  had from the existing asphalt  where the storm water was running  down, and I'm going to ask you to  change papers really quick to  erosion North Side . What  would just look at was up here.  You have your erosion and it comes  down and makes a trail and you can see how it hooks under  that vegetation the new have a giant  wheel there. previously we  had a little bit of erosion every  time it rained where it came down  the asphalt hill you see in the  back but now we are taking on additional  stormwater from the property to  the south and they  are not containing their stormwater  on-site. It has been  an issue. Anyone of  the three alternatives proposed  whether it is the full asphalt layout or the minor alternative three  we are going to recommend we do  stormwater in movements an alternative three where we use  the sand path on the walkover, we  are going to rip out the existing  asphalt out and plant it with native  Florida dune vegetation to help  with the absorption and that will also prevent the  runoff issues we are having from  our property.  We will have to find a way to resolve  the runoff issue coming from the  south property that just got constructed.  

How do we do that? What legal right do we have to  do that?  

 No right on their property. We can  only deal with gets to our property and that is what happens to  us often. The best engineered solution is  the main option one because we can  capture it and move it. We actually have dreams put in and that is how we  deal with it often in a residential  area. We can't go onto  their property and do anything  but we certainly end up with it  out in the public right-of-way and  that happens to us quite a bit.  

If you look and alternative  when we have storm inlets. When  one right there collecting to the  [ Indiscernible ] to infiltrate.  Our runoff production, we will have no runoff from the  site. We will go in and do erosion  repair. If we can reduce our runoff  the hope is the southern property  will not degrade significantly if we can put in good quality material  and vegetation.  

I  think that is a key indicator in  my decision and where I'm going  to go with this. At the same time I appreciate the pictures of the  parking up there. We live in a  beach town and it happens  on every road every weekend. The  concern about taking parking out  of the right-of-way, I agree with  you and this will help do that because  we would to find a parking space but even to a bigger picture than  that, this is another discussion that we can talk about and workshop, perhaps it is time we take a look  at all of our parking  and do a study on parking everywhere  we can. We have  the revenue and the beach  tolls in the budget to take a look  at that. With that being said this  particular item here, to maximize  parking we make it ADA compliant . We  reinforce and we stabilize the  erosion efforts. 
     It is the best compromise we have  had. Other than making it  drivable . Just open it and make it a beach  driving ramp because you are right, it is a busy  area. Out of  the five busy strands in Volusia  County,  four  of them are in new Smyrna Beach. We have an access issue. We have  a parking issue. Everybody wants  to go to new Smyrna. These are all issues. It is not a last minute I didn't know situation.  It is all publicly recorded and  in public he disclosed and in my opinion  this is the best option  for providing off beach parking  and allowing access in an area where  we were programmed for a beach ramp that thanks to my counsel  for listening to the citizens of  new Smyrna Beach which we did hit  the pause button, thank you for  that, and I would like to hear  what the rest of the counsel says. 

With that , I'm going to make a motion to recommend option number one 
     for the 16th Avenue off beach parking  lot in new Smyrna Beach.  

Is there a second? Is  there a second? I'm going  to second. Further discussion. Now I would like to use my time  to discuss it. If we did just  a walkover, you're talking about  traffic in the neighborhood. It  would be horrible. That was one  of the first complaints I have heard from anyone in new Smyrna Beach was they are parking all over  our yards and blocking our driveways. This solves that to  some degree.  We also listened and didn't do a  ramp because what was also determined , that is an area where  the ramp would have provided access that fills up at 10 o'clock anyway. According  to the records I received and according to first-hand exposure to that  area by our County manager, it was  their memorial weekend. Jessica  verified it fills up.  Most every area fills up. This  provides access even for the people  who live there that don't want the park there  but maybe they live far enough away  they went to go there and park.  It is not just for the nonresidents  you drive over for that parking  spot it can be for the locals . It also gives a walkover to those who do live close enough  that want access and provides more  than just  three or four spots for people to  park. Yes, it is expensive. There  will come a time there  will be no auto access to our beaches.  I don't know when. It is not in  my plan and something I'm looking  forward to because I have driven  on that beach since 1962. I've been a supporter of each axis  and beach driving. In 2031 or 2033 when the incidental take permit goes out,  you can bet the federal government is not going to allow us to have  that permit. It is going to go away.  This provides not only access for  people now but provides access for  those in the future and that is  why it is the best option we have . If you do just a walkover, what  are you doing? With two other areas which could be walkover is the people that are driving there  are going to park somewhere with  they shouldn't park, peoples yards. You going to come back  to us and say you should have.  We can now. That is my speech. Ms. Wheeler.  

Thank you Mr. chair. Here again there is one of  those circumstances that we get  thrown into because of some property and how the property on the south  side was developed. We have got  all these drainage problems. Apparently  the north side from what I read  in their built a driveway  they didn't have a permit for and  we have to move the driveway.  How did that happen? How  did they get that permit past  that they could put that in our  right-of-way? Now it is up to us  to correct? Let me ask you that one and then  I will finish my comments.  

I believe  that driveway was installed when  the original property was permitted. At that time I don't believe the  collaboration was there between  the county and the municipalities. 

So here we are so it's going to cost us and all  the citizens to correct the problem that wasn't ours. Consistently we get thrown the ball. I  listened to the gentleman back there 
     and I'm concerned about the traffic in the limited area. I know you're going to get it no  matter what because there is access  there. At this point,  unless I hear from the rest of the  counsel, I am kind of opposed to  number one because I  think that is the most invasive  for the environment and here we  are talking about environment and  preservation and that is cutting  out everything there is.  I would be for two or three, preserving as much as there is  around there. There is still plenty  of parking and sand parking . I would just to not leave such a large foot print but I really want to hear the rest  of my counsel.  

Mr. Johnson.  

They  said in field of dreams build it  and they will come. Somebody built  a notion and they came and is going  to be that way no matter what. I'm  a big believer in beach driving so I don't want anything taken  out of context but I'm like the  chair but I'm afraid someday we  could lose it and we better  be prepared to put our people somewhere  to park.  Once again I am for the beach driving but the only way you can correct  it is to push the condos into the  ocean. That  one won't work. We need desperately to be planning  for the future. I can understand  your issues about it but I have  been involved in law enforcement  since 1971 and we have dealt with  that beach in the parking  and people parking and peoples yards a people parking at the condo is  and on the highway and there is  a lack of parking and we have to  do something about it even if it  is in increments. We have got to do something to  make sure we have the future of  this open for people. That is  one of the big draws in this county and as it stands right now I would  say probably heal Street North  up to Flagler Avenue if we ever  lost beach driving it would be very  limited places. Basically you have  just made a private beach and we  don't want that. I can understand your issues about  not wanting it in your backyard  but for the good of the public I'm  going to have to go with it. The one with the paved parking  lots. Option one.  

Miss Girtman?  

I like new Smyrna Beach. One of the reasons I like to  go there is because it is such a  natural environment. I  know we do need parking but to me  option two especially because it  is in a residential area, it is better with the environment and I guess the aesthetics of the  area, the natural  border and natural area and I think  that matters  we maintain and conserve as much  of that as we do. My  option would be option two. Thank  you.  

Miss post? 

We are all over the place. I really sort of mimic  Councilwoman Girtman's  viewpoint of the beach and keeping the dunes and the beauty of the beach and keeping  as much vegetation there is possible and keeping it as natural as possible. I am listened to the people who  have spoken today and everyone I have heard from the public  speaking today as asked for option  three and those are the people actually  living in the neighborhood so I'm  hearing that as well.  I'm also looking at the difference  between options one and three that is $345,000 . I am all for additional  beach parking but saving everything isn't always a solution. I would actually ask  for approval of alternative three since you did give us three options said that obviously is a viable  option for that area  but if we don't have enough votes  for three, I  would ask we vote for two.  >> Just one quick point. To me, being  able to handle the runoff going  from the area  is as much of an environmental correction  as you can get because you have  the runoff now as it exists. The erosion that is there is caused  by the wall of the north side. It  is not going to go away by leaving any of the  other options. Option one is the  only one that is going to correct  the erosion in the erosion is going  to continue and we  will eventually have to go back  and do something to fix that.  

If I may before you vote and  to make this a little relative , if we go with option two  I want the expectation to be there  that should we get the storms that  we had this past weekend, if we put option two in that you  may have a ponding situation. Like we have it  17th and 24 the new Smyrna and along  the side of A1A [ Indiscernible  ] when you don't your  stormwater infrastructure in there, you get the day louche of stormwater,  it is going to pond unless we allow  it to run off. You may have a fairly large puddle  in your parking lot. I just want  you to be prepared for feedback  you might get because I get  constant feedback throughout the  county.  

Let me  weigh in a little bit as well. Two  things have been said. One about the beach parking going  away and the driving at some point. If it goes away on the  high tide, one of the things 
     when that occurs on this days is  when the place is packed. What happens  is you have people running around looking for off beach parking 
     and this is adding parking to the  mix. It is served on  the beach but you have  a lot of times where you  can't get down on the beach because  of the tide and or because it is  full. This gives you that option for  those who made the trip all the  way over that are now searching  for somewhere to park and it gives  them legitimate parking and allows  parking to be enforced because  you have parking there. I don't  think the turnover once people get  there, you have 10 or 11 spots in  the going to get there and stay  there for hours and maybe several  will turnover so I  don't see it as a big traffic jam. I put option one backup there. Again we are trying to  do a conceptual picture and that  is hard to do and hard  to see what it is going to be but Jessica, on this northern edge here it is showing the vegetation is all gone. What type of vegetation  is there and what kind  of canopy are we talking about?  With some of this be canopy to back  over to a certain point or working  under some of that? . This picture is a little deceiving  and it may look like that. And at worst case right after  they are done. Usually these things [  Indiscernible ] over. You have some rather established  palmettos or cabbage palms in this  area of the driveway kind  of wiggles through. Once you get  past the front corner of the house  you get down to your standard palmetto grub vegetation. 
     I will put up some additional photos  so you can see what you are looking  at. The gentleman who owns the property  to the north is correct in his statement there is a large elevation change. What you are seeing is just your  regular palmetto brush. You have got the major  palm trees which is right around  with the driveway wiggles. You don't have a canopy they are  taking out with the exception of  those palm trees. You're looking  at a four foot elevation from the  property line. 20 is  your highest and then it goes down to 15 on the edge of  the payment. You've got a big doing  in their and that is why  we were looking at the retaining  wall on option one to help with  retaining the soil. A privacy fence on top of the retaining  wall because they knew they would  be looking down into it then we  also have visitation. We haven't  had a tortoise survey yet.  That looks like prime habitat but those are issues we worked  environmentally. 

Is there no way to do number  three and still allow  for some type of drainage response to that wall on the corner in any  way shape or form?  

We can do option three. The reason why option three  is rather extensive is because we are planning  on ripping up the asphalt you see  that goes to about their and what  you take the asphalt out when it  rains you will start to have infiltration  and it will go into the sand. When we talked about the sand parking  lot it will take a while for it  to get there so we would have to  do some creative grading of that  sand soil probably to the north  of the walkway where the vegetation  is at and we will have  to build out the ease out a little  bit with the good materials to create  an invitation  [ Indiscernible ]. Your runoff if you don't capture  and maintain it is going to be hard  to fight. We have got something  similar at 22nd Street. 24th Street is basically and  annexed parking lot. 17 is residential  only and we have got grass on those  and it just sits there. 

With his great engineering mines  you we should be able to provides Dohrmann often some weight and  keep the natural environment.  

 Yes, typically what we would say  in normal situations extend the  water to the right-of-way where  you have an existing stormwater  system. He is city is the  Sandy Road and runs Morris out. 16th between hill and Atlantic , you  see the grade change as a goes up  that peak. It starts running east. Our topography on the beach  doesn't necessarily go rest. It  will go met capturing the runoff each of the  primary doing line we are worried  about. The runoff on the property  to the south you can see on this  concept, the patio extends where  the primary doing is and you are  already into the area where you  are cranking down on the elevation because they are coming straight  off the concrete into sand. It is  moving the sand particle. There  is nothing to slow it down.  

 So what we are saying is three is  not really a viable option.  

Three is maintenance, two is  more maintenance, one is asphalt but it is steady parking and collects stormwater and prevents  erosion. There is no win  if you look at the erosion and the  runoff and the natural beauty. Asphalt  is not pretty. 
     >> Deb ?  

Thank you Mr. chair. I'm listening  to all of this  and were back to answering the questions  long-term as number one. We create the most parking spots and we have the ability to  put in reinforcement  to protect the dunes and  that is this  is off beach parking and that is  our goal. 
     Every parking lot we have put in says I don't want more asphalt. Have you ever helped design it  off beach parking lot anywhere it is a necessary evil but as part  of the process in the next one we do is off-site or whatever  will involve concrete and it is  either that or the cars will go in the right-of-way,  and they will, and they will get  stuck in the soft sand. When somebody  referred to vehicles getting stuck  in the soft sand, with this fix  that?  

No.  

Further down to Atlantic, is  that the issue?  

I believe it is the  intersection of Hill Street and  16th. 
     Once you start turning your tires  on sand you eat it up and it gets  lost. The majority of  the intersections.  

Is that  hours or the cities. I  think we try to work with them.  

We were when  we were discussing a ramp.  

[ Indiscernible ] that didn't  work. When I  talk about compromise happening  there has been a lot of compromise from the county with the citizens to get to this point. We are trying to be  good stewards and this does everything  we should be doing with off  beach parking and restoring the  dunes and creating access  and not making a beach ramp.  

And not impacting  the residence. 

Again I want clarification. I  just heard you tell  Ms. Post number three was an  option but two was more costly  to maintain. Can we not do anything the drainage  and that? To me  that sounds like a compromise with  having some parking but also  still creating the  environment we all went to maintain.  

This is alternative two on  the screen. You have a pretty significant  ridge about right there that runs down. You are high on this side and low  on that side.  You are running that way with your  drainage and this one is going that  way. If we do this when you see  the proposed sand you will still  impact some of that palmetto vegetation  we had earlier but what you are most likely going  to end up with is that will be  a lake. I can build that up and  put more material like I do it Oceanview  once or twice a year and 24th once  or twice a year like the state that  is when they do A1A. That we will probably  drop three truckloads and make it  flat in in the next year  it will compress down and go back  there unless you have your way [  Indiscernible ]  your storm water will just infiltrate  naturally. If we want to treat it  I have to put a great in their.  If it falls into it we have the  shelf falling into it which also  becomes a different type of maintenance. 

Just following up a little bit. You are saying several truckloads. Were talking costly maintenance  when you have several truckloads.  

Four to  5000 a year per location and that  is using road and bridge that are  in-house. They  are not as expensive as the private  guys.  

I think we are  ready to vote. All in favor of  supporting the alternative one that  is presented by Jessica, say aye . All oppose say no. I  think I had 4-3.  >> Do you want to do a  voice vote?  

[ Captioners Transitioning ]  >> 

Mister Johnson, myself, Mister  Lowery has yeses.  The other three were no. I don't  think [Indiscernible]. Amendment passes 43. Thank you and all the staff are  working at this. It's a good compromise. It answers all the questions put out there protecting the environment  more than anything else and providing  access. The point was made. When  you can't go to the beach it's a desirable place to go. Even as you mentioned times. Will now move  on to item 16. 

Good afternoon. Community information  director. We have one new event added to the  list since the last Council meeting.  That is the naming ceremony for  the Edwin Senior Park. Volusia County  will hold that naming County at  10 AM  at the sure pavilion. 
     The senior Park will be constructed  at 3167 S. Atlantic Avenue in the  shores. The actual construction  will begin next year and the date  of June 21st for the naming ceremony  was chosen because it will also  be the 100 first birthday 
     of and would pack senior. We also  want to give you a reminder about  the hurricane exit this Saturday,  June eight at the Volusia County  Fairgrounds. More than 50 exhibitors  will be inside at the fairground  in air-conditioning. There also  be a number of safety vehicles on  display outside. About 20 County  divisions and governmental agencies  will be at the event. Again, it's  free, 10 AM to 2 PM. It includes refreshments, safety demonstrations,  and speakers. New speech will be webcasting live from 10 AM  to noon. There will be a lot of  giveaways, throughout the event  and other safety related goodies. Any other good questions? 

Thank you very much. We now move  to the afternoon public participation.  John Nicholson. 

John Nicholson 413 Nichol Avenue. I will want to remember the song, I think  it's Jimmy Buffett about paradise and putting in a parking  lot. If you look at that picture  you are now bulldozing 60 percent of  the dunes to put in a parking lot 
     and if you've been to some your  the beach it's equate town. You  will lose that.  What I came up for is I want to  thank you and remind you what you've  done with the city  in ridding us of the homeless and  the panhandlers. We are down to  one panhandler on the beach. I would ask you for the beat each patrol to staff the stuff  under the steps. You leave and you'll be  down to zero. Do a  fantastic job.  Thank you. Secondly, with regard to the  bathrooms part of it is  the cleanup. I was informed that  the plants just planned they painted  them all. It was really ugly. She painted. It's  really nice. Most of them  are still in. She tried. There's a little bit of hitch in  that regard. Lastly, with regard  to the homeless shelter that's going  in, it will go in.  I passed by on the way here. I know you're not happy with  the city. That shelter will go up. I will have a  certificate of occupancy in October come hack or high water. Have a  good day.  

Thank you. Were getting to that part of  the tunnel I'm happy to see. George?  

Thank you. Just a couple things. First off , I want to get an update on implementation of the  amendment 10. We talked about  this lately. We are still moving ahead. I have established  a working group of 10 staff members. We go through the various  departments affected. It's Tammy Vuong, Ryan  S Oski. George Baker, Tom Moats Charles Spencer, Charles Hargrove. 
     They are working on the various  issues that we have to go through. We have a weekly meeting. I have met with the sheriff on  several occasions.  So has members of that committee.  That was at the sheriff staff. I have not talked to  Miss Lewis formally talk to her  informally. It's the  tax collector office.  It's our steering committee. There's a counties in the relationship  and their constitutional officers. You trying to identify each of  those areas. We will  meet with the officers as we get more information together. I would think  the summer is a concrete assessment of  the issues. We phone cities before our organization. We have  taken on organizations.  And of course we move the medical examiner  into a different type of model we will continue to address each  of the areas. We've identified all the buildings  and leases that need to be addressed.  We've identified all the contracts,  reach offices that need to be addressed. It's association. Were in that process. I know we haven't talked much about  it but I want to sure everyone there's  a lot of work ongoing. There will be challenges. There  will be financial challenges as we look  into these things. As I said before  you have insurance that can be changing. The idea that people are leaving  our organization and going to another  organization. What does that mean in terms of their retirement or their leave  time. Things of that nature is all  being addressed. That's what I want  to say about the transition. I do want  to give a little bit of good news. Carlson it come up and bring Keith Lauren  and Heather trooper just started  with them. I  would like them to go over a little  bit of good news. 

Thank you. Aviation reckoned  no resources. There's a project that's been around  for a while and it just got legs. Jumping out the window. It's gonna become public sooner  or later. 

Great. Thank you for allowing  me to update the commission with  Heather. Were excited that not only this project is  in aerospace and aviation but  we have several more in the pipeline  taking legs.  It's still  decided they haven't  sign the lease. They  are here project Lander you seen it on  some of our pipeline report's  it's tied to a NASA contract. It's in the space field. It's destination hardware. It's where we see ourselves having a great chance as we build on what's going on  in the port. Now I'm going to let Heather  talk to about the project. Were  delighted to have Heather here and the team is working on it collaboratively  with Andy Riddle. 

Speak into  the microphone.  >> 
     [Indiscernible] face Florida, enterprise  Florida, the county and team Volusia. It's all the news  to be recorded.  

 They may have decided a certain  part of the county I can assure  you I was involved along  with the team members research is  all over the county. West Volusia,  Southeast Volusia, and the county. It's a great project. Heather? 

We have  been working on a number of these projects are fantastic.  My six week. That's fantastic. This project is searched all over the county and we hope it's 50 high-paying  jobs over the county and do some fantastic things. More  to come on that. 

Rick, I think it be more appropriate  to say this project getting wings instead of  a set of legs. That's what I would've  said. I'm more the marketing scheme. 

Thank you and we look forward  to the total announcement. This  is important. 
     This is gonna be one of the  future deals that we can take a leadership position  in as a county and attracted high-paying  jobs which will provide better jobs and it will also be  a part of us trying to help in the  affordable housing as well and bring  in the paint jobs. 

I just want to congratulate the  county on having the wherewithal  to do the price study. We really appreciate that. This will also give legs to the  price study because this will be  an example. Were in television.  Wings to the brace study because this is the first of several announcements which will give  us credibility. >> Last Friday they attended. 
     It's run by veterans for veterans. The main thing other than being  a member of the national Association  of veterans and committee and being  very involved in that sector I wanted  to point out the collaboration that  was involved  in bringing the center to fruition. We had Denny Burgess  that's the new executive director of the  veterans administration was there. Rick Scott's representation, Mike  waltz was there. Senator Tom right. Elizabeth better half.  A lot of good representation and the wonderful thing was the  collaboration between the business  sector and elected officials in really focusing on veterans  and getting this off the ground.  Wonderful event last Friday. And certainly not less  I will hear from them and the momentum  in this area.  The second thing is I attended the  TPO board meeting a couple  weeks ago and was not notified that an alternate was needed. I just wanted to ensure does talk to staff  about that. Whatever the process  is there if we as a counsel if none  of us are there then if  we can notify myself or been your  the other alternate. Okay. If  we can work collectively  because we have the two alternates. It was a little embarrassing. I was there to give a summary report  for the TDL see committee and are sitting in the public session for two hours until I realized.  

Blame  that on been. He did make  a mistake. I had address  that procedure  a month ago we the situation >> 

I just want  to make sure were on the same page. Real estate. A lot  of people have heard about  girls state which is the program where a lot of our high school  girls are being a part of the political  process in Tallahassee. They have to  interview elected officials. Many  members of this council have been  interviewed by participants in the  past. Get ready to head out this  week. We did a couple interviews  there. Good luck. Enjoy and I hope that they take it manager every  opportunity they're being given. Studies  let's day is the 14th which means that it's her last council meeting  with us. I wanted to make sure we  noted that. I don't know if anyone else would  like to say anything at this point.  

I think she's coming back on  the 18th. 

I think she's out here. Ready.  Thank you for your service. 

Good for you  Betty. 

The last thing I had is 
     the practitioners I talked with  Nick Conti is the head of that. I would like to have him  come in and do a presentation  -- a public presentation what they're doing  with her focus is from the city  side. Our discussion with collaborating  and working with the city's from  here on out and especially the economic development side.  We need to be doing that. He has  asked come present the counsel and gave a good overview of  what they're doing and what their  focus is there working with our county side  as well. I would like  to get everyone on the same page. If we can get him on agenda that  would be wonderful. 

I'm not opposed to it. We have 13 or 14 other  economic developments. I don't know  that we need to hear from each one  of them.  

It's representative.  He's the head of all of them. He's  the head of their collective groups. The city practitioners meeting is a group of all the economic  developments. It's the  economic department. 

Will start with Rick  can put it together and after that I don't see a problem.  Let's do that. 

I have several things.  First of all,  how's it look on the internal auditor? 

I have  interviews scheduled. Hopefully I'll have someone here spread out over the next  two weeks. It's hard to get them  all here. I just want to keep that up no.  It's not for my mind.  

I'm sure it is. I've had several phone calls on  the Russian project on each side. The two buildings a construction. The north building  has come to a halt. I just got notice they had not even talk to staff  yet. Already been questioning staff  to follow up on it. My problem is that  in the agreement with the county they were to have access  on the north  and of the building during construction. That was part of the deal. That shut down when Daytona  said no they can't leave it open because of all the cranes and everything. My question was how can we can  have scaffolding under the sidewalk  and people going underneath fit with construction overhead.  What can we do that on the north  end. The conversation been going  on for quite some time and I pushed  it this weekend and then I got a  notice from a city resident that  said they spoke with the city and  the building officer  said that  he notified the company  they need to open access. I have asked staff to follow through  with that. Staff did not know anything  about it.  It's important message our staff is going to look  on that. Which brings me to my next  thing. I would like to know in the shores there was access area  where they were going to develop  in and they were to build a  parking area with a little park. They had to do  the park first. The people were  confirmed access.  Van Avenue is a perfect example  of that.  The construction fell through at  this point for the building. The  citizens still have access. We can make that a part of our  proposal. It's our project. We've given up that access. Build the deck on  park first. I would like to counsel them. It was in the Van  Avenue agreement. It was wonderful. These that park all the time. There's nothing else developed. It worked well. Why are we not doing that. 

Each project is individual and counsel ultimately approves  them.  Some developers book and so ultimately it's counsel's  decision. I don't disagree with  you. 

I like have a up for  discussion more. We had this happen  too many times where they follow  through and we given up that right.  Of having that access. 

Let's have a discussion on it. 

I'm not willing to accept are  things that as gospel truth.  

I agree with that but I would  like to have session on it. I have  another thing. To good news things. Couple weeks ago I got the bronchial  stuff. I'm the tell all the CIGNA  people  are employees I have  the insurance. And this happen on  a Saturday. They have two things on  the site. It's  MD live.  I made the call. I had  a doctor looking it me in the face. He pull  out my records that see taken previously to call into the pharmacy and within  15 minutes I never left my living  room couch. I had my prescription. A savings  for everyone they're not using urgent  care I wouldn't have gotten  it and. It would've been seriously ill  or I would've gone to urgent care. Get onto the site. It was a life saving of that. It  took it affects. I'm excited  about that. It's from Palm Philip. Thank you  for bringing that to may. And  thank you to the staff for working  with me are in a more control. For all  the work they put in. It's a  would plan. 
     I've been talking to other counties  on this. I  had stuff to proposal because the  Association of Counties were asking things the  county has done that you  could get a best practice award. I was just notified that we  see at the conference best practice  award for 2019 on  our animal abuse database. 
     Now my final comment and I'll make  this short.  I'm concerned about this.  On December 14th 2008 team  the trustees of the internal trust fund approved the request  and the city of Daytona Beach for  the release of mineral and petroleum  light and restricting the use of  land used for public purpose. The city's request included land  owned by the County of Volusia.  The county did not give the city  authority to petition on its behalf  and the trustees have provided a  quick climb by the county. It's release to the city to impair  the county ownership. They request  attorney to ownership of all property on what is known for city Island and to only provide a release  to the city for property it owns.  Here's another fact. We get all  the heck raised through us. We do  know anything about it.  We have our claims on the property. I don't know if we need to instigate  a letter. 

We notified the city  of this. 

 We would not be notifying the city  to the trustees. They voted in December.  Counsel, I would like the city to  release those right on County land to the  city.  

Counsel, I would like to give  our manager the go ahead and have  legal draw this up from counsel. I think this is  something they should not have done.  They overstep the boundaries. We  need to have a say on it. 

I'm curious to know who the trustees  are. 

The trustees for the internal  improvement are the governor and  cabinet. They hold  all rights to state leads an interest  in land. On city Island it has language in it that says it must  be used for public  purpose. It also retains mineral  rights on some of city island to  the trustees.  The city of Daytona Beach made a  petition for all of the land including  city island library and the courthouse which the county has owned since  1963. The trustees for whatever  reason were not aware of the county's  ownership which I do  not understand. 

Their counsel didn't know this  was going on.  

The  difference is the county owns the  land under the courthouse and the  parking lot. 

Yes sir.  >> It's not under the reverter clause.  

The trustees did  issue a quick claim back in 1963. 
     The land under the courthouse. We  had the information for whatever  reason the trustees did not the trustee staff did not uncover  the information when they were working  with the city. We would very  much like to present that information to the division of state lines,  EEP, the trustees for the internal  provement to advise them that's  County property. Not city property.  

That's what I said. 

They did not  find the information for whatever  reason.  

But we do control that. The other property is not owned  by Daytona.  

The rest of city island is owned by the city of Daytona. With reverter  instructor language. 

We need to set them straight.  Not Daytona.  

 Correct. The  state now --  

They need to be put on notice  that they did not get that from  Daytona. Daytona didn't have it. 

In 1963  county attorney Charlie Luther travel  to Tallahassee with the city of Daytona Beach  and petition the trustees to give  the county that portion  of city island that is the  courthouse property. The trustees granted the  city authority to cut that piece  off and the trustees gave the county another piece of property to  square off what we  call our courthouse property. We have own that since 1963. The  county position for release of the  reverter. 

What I would suggest is you Dan  or legal send it with a copy to  us as a counsel so were  all on record to the fact of what  they did. When that be the legal  process?  

That's acceptable. We want to do anything without  counsel's knowledge and understanding  of what we were doing.  

If we would have the information we would've been done in Susan  we found out.  

They did in December  before the change of guard. Is that  what happened? 

December 18th I believe.  >> That just needs to be corrected.  I'm sure can be corrected without  too many. Is that it? 

 They were a great  group of young girls. They have  good questions. I was impressed  with them. Good luck girls.  

We will move to miss Denny's. Of save the last I can skip that  one. There's eight things on it. 

First of all, use this manager to save me. The  first item bullet was on amendment  10 transition. Are you gonna be  bringing that back for presentation  to counsel. 

I will let you  know informally where were at and  I'll bring back more of  a report.  >> Here's an issue I've had several people in the  area ask me what were gonna do and  can we help improve the intersection in for 15. It's amazing we haven't had more  incidents there. We do a  traffic study? I don't know we have  to do that.  

It's deftly  a tricky intersection. With the  deep ditches on three sides  and a business that's moving right  up against the road. We  will take a look at that.  >> That would be great. Also, this  past weekend we knew this was coming.  We have flash mobs every once in  a while and staff does a good job.  Jessica and her  beach patrol was ready.  There's a deep invasion from  the Orlando area. They were very  friendly. Their  slogan was tread lightly. We follow  them on social media to see what the interest was and  the non-interest and what they were  bringing to the beach. It was a  very good event. Nobody heard about  it. It didn't make the news.  We couldn't find any negative. 
     The NSP Jeep invasion was a very  successful  event we welcome them to tread lightly  anytime on our beaches under great  group. Another successful each thing  nobody knew about. Also  last week I was honored from  Congressman well and Congressman  Mike at the transportation infrastructure Roundtable that Daytona  Beach hosted. Thank you to Daytona Beach airport and  our staff  that hosted this on the Congressman's  behalf. They got official thank  you at that event but they went  above and beyond. It was  the brain trust in their. It took  my breath away.  Is pretty impressive. We had everyone  from blue or Jane FAA U.S. D.O.T., the Florida D.O.T.,  NASA, Senator right, Fedor half, and it just went our steamed manager was there. It was good. Here's what was intriguing and  John Booker was there.  All about John. Here's the intriguing thing about  the dialogue in that room. Here's what Congressman Walt said. We have to address the transportation  issues. Are so glad to hear this. You can't build  the roads fast enough. We have the  time on the finances even if  the [Indiscernible] passes we don't  have the time quick enough to build  the demands. What we do have this  work smarter with the intelligent  transportation systems  and I didn't know that's where they  were going. I was there and presented  NPL in our TPL the two systems just approved from our transportation planning State Road 421 from 10 lot and was the 95 all the  way out  to a one and state 144 west of 95  all the way down to it manic. The  systems when in at 1.6 million each  or not is next. The frustrating  thing for that man is the program that in  2016. This is 2019. Technology changes  between the time, the generations  we program and  what should be implemented in 2019. Kurtzman talked about that. Secretary  feeble said for congestion we have  to leverage the technology and streamline  the processes it was an honor to  be there. It's the first of many that Congressman Walt  is gonna have in this district and  it's an exciting time for all of  us. The other piece of that  man, I met yesterday. I don't know if this was what team  pollution was and talk about. I  did have a meeting yesterday which  had Hegel from space where. They're  looking on ISV to take over all the open commercial buildings  on ISV and turn that into a space Michael Plex  for aviation and aerospace and private  investors. It's really full of possibility. It's all  coming together. I don't know exactly when that  will be rolled out or when contracts  will be in. I met with Jim Cameron. He  helped facilitate that one. That's  exciting news.  Transportation dollars and  the TPL , go back to F..  This conversation to continue because  it's troubling because dollars are so precious. At the last NPL alliance meeting Deltona Commissioner is on that board representing  Volusia County. F.said  to the whole room, these are 10  counties sitting there, to D.O.T.  districts said  that we were leaving trip dollars  on the table. Did you know that? I saw executive directors TPL I'd share the organization and  she looked at me and I said  what are we leaving at the table? Trip dollars our transportation  regional incentive program dollars that we use to  subsidize regional transportation  areas which is the County projects. 
     Everybody in that room. What you  mean were leaving trip dollars on  the table. After that conversation and meeting the executive directors of  the TPL and the electives that were  there were saying oh my gosh,  what are we doing. How  do we get these projects listed. And put a letter out to  the secretary and to our district  secretary Mike Shannon under my  signature is  chosen central Florida NPL asking  for the count of the trip dollars  how much is left and what we have  to do to access them and look at  this particular budget and will  take that concern Doctor executive  committee of the TPL tomorrow. I don't know what that means. We were chastised. That's  the first. 

Especially we know it's the trip  dollars. What we've been told is they are  not available and there being used  up down in the  Orlando area. There were sweeping  accounts and having to put  money into those areas. We as a county have received millions  of dollars in funds. It's one of the  ways we transportation money we  have leveraged. That's  part of it.  You have to leverage.  He was referring to. Our recent communication  wasn't much left. We would deftly be interested  to hear what they have to say. Maybe  something's changed. 

We're gonna make the inquiry.  Take that back to the TPL and bring  everyone into this question. I like to take  a look at again I'm still receiving  correspondence. That's the big red barn venue. That issue. Agri-tourism.  I'm concerned that in a challenge will lose this  one. 

I have to tell you.  This gentleman misreads the law, he misreads the  case filed in number County. We  are relying purely on state statute. There is an exception that allows  us to to regulate facilities that are open for the public to use. We mere that in our ordinance and I understand he continues to object. I do not believe are going to lose.  I read the case filed. I am confident we are falling state law to the  letter.  

Thank you. I  just had to share my concern of  what's being communicated and stated 
     and where there's a belief that we could be vulnerable. Thank  you for that. My last one we can consider legislative meeting with a coffee before meeting. There's something about we take  a break in the middle doing something  we go down there and every spare  we go in and work out at least may. I'd like to start the  day off and probably they would  with their busy schedule.  Counsel we could start a coffee  in the morning at 830. Done in the training room. 
     Then delay half an hour coming into  this.  

See if you can get  them all to come for the meeting  on the 18th. Will do that one first.  If not will do as soon as we  can after. 

If  I could just bring up one more thing  I neglected to bring this up. I  did get a call from one of  my cities  on Sunday they lost one of their  attendance.  Was only in late 50s. There are going through a time  of loss and grief. Our hearts and  prayers go out. 

 Thank you chair. Will make this  easy.  Councilman post brought up  Miss Betty. That was top my list  to acknowledge her. I know being  new Councilman woman you believe  for me.  I just want everyone to know that  and put it out on the record. One of the things she's been instrumental  in helping me with. I've met with  at least 10 to 12 of our departments and staff. Whether it was  public safety, the ocean center,  community services and I'm really  proud of the staff and they say they're just happy to have one  of the councils spending time seeing  what they do and  just getting for me a real good  picture of the services we offer  throughout the county. I want to  thank Miss Betty but  also the staff and the department. I was  one of the ones that brought up  the conversation about the workshop. I know we have them coming up on  the in 18th. And get insight into the topics we discussed. We can make the best use of  that time. I'm not sure how want  to go about that. If each one of  us or bring an issue. The staffing bring the top for  major concerns. I think it's important we have that dialogue come up  with how are we doing this workshop since there will be a facilitator. 

I think  each of us needs to be able to provide  at that meeting concerns for things we would like to discuss.  If not at that time and further  time. Whenever we will discuss every  issue. It's  consistence from the issues we have  and how much more detail discussion  we want to have. I'm  just saying. Based upon what I've  done before we would do that. It's kind of like  without the facilitator. We can discuss it. When they get issues that  people offer that day  into a greater understanding of the issues we  bring forth in workshop can be brought  back for discussion vote. We don't vote on the issues  we have in a workshop. Or fact. Vote on funding. We need to advertise what they  are and the criteria for them  before we vote. Anything that was  involved or anything like that can be rolled back for an agenda  anyway. If you have any thoughts 

Again,  since we're preparing for this in  two weeks on have a better understanding.  

We can't submit to them and have  them pick are items.  We can't do that. We need to present those in an  open form. One city got their hands wrapped  for trying to have a manager selectively choose  which ones to discuss. Let's prepare  items. Staff have a list of items  to discuss. 

It's your workshop. I  will have some things. They will overlap I think.  

The purpose is for us to express  where we want to see things go that  hasn't been brought up.  

We have a short period. The more we can think through it  and identify if or bring one or  two issues to the table or are we going based on our  last conversation and taking some  the high points from their. We need  to consider that so were ready  to roll and know  how to prepare for the next two  weeks.  >> Items we feel need to be worked  as first workshops in more detailed  settings we can bring them out to  be workshop in  a discussion from the Council on  the agenda which might be the better  way to move forward. Try to pick a  fictitious issue. 

We talked about smart growth.  Is that something that in a two-week  workshop that we would  be prepared to have a discussion  for. 

Debbie one we need  to wait get the feedback. We can  certainly share our views but we want to get new issues and  new ideas or new things. This is  something we both said the first  or second meeting we need to have  issues brought forth that we may  have. You can have 10 or 15  issues or ideas that you want to  have discussed if we can get enough consensus  to have them brought forth to further  discussion or even spending time. We don't have that  much time. We are limiting ourselves.  I prefer an all-day meeting. >> Could we provide storage or staff with ideas. That's not a violation for him to collect and disseminate. Just so everyone 

The city was called on it  because that.  

I was at a violation were not  discussing anything.  

They selectively determine. 

No selection. Just gathering.  We submit.  At least going and we all have an  idea of what is can be going on in the meeting. 

Each one of us submit our top  three concerns. If you don't want to list  to's name provides what issue we  have to do that either.  

There was an issue where one  city had the  items given  -- we can do it publicly. But  received and remembers that. 

No sir. I don't. I think you could list your  top item and give it to the manager and he can have it available with the county for distribution. You can disseminated. It's one-way  communication. 

Will call Barbara Peterson to  make sure she understands. 

I'm not suggesting  you interact.  

Okay. If  we all want to submit items for  them to discuss and have on the  board or have somewhere.  

Just your top three concerns. 

That's  it. Thank you. 

We have a claim I didn't  know about if we get charged. I didn't say what I just said.  Mister Johnson? 

I have a couple things. I do phone call today that  was referenced at quest. We might think  about this. Frank was involved with  all of our [Indiscernible]. He escorted them out. He dove on  them to make sure they were proper. It's  apprehends. They put  a plaque down on and them anyway. It's Frank Schofield brief. Just  something because he was involved  in that heavily. This is been brought up to me. ATVs and the wildlife refuge. It's one percent of the  property is used for ATVs. Volusia County we have  nowhere people can run ATVs. To big business and Volusia County. I know for one I manage a large piece  of property.  It's ATVs because they don't have  anywhere to do it. What  they're looking for is a letter  of support. To the state on one percent of the land. We would support  them to do that. The state would  pick up the properties. They would  also be able to bring in more towards  them. There several places that  doesn't you have room for the a question. There's no reason you can't make room for the ATV  to also use it out there. You have  the game department that is able to monitor. The sheriffs  department and the for service.  The majority of the people that  use it use it correctly. Some may  can go in there were they're not  supposed you. That's a law enforcement  issue at that time. I truly believe this is well worth  us supporting for the good of our  county. 

Counsel has brought that forth  as an item. We've had conversations. The city of Daytona has  done. They offered a resolution. Taking off the  tax rules. We have to vote on it. Can we just  agree. 

Before we sign off on it.  >>, I read you a rough thing. Allow the  operation of street legal vehicle  such as Jeeps, sport-utility vehicles,  trucks into track interior roads  for recreational purposes, dedication  of up to 10 percent of exclusive  use  it's the motorcycle area in the 2G state forest in Brooksville. Pretty straightforward. >> Mister Chairman a supported. It's on  the agenda were all in. 

My only question is I'm not familiar with Brooksville .  

That's a state status. Before they allow. 

They already allow the ATM. Okay. 

We just thing  we supported. 

We're down now to --  

I picked about data more than  one thing. On a personal note  I'm down to one daughter. After  the wedding she has decided she's  gonna look. I had two interviews. The group today during lunch. That's  one reason I can go to lunch. They  want to ask me some questions. It  was really cool. Good  luck to them and the days ahead.  Also the state allows -- make sure I get  this right. Restaurant to have outside  seating to allow animals to be there.  Docs for instance. In my area we  have such a restaurant and address legal if they  look into writing as an ordinance that would  go long and so forth. My constituents  have asked me to approach that.  You may need cleanup . I may have muddied it.  

State Lao allows local jurisdictions to adopt by ordinance  the rules and regulations by which  you can bring a dog to outdoor seating  areas in restaurants. Each jurisdiction  gets to make their decision. They asked us to look into it and we've reviewed some the other ordinances that have  been adopted. It's up to counsel  discretion whether you want to bring  forward to you the ordinance that would allow for.  

We had adopted one in Norman Beach and  we spent a lot of time developing.  Pretty straightforward. It requires  what it has for the animals to provide water and so forth. It has to be in certain areas.  We might want to look at that one. 

Six to eight months  gathering information. I don't  know what other cities have them. I would say look  at that.  It's important. Especially --  

In the rural areas.  

We don't bring ordinances forward  unless we have the majority of counsel  directing us to present an ordinance  to you.  

Absolutely. 

We are unanimous  on that. They even have you happy hour.  That's pretty neat. Not happy. 

I thought  my jokes recording.  

We're getting a lot knocked out  today guys. 

Mister [Indiscernible] could  not attend the summary  meeting recently.  I was the substitute stunt guide  to go to represent . I represent  us in our position. Were not going to have  one mile and paper 11. I know Councilman Patterson carry the water for two years and  offered amendments. We were totally  ignored, basically. Anybody want  to talk about it. I offer the  new secretary was there.  Transportation. I offered my thought to him since he inherited such a giant  headache the state might consider that may  21 deadline because if we don't  get things resolved there's been  recent problems. There doesn't seem  to be any desire on the  commissions part to help  us out to adjust things. They  need to be adjusted. I don't think I want  to be on Mayor Dyer's Christmas  list soon. He was challenging us because we did contribute to one of the more  recent studies they did. The problem  is if we contribute to that it makes  it look like were okay with it.  We are not okay with anything. Anyway,  I tried to swing for the fence.  I just want to give you a report  on that. Appreciate the staff going and legals and then John Booker  and Mister Rector more I appreciate  that. There some other studio. Just  trying to represent us and kept our position. It needs  to be amended. Until then were not  to be happy. Anyway, that's what  I did. Thank you. >> There's a reason I  hadn't recognized that he is leaving  is because I don't want to accept  it. Be that as it may  I have Betty you know how  much we care about you and how much  you do for us. The times lost a lot. You're always  there when we need you. You have  the answers and the direction and  thank you for your years of service  and continuing on in the full-time part-time career you have. We certainly appreciate  it. Really is can be happy to  have you back full-time, I think. 
     If at any time he says you can come  back you know you're welcome. We  will always take you back. We  received an update from legal on  the process or lack thereof of RPO  on amendment 10 which ties in with  the fact that staff is proceeding  forward with the idea that we will  make plans and move forward in the  event we don't. Fail in that. August 29th  and 30th there's a Florida water  forum. If anyone else  is not to go you save me going to that. Somebody will  be there. Very important.  It's important for you to go. 
     Sales tax. We haven't had a meeting  since that didn't work. Thank you for your service. It's on the canvassing board I  appreciate that. Affect that's missed  in this. Less  than one percent of the registered  voters determine the future or  lack thereof of the county. 400,000  voters registered. Less than 4000 were to be one percent. For the determining numbers. I just want to point  that out. I was asked whether or  not we should do a  vote in November of 2020. I said it's worth discussing. I  still think it is. I'm not necessarily  opposed to that. I also told and stated any number  four rooms there was no plan B that  could do with that plan could do which was including funds  from people outside of our area  funding the revenue. I had a plan see offered to me 
     and whether was just are not I'm  not sure. That plan see would be  to have the county do a one build dedicated increase unding for transportation and  water issues. I said that would  be great but  I don't think we get six other votes. That would fund $32 million or  something like that. It would fund  $32 million. They won't go  for that. They say if some other funding  source comes along in the future  it would be removed. That's kind  of catchy. Anyway that was  the only plan that anyone has offered since it passed.  Speaking of that I  happen to be in and casual event and spoke with Congressman Duncan Hunter from California over  the weekend. It  was the sales tax failure.  He was also aware of the transportation  needs of our county and he served on the transportation  committee in Washington with Congressman  Mike up. How well Congressman Michael was  able to, as he pointed out you're  Mark to get everything from Volusia  County. He said you know they're  gone. He said you know not to get any  help from the federal government . He is a skinning the  gun but were leveraging funds. I said that was the main reason  we do this. To be able to  get correct transportation needs  we had. Was point out today every dollar of Orange  Avenue bridge funded by the  federal government. That's never  gonna happen again anywhere. That's  just some the things we missed out. You  see right now the articles in the  paper it's a shame these things  were pointed out that  they uses fundings to help . My first attempt in Norman Beach that every year  there was a set of money, forget . The amount of money they called.  We tried to get money for hidden  Hills for sewer. At that time was  about $8000 per Houtz. Were plan divided up between the  city, the state and the resident. It would work back  then but it's just a whole lot more  expensive now. Understand  anybody out there listening the  has plan C, B, D that would be great. The next the  last thing I want to mentioned is if you received a draft  of the letter of support for Judge course act in the last of  the brother-in-law. I sent the names. I'm sure everyone's  okay on that part of it.  The other thing is a couple the  meetings we had scheduled our gonna  be postponed, George. I know had one that was for tomorrow. It's been changed. 

The one on Thursday. It was the [Indiscernible] that were  postponing that. So people can attend. It's what I have in conflict with  Ms. Cusack.  

Yes. Will make  sure every have's.  

It's tragic. Will  get out here before 6 o'clock. Unless  anyone has anything else to say  wardroom five duck 20. 520. >> It's all  on you. 
     [event concluded]