(Music plays) SPEAKER: Welcome to the Volusia County Council meeting. The meeting will begin in 10 minutes. (Music plays) SPEAKER: Welcome to the Volusia County Council meeting. The meeting will begin in five minutes. (Music plays) SPEAKER: Welcome to the Volusia County Council meeting. The meeting will begin in two minutes. (Music plays) SPEAKER: If everyone wants to find a seat, we will get started shortly. (Music plays) SPEAKER: Wow. See how that works? We will call the meeting to order and the way we start the meetings, we will change just slightly but we will start as we always do with a prayer. If you are part of the faith group who would like to participate in invocation, you are welcome to do that. Just send an email to Karissa Green, KGreen@Volusia.org. She will get you all set up to do that. Are you going to pray, Don? And then right after the invocation, which today will be by Pastor Mose Hawkins from the No Limit Praise Tabernacle in DeLand after he is done we will have the Pledge of Allegiance and what is different is we will go right into a very special proclamation for a member of our community who deserves our recognition. So, if you would stand with me, if you care to, for the invocation, Pastor Mose? PASTOR MOSE HAWKINS: Let us pray. Father God the name of Jesus, we thank you for this day, this opportunity, to first serve you. And Lord we pray now you will give wisdom God to these councilmembers, God, who if you've put in those chairs, God and father we pray now they will put you in their hearts as every decision they make, God, it would be for the betterment of the people. We ask you continue to bless this county and all the citizens. We pray, God has business is discuss today will be done in such a way Lord God that, it will bring peace, God, and unity, even if the decision is to agree to disagree. Father, we pray for your presence in this room. We pray now, God, you will give understanding, that you will bring unity as we enter the business concerning our county. We thank you for your blessings, God, that rest upon this county, God and upon these men and women that are in this room, we ask in your son's name, in Jesus name, amen. ALL: I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America. And to the Republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. JEFFREY S. BROWER: You may be seated. Some of you, when you came in, might have saw a lot of activity down in the rotunda. And we had the opportunity to add a member to the Florida veterans Hall of Fame. I cannot see him, but I'm sure he is sitting there, Joseph Sicinski, and wanted to carry that over to this meeting. He was awarded a special plaque in the Hall of Fame, one of seven people to earn that honor. All of us in this room, we honor our veterans and our first responders. Joseph, it is our honor to have you here today. Jake? There he is. Jake will do, will start the proclamation for Mr Joseph Sicinski. Congratulations. JAKE JOHANSSON: Welcome again, Joe. This is a proclamation from Volusia County, Florida, whereas Joseph Sicinski is a true American patriot who served honorably in the US Air Force during the Korean War. And whereas he served as a chief for F 84 jet fighter bombers with the 49th fighter bomber squadron in Japan and Korea, and was later deployed to the United States to join the 4701 airborne early warning squadron in Sacramento, California. And whereas, after leaving the military, Mr Joseph Sicinski founded firms that provided technical writing and contract engineering services, both of which supported the aerospace industry, and whereas he is a renowned asset to the veteran community, understatement, having served as resident and commander of the Korean War veterans Association in Port Orange, Vice President of the state association and first Vice President of the veterans Museum and education center in Daytona Beach. And whereas he has been inducted into the Florida veterans Hall of Fame, which honors military veterans who throughout their works and lives, during and after the military service, have made a significant contribution to the state of Florida. And whereas he and his wife of 60 years, Anita, 69? 69, live in Port Orange and have two children, for grandchildren and four great-grandchildren. Now therefore, we the County Counsel of Volusia County Florida do hereby proclaim, May 21, 2024, as Joseph Sicinski Day in Volusia County and urge all residents to honor this outstanding man for serving his country, community, and local veterans. Dated this 21st day of May, 2024. Signed by the County Council. Joe, thank you so much. (Applause) JAKE JOHANSSON: Now Pat is going to make us do some stuff. Don't sit down yet. Where do you want us? Come on over here. I'll take this. SPEAKER: Let's see if I see everybody. I can. Wait a minute. (Laughter) SPEAKER: You go first. OK. This row take one step that way. Everybody go one step that way. OK. This is nice. One more. (Taking photos) SPEAKER: Another step that way. (Laughs) I see you Ready? OK… SPEAKER: (away from mic) SPEAKER: Let's get him in there. Alright. You get in there, too. That's nice. Ready? (Taking photos) SPEAKER: I would like to ask the previous inductees to come forward for another picture. (Applause) JEFFREY S. BROWER: What a great way to start a Volusia County Council meeting, in the presence of greatness and someone who has served so honorably. All of those men and their families. So, Karissa, would you call the roll please? (Roll call) JEFFREY S. BROWER: We do have a quorum, six of us. We will start as usual with public participation. If we... We do. I will call your names, you also have an opportunity to speak on items. This is the first public participation. You can speak about anything you want on County matters. When I call your name, just come up to the podium. Please try and make sure you have a microphone close to your mouth so we can hear you and it is being broadcast to thousands of people, don't let that make you nervous. You have three minutes to speak to the Council. There is a clock above my head and on the monitor in front of you. Please stay within three minutes because we have a lot of people that want to speak. First today, he is going to show you how to do it, is John Nicholson. SPEAKER: Yes, I've been here before. John Nicholson, Daytona Beach side. I've been bringing this up wherever I go, whenever there is a meeting of the city or county. We are in an age where it is politically correct, and it is killing us. Alright? We choose people by their race, by their religion, gender. The last time I heard there's 49 genders. I know two, and I don't care to know anymore. I understand people have differences, however, by concentrating on our differences, it is hurting us in the long run. When I grew up, we were not considered a community of salad, we were a melting pot. Because what people did was they fell into the community and joined the community. We are not doing that anymore. We are separating people constantly. And that is hurting us. I often talk to you about the value of Daytona Beach. Daytona Beach is the center of development here on Volusia County. We are the political engine for the County. Are tourism is very valuable to the county. If you have read the paper on Sunday, the city is raising half $1 billion to put in the mid-town. In the last 17 years, there has only been two projects on that side, three when you include the Daytona Grand. But all the money that is spent for the boardwalk, 702,000, one for the median, 750,000, that is it from the city. It is imperative that the hotel people get together. We would not be here today the hotel people had paid attention to something outside of their front door. Something other than rooms and beds. They have to know what is going on. Daytona Beach, if you walk down it it is deteriorating terribly. It cannot be, wherever they go it's pristine, you go on a cruise ship, you cannot find a piece of paper! Go to Disney, you cannot find a piece of paper! Go to Daytona Beach, not a problem. It concerns all you, Ormond Beach makes money off events in Daytona Beach. Everybody makes money off the events. You cannot kill the goose that lays the golden egg. You have to pay attention to what is going on. We are being sued because we don't represent our citizens on our city commission. The paper came out yesterday. 84,000 people in the city of Daytona Beach. We divided it on 70,000 people. One of our zones is over 12,000 people overcapacity. (Bell rings) SPEAKER: They are not being represented. Thank you. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Angie Sutton. If I did not say it, when you come up to speak, just tell us what part of the county you are from. You don't have to give your entire address for us for safety reasons but your representative would like to know where you're from. SPEAKER: Angie Sutton, District 3. I'm here to speak out against the proposed motocross track. There's a public meeting with over 200 people in attendance but we've not heard anything since. The flooding, the noise, the lights, the constant traffic, are an immediate impact. Those of us and in the surrounding neighborhoods, take it somewhere where it's more of an open area and there's less of an impact. There are so many more logical areas for it to go, in my opinion, along US 92, long Daytona Beach area, Daytona Beach has many hotel rooms, and things for people to do are not just people who want to come to right. Those of us in the neighborhood are not against a project like this but a project like this in our backyard. There's already so much more flooding you to all the new construction happening around us, no one is taking that into consideration when digging about us. All you can see are dollar signs. (unknown name) has grown so much and continues to do so, towns West has caused our area to flood the worst it is ever flooded. During hard rain we have standing water in our yard, heaven forbid we get a hurricane. During the last hurricane, my grandson was in our front yard and a John boat with the motor, whipping around having the time of his life because we had so much water. And it takes days for it to go away and then we have mosquitoes, so, we are on the phone with mosquito control constantly trying to get them to come out. Are you taking into consideration the traffic this will cause to Tomoko Farms Road? The main entrance is right on a very dangerous curve, every thought about that? This is only a two lane road that is already overcrowded even though every traffic study done for every new project states otherwise. Just ask anyone who lives off of it that tries to pull out of there in the morning, it's like taking your life into your own hands. You either sit there and wait forever or you pull out and florid into the flow of traffic. We are simply asking you to take us, were already there, into consideration and look for a more suitable place for this facility. Thank you. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Thank you, Andrew Schneider? You will be followed by Madison Hall. SPEAKER: Thank you for the time, this is my first time. My name is Andrew Schneider, and from the Port Orange area. This is about the proposed motocross track, my family is here with me. We do not get time off, and to bring my girls here to talk about this. This is an important topic for me, first I would say I lived behind the proposed track. I would say qualitative perspective, I am against us. We moved to this specific area, what are my main concerns is the noise. I would echo the person before me who said there seem to be again, from a very limited perspective, I do not have the data you have in front of yourselves, of other areas that are far less populated. We specifically moved to this area because we enjoy being further away from the city and we enjoyed the zoning it is, it seems like it's rezoned in this area for something highly commercial for commercial operations, and not into consideration for the families that have bought these homes in that area. So, I'm breaking my family here today, I'm taking time off, my wife is taking time off, we do not have anyone to watch the kids because it's important enough for us to talk about this issue. I would also like to echo the comments about the traffic of my concerns there. The (indiscernible) and smell that blows into our area, does the employee or area, and flooding that is already in the area. Thank you for your time. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Next we have Madeleine Hall and after that we have Elizabeth Caprio. SPEAKER: Ditto everything that was said before me, I will not repeat any of that. I am from District 2, I live in town west -- Westport on town West Boulevard. I am the last subdivision that got built. We built out there to have quiet and peace, but I have questions I want to consider. The economic impact that this will have on our existing residents especially the value of our homes. We now pay taxes on high value, if a property drops, will our taxes drop? That is number one. I know we have to fight that ourselves to get the taxes changed. The noise pollution, I work at Daytona Speedway as a go-cart driver, I come home filthy. This is an asphalt track. We are going to have dirt tracks, no asphalt except for some parking. The filth and the dust, the noise, we do not see a sound barrier anywhere on the plans that you presented. The plans that show an open area with no housing, I do not know how old that map was that it was drawn on, there are so many houses right across from there. When you see it, you can also look at the other plants they showed in comparison, there are no homes around any of those. The one in Gainesville, I do not remember, all these different places, it does not show any homes at all and they are finished. The third thing was, how will you help communicate to the news? No one told us about a meeting, I do not know where people find it. It says you will make it available for the community to hold meetings for residential feedback, we've had one meeting. I found out after the fact, I read it and went through all of your agendas to see, I have exact timeline when it was proposed, when it was talked about, when it was presented. I do not see any community feedback coming here except for the 200 people that got lucky and found out about it. And then there was one more, quick, quick. What other sites have you considered besides the one on Tomoko Farms Road? Because the traffic I'm right there at that intersection, the traffic is horrendous. We put up with the bike week, we knew it was there and understood that when we bought our home. We put up with Bike-toberfest, we found out about that when we build our home. But we had no idea about plans three years ago to put a super motocross track. This does not serve children but it serves adults who can pay for it. Were putting in RVs, patting parking, that is not for kids. Our neighbors who think this is a great idea think the kids will go across the street and drive their dirt bikes, they have another thing coming. (Bell rings) JEFFREY S. BROWER: Elizabeth Caprio? You will be followed by Debbie Forrester. SPEAKER: My name is Elizabeth Caprio, and District 2, Port Orange. Ditto to everything that has been said head of me about the motocross. I also did not find out about the meeting for feedback until the day after it happened and I heard it on the news. I have not heard anything about the environmental impact study. The water that sat in the woods off of Tomoko Farms, sat there close to a month. I would hate to see what would happen without it and I do not know how far you would have to dig down for that to go anywhere. I cannot imagine the wind and the water combined, coming into the Westport community that at the most is 5 1/2 years old. Coming into that community as well as to Coquina Cove and Hawks nest without the benefit of those trees. It would have the same adverse impacts of removal of them mangrove trees have had on the people that live on the coastline. There is a substantial amount of wildlife across the street and in this area that is being considered. Including, some eagles that come down and fish in our retention ponds. They are absolutely gorgeous, I cannot imagine I will ever see one fly around again. And I want to know what the floodplain will change into right now, Westport reserve is not considered a flood zone. We know that can change in the drop of a hat, you remove the natural barriers and you subject all of us to ruin. I grew up in central Florida, when I retired we moved -- I moved to Connecticut many years ago, but I retired my husband and I moved here. We looked at many places in the Port Orange areas including Pinnacle, the noise from 95 was prohibitive. Comoco Road is not bad. We know about bike week and bike toberfest. The other odds and ends, we can hear from the Daytona 500 when it's going. Not right up next to it but we can hear it. I cannot imagine motorcycles with no mufflers, with decibel levels that go 106 to 125, dozens of them at the same time. Try it in your backyard. Thank you. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Debbie Forrester? SPEAKER: Thank you for your time, Debbie Craig Forster, commander of Ormond Strong. In the spirit of honoring all who serve, I am letting you know about an event we are having Saturday, June 1, from 10 AM to 12:30 PM this takes place at the Ormond Memorial arts and gardens. This is an eighth annual Ormond Strong JD Martin and military veteran appreciation day. This will be inside, we have AC, this is a free event for everybody in the community can participate. The Ormond Memorial Art Gallery did was started by World War I into veterans, we wanted to have it before but it was not open at the time we usually have this event. We are excited to go there because our veterans are getting older and slower but our enthusiasm does not waiver for our heroes. A master of the ceremony is Colonel (unknown name), United States Marine retired live music by Randy McDonald, everybody will enjoy free food, art, resources, fun for everyone. Every military veteran and first responder will be honored by a service medallion, goodie bag, and most important, events like this and other veteran events and what you guys did today for Joseph Sicinski, gives us all a renewed sense of pride and dignity and purpose. We appreciate you and the whole community that comes out to support us, thank you. Ormand Strong out. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Thank you, Emily Faust followed by Larry Wesley. SPEAKER: Hello, my name is Emily and this is my first time speaking at a County Council meeting. My pastor and some members of my church as well as the families at my preschool are asking me to come here today to speak about a traffic issue that we have in front of all of our business. Our preschool is a nonprofit that has about 100 some families that attend the preschool. On any given day, parents are dropping off and picking up and there is no left turn lane into our preschool. This is a two lane road and I just wanted to bring your attention into some statistics about left turn lanes and how important they are. In Volusia County, over the last year there have been 3127 crashes. While we may not have had a fatal accident at our particular non-intersection or no turn lane, there have been a lot of close calls over the years. There's been a 39% increase in the state of Florida from 2013 to 2023 and total crash fatalities, here in the state of Florida. Because many of our parents are constantly voicing a concern that they feel unsafe with children in the vehicle turning into our preschool, I am asking that when you guys start your project to widen Taylor Road, that you would consider putting a left-hand turn lane in front of our preschool and church, to serve our families on a daily basis. And I also have some statistics from the Federal Highway administration, that exclusive turning lanes or vehicles removed stopped vehicles from through traffic, left turn lanes at intersection significantly reduce rear end crashes. This is something that we are hoping to provide for a lot of families in our community. And I also want to say on a personal note, I have been working at this particular preschool for 18 years now. I have personally witnessed some of these close calls myself. And that this will definitely have a significant impact on our families and impact on what preschool they choose for their children, should they not want to make that left turn into the parking lot or if they are fearful of having those close calls happened to them or their loved ones. So, I ask you to consider adding that to the expansion of Taylor road, thank you for your time. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Thank you. Larry Wesley? I will add -- OK, I don't have to tell him that. The clock above my head is on. Can you see it? SPEAKER: Larry Wesley, 39 Saint Andrew Circle. I am involved with our Savior's (indiscernible) church as well and Emily did a great job in presenting what we are trying to get here. I don't want to see what happened on was that grand Avenue out there in DeLand? Where grandmother and what three children got killed? JEFFREY S. BROWER: Yes. SPEAKER: Because there was no proactive thing done as far as turning lanes or thank God you came up with the circle. Beautiful idea. Anyway, I talked with the previous pastor and Mayor Burnett and his assistant and Danny Robins and Jake Johansson is aware, I think Matt probably, you guys talk, call you the Three Musketeers. You know? Johansson, Robins and Reinhart. But anyway, we need that turning zone. These children, this is precious cargo coming to this preschool. We don't need it for the church. We need it for the preschool. Those parents coming in about 7 o'clock to 9 o'clock in the morning, dropping off kids. If you cannot put a turning lane you could at least put a -- I've got a minute left? You could at least put a sign. School zone. Flashing light. Maybe some paint down that signifies a school zone. They are going through there right now at over 55 mph. I talked to Mayor Burnett. He said when there is an accident there, there was an accident, our church secretary, it is still under litigation right now. A rear end, pushed her into oncoming traffic. My Pastor in Wisconsin told me it's still under litigation. And you people are aware of the problem. Let's be proactive here. Danny is on top of it. He has talked to the engineers, talk to the Florida transportation people. And it's time, you know, I'm throwing you a bonus here. It is an election year! Do something. It it done before, you know, September school year starts. I think they are practicing graduation right now. School is almost over but you can have this ready easy if you put a little effort into it and get it over by, you know, next school year, September. If you give me the equipment I will do it myself. Do you know to mean? It's not that hard, people. Let's get 'er done! Seven, six, five! Come on, people, help us out here! I don't want to see this disaster. (Bell rings) JEFFREY S. BROWER: The reason I told Mr Wesley the clock was running above my head is because it had not been but just in case you come up and speak and the clock goes off, it's still on on the monitor in front of you but it seems like the clock above me is working now? OK. John Keister. SPEAKER: Thank you, sir. John Keister, District 3. I spoke to you all sometime back and I was tortured in the Volusia County jail over here, and mamed on February 5 and six of 2021 for not wearing a rag over my face. I'm a grown man, and I don't force anybody to do anything. And no one has a right to force a rag over my face or an injection in my body. Here we are, about three years in, and I'm not hearing anybody talk about this. The government... Nobody seems to want to talk about it. I will debate anybody, anytime, anywhere, and I want to debate any leader in our government who says they have a right to put a rag over my face or any authority put a rag over my face, because you don't, and they don't. We are a country, people talking about democracy, that don't understand what democracy is. I will debate anyone on this planet on democracy. The world does not understand the democracy, there is no such things as an earthly democracy. Democracy is the spirit of cooperation. It is the spirit that taught men how to toss a coin heads or tails because that is fair and it is equal. And democracy is always fair and equal. I will give you a quick explanation. I challenge anyone, the definition of democracy. Try to get someone to define democracy. Here's the definition. (Reads) "Democracy is 100% voluntary, equal and fair agreement." The moment you get outside of that, you are no longer in a democracy. You're in something else. You might be in a democratic process, and that is what for instance, when you toss a coin, heads or tails, you are in a democratic process. That is what voting is. Voting was invented by democracy, but it's not democracy. Voting is democratic. It is the process that democracy acts in. The parliamentary procedure is democratic. It is the process that democracy operates by. America is not a democracy. We are a representative republic, where democracy can take place, but it's not mandated by law. Democracy can never be mandated by any law. It is not a physical thing. It is that understanding that we are equals. The kind of equality that takes place when you, for instance, toss a coin, even though we all have different money and where different heights and different physical abilities. (Bell rings) SPEAKER: Is my time up? JEFFREY S. BROWER: Yes sir. SPEAKER: I would love to give a PowerPoint sometime on democracy for this counsel. (Bell rings) JEFFREY S. BROWER: Thank you. OK, thank you, that brings us to item 1: the approval of the agenda. Can I have a motion to approve the agenda? SPEAKER: Motion to approve the agenda. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Motion to approve by vice chair Kent. Is there a second? JAKE JOHANSSON: Second. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Second by Jake Johansson. All in favor say aye? Any opposed? And the agenda is approved 6-0. Which brings us to the presentation that we had, proclamation. I would need motion and a second to approve the proclamation. Motion to approve by Matt Reinhart and a second by representative Jake Johansson. Any questions? All in favor say aye. Any opposed? Proclamation is approved 6-0. That brings us to item 3, the consent agenda. Does any council member have an item that they would like to pull for a comment or for a vote? Danny Robins? Item F? Councilman Reinhart? Matt Reinhart is the same. Item F. SPEAKER: Motion to approve the consent agenda item F. JAKE JOHANSSON: Second. JEFFREY S. BROWER: It can be with that item, it's just for comment. TROY KENT: I didn't hear that. Do you want a vote or comment? MATT REINHART: We can discuss, I just want to tweak it a little bit. TROY KENT: Approve absent item F. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Motion to approve except for item F by vice chair Kent and second by Jake Johansson. All in favor of the balance of the agenda item please say aye. Any opposed? Carries 6-0 and we will move to item F. George, there goes your perfect record. GEORGE RECKTENWALD: Pressure is relieved. We will start a new streak starting next week. JEFFREY S. BROWER: This is an item on the award of funding for swim safety program. DANNY ROBINS: I read over and reviewed anything. Just want to bring a couple suggestions I think for some checks and balances. Brad, I can I bend your ear for a moment? I was looking some of the verbiage when it came to the award and funding of the water and swim safety programs. Thank you guys for bringing this back to us and giving us some options. I like the program. Is it possible, how can we make sure the YMCA and city of Daytona Beach, where that money stays with this program and kind of does not get lost in the mix? Do we have a plan on how to make sure that is earmarked? Some of these organizations? SPEAKER: It is a cost reimbursable grant just like many that we do so they have to prove they have had expenditures for this program in order to get the money, we just do not get the lump sum. SPEAKER: That answers that. I see also it limits this funding to go towards, I guess folks with pools? I would like to add some verbiage in there. The number one, is that correct? SPEAKER: No, sir. The swim lessons you do not have to have a pool. But a component of this are alarms for folks, and they have to have a pool in order to get one of those alarms that we provide as well. DANNY ROBINS: I would like to expand that because not everybody has a pool. But there's a lot of canals in Volusia County, ponds, drainage, or retention pond, farm pond on the property. Can we open that up to those folks as well, not just limit that? SPEAKER: Absolutely. We need to look to make sure the work in those larger bodies of water, we don't want to give folks something that will not work but yes. DANNY ROBINS: Obviously with the pool sensor, I get it. But I'm talking about the window sensors and the door sensors. SPEAKER: Yes, sir. DANNY ROBINS: That's all I have and I will make a motion to approve. JEFFREY S. BROWER: OK. So far we have a motion to approve item F. The representative Danny Robins and a second from representative Matt Reinhart. Matt? MATT REINHART: Just really quick, thank you for that, by the way, I did not think outside of that. That was a good idea. I was actually pulling it for discussion, we had started this conversation with the city of Daytona when they first were made aware of this and they are extremely, they were hard at work right away on it. So I know Commissioner (unknown name) was very active in that so they are very appreciative of the fact. I would like to see it where they have the opportunity to pursue this again. 275 kids in Daytona will get those types of lessons. 275 potential life that could be saved because of that so my thanks to you all for doing that. I appreciate it. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Thank you. Vice chair Kent? TROY KENT: Thank you, chairman. I'm excited about this. This is the right thing to do. When Wyatt was able to start crawling, we put him in infant swim research. I watched it work firsthand. Absolutely incredible for kids who cannot even walk, but know how to roll over and float. And living near any body of water, I would recommend that every parent their child swim lessons, or infants swim research. Brad, I have a question for you on this because $20,000 to the YMCA, and they are going to provide swimming lessons to 200 children throughout Volusia County. The city of Daytona Beach, $20,000 and they are going to provide swimming lessons for 275 students. Why can Daytona Beach do it better than the YMCA, and have we spoken to the YMCA and said "hey, Daytona is giving us 75 more lessons here for students. We want you to step up and provide the same. You're getting this same amount of money." I think it is a healthy conversation that is valid. I do not think it is irrational. I think it is a reasonable question to ask and if you do not ask you Leno. SPEAKER: I thought your question was going to be if you have to be a YMCA member. TROY KENT: Thank you, because that was going to be my other question. SPEAKER: They're being supplemented by other government funds for this, whereas the YMCA is not. But there is a sliding scale. The YMCA gave us a number, they may be able to serve more based on that sliding scale of income just like they use for their membership. It all depends on if you have someone of the lower end with a higher end. TROY KENT: I saw where the YMCA could be free or could be discounted. For Daytona Beach, is it free or the same sliding scale? SPEAKER: It is income eligible so there is an income threshold. TROY KENT: And is the income threshold with the YMCA as well? The sliding scale? SPEAKER: Yes. TROY KENT: I am going to vote for this and approve it because if this amount of money saved one little baby it's worth it but I'm hopeful of the conversation and maybe another Council member will speak up as well as that if Daytona is doing 275, I want to see YMCA and or put in the question mark any other group, Ormond Beach, Port Orange, I don't care, do it as well as Daytona is doing it. SPEAKER: Your point is well taken. This is the first time we've done this and I think it aligns with George's leadership and your goals to be nimble when we see an issue in the community but also protect the public trust and your point is well taken. We put it out for bid next time we'll make sure there's kind of uniform, this is what you're getting for each unit. TROY KENT: Sure. I want to thank Councilman Robbins because he spearheaded this and brought this up six or eight months ago or something like that. It was something like that. And this is positive for kids in the community and I'm really pleased you brought up, you don't just have to have a pool because there are many that live near a pond or canal or ditch. When you see these things on the news or read about it is absolutely brutal. SPEAKER: I will say as well the state as well as the need for this and started a $500,000 pilot program that is similar and I've asked her health department director how we can access the funds going forward. So we can leverage our funds or not use the funds in on the future. TROY KENT: I am pleased to hear that, since I still have the force and someone else has jumped in yet and the chair has not recognized me, I did not know that, and please the state is offering up half $1 million. Here we are in Volusia County and looking at $73,000, it might be something that Mr Booker, if he is in the house, George, he can tap into and this is something we can talk to our delegation going to Tallahassee. Statewide at half $1 million, will leave it at that. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Councilman Johansson? JAKE JOHANSSON: Thank you sir, just to get clarity, the window alarms are only for the windows they give access to the pool, correct? SPEAKER: I'm looking to professional, please Carmen. JAKE JOHANSSON: This is not for all the windows in the house? SPEAKER: Those alarms come in a package of for this would be a package given to a house, we will not be installing the alarms on each of eventual house. JAKE JOHANSSON: If I come to the county and say I have 16 windows will you give me 16 door or window alarms out? SPEAKER: Probably one package per household. But we can discuss that. JAKE JOHANSSON: The request from Councilman Robbins to add the canals and the ponds, that is for the water intrusion alarm only? SPEAKER: Correct, that restriction was just for the water intrusion alarm which is for a pool. It may be able to be used on that one. JAKE JOHANSSON: Not the window? I'm trying to prevent someone from saying they have 16 widows. If a kid can get out a back window and go to a pond, a kid can go out of front pinto and go to the pond. According to the building code, it cannot get out of the front window, technically, and go into your pool because you either have to have a sense or some other way to get into it. Those things are protected and which unnecessarily protect ponds and canals with fences, according to building codes. What I do not want is for five people to come up and set their house up for success at the expense of other people that needed. So, I want to make sure that we do not do something great here that makes us inefficient in the future. SPEAKER: our goal would be to help as many residents as possible, this is a supplemental program and not to retrofit your whole house. JAKE JOHANSSON: I know what it is intended for. I love the program, like many other programs that we do at the county. But keep in mind as we talk about other programs, this is the government doing something that may be a mom and dad should be doing, having said that I supported 100%. Thank you. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Thank you, we have a motion on the floor to approve the award of funding for water and swim safety programs with an expenditure of $73,490, is there any other questions or comments? All in favor, say aye? Any opposed? And the motion carried 6 to 0. That brings us to item 4. We do have members of the public that want to participate in this. Item 4, I asked to have this placed on the agenda because it concerns the legend beach parade in (unknown name), which hopefully all of you are aware of it. This is a very, very popular parade that happens once a year outside of turtle season. It is so popular that many residents and visitors that go down to view the parade are not able to find a parking spot. There is very limited parking in Ponce Inlet . I am asking the Council, what I hope to get to today is that we cannot take a vote and just approve to allow cars to park for a parade. This will happen through several steps. I'm asking the council to make a motion for staff to proceed to review this potential change and then return the matter to counsel. So, we can be well ahead of the 2015 legislative session, it has to go to the state legislature as well. It did before to even allow the parade, this is not require you to vote on the final decision, it brings us the information needed to make an informed decision. At the same time, we have received a letter from the mayor of Ponce Inlet, very timely we also have members of the Ponce Inlet, city commission here that will spoke. She has offered -- the Council has offered to seek parking off of the beach through their own city owned property and through private businesses. I think we should proceed with that as well, and let the city see if they can lock that in. However, I would like to do both simultaneously. I think we still need to move ahead and be ready for the legislative session. Because the benefit to our residents, if the County does it, is that this is locked in. If it's improved, if it's approved it down the road and we are allowed to have parking, not driving, although you have to drive to the parking place, but to allow people to go down to the Beach Street approach, turn left and go north and Park. They know that they can do that every year. If it's private businesses providing parking, we do not know if that will continue from year-to-year. One year it might be in place next year it might not be. I believe we should approve or pursue both of them. And all the details after that, the Council would decide if the AFWC says it does not adversely affect our incidental take permit, whichthis should not. This is outside of turtle season, this is not nighttime driving, and it's not driving up and down the beach. This is turning to park, so, everyone in Volusia County and our visitors can enjoy the parade. So that is why it's on the agenda, so can discuss it and decide if we would like to start the process. This can take some time, attorney Dyer, we do not know yet, we know when the legislation will start but we do not know when we would be required to inform them of this meeting? We would have that public meetings were inform them of this ordinance? MICHAEL G DYER: The Volusia County delegation meeting in anticipation of the 2025 outside of session, the date has not been set yet. If counsel wishes to proceed with this, anytime we have these beach issues we have for silos of issues which we addressed in the agenda. The first which the chair is referencing, this is seeking a special law to allow parking on an area that is currently designated as nondriving. Counsel did that previously for the purpose of the reenactment of the historic Beach event, beach race. The other silo is the federal permit that the chairman referenced. The staff can get with the federal government to find out if they would treat changes to the apartment as a minor or major amendment. A minor amendment it is what they accepted last time for this event. If it's a major amendment, that is a bigger deal that we need to talk about and report back to you with that information. The third silo is the issue of customary use. Up and down the beach, people's property line varies on how eastward or see where that goes. So, the public use of many part of the beach is actually occurring on private property. We would need to review that as well because there are certain elements that we have to achieve in order to have customary use. Which in other words, allow the public to use this property that is ordinarily private property, without compensation. And the last issue which does not apply, is if there are any contractual commandments or issues that we must resolve. JEFFREY S. BROWER: OK, thank you. Any questions for the attorney? Any questions at all? Yeah? OK, I will let the people from the public... let's start with the city of Ponce Inlet. I know they are here, I know Mayor Paretsky is out of town. Michael (unknown name), the city Ponce Inlet manager. SPEAKER: Thank you, honored members of the Council and County staff. In your packet you have a letter from the mayor Krasinski. She sent her regrets she could not be here today. Mr Chair, you already covered a lot of the points that the letter highlighted but I will hit some highlights. There are some currents within the town about the issues that may be raised at this process goes forward. We want to work with private property owners and commercial properties to see if they can offer parking space for this event. The town also has up to 160 spaces of its own that could be used for this purpose. In total, there are 345 spaces that are being used for this event for visitors and staging. It would be helpful to us if you have a certain amount of parking a number of faces in mind that we could work to secure that number. I would be happy to answer any questions that you have, Councilman white is here as well. JEFFREY S. BROWER: OK, thank you, we will see how it proceeds. Councilman White? SPEAKER: Skip white, Ponce Inlet town Council. Afternoon counsel, digging for languages becomes a born issue. The legends parade, held annually, historic along the stretch of our beautiful beaches were the most popular events we host each year. We get visitors from all over the US as we commemorate racing histories right here in Ponce INlet. This legend parade is an excellent example of cooperation a nation between Volusia County and Ponce town Council. We value our partnership with the county and is always look forward to working with you and all important matters that come before us. Based on my research, the current proposal under the consideration would potentially violate the following under the ITP that is supported by the habitat conservation plan. Number one, Ponce Inlet designation for natural beach management area, see page 110 and 111 of the habitat conservation plan. Number two, the vehicle access restriction for the natural beach management area, see page 113, table 30 of the ICH CP. Number three, vehicle restriction for natural bees, management area, under special events. See page 114, table 30, and item J on 115. These are a few of the issues are presidential amount of staff time, legal research, and amendments by the state level for additional beach parking would become available. The Florida legislative session is not to begin until March 4, 2025 one month after this event. I provided supporting documents for your review from the HCP's, in addition, this replacer project which should be underway during the time this event takes place may present challenges in terms of practicality. Amendments to the state law, the habitat conservation plan, and the in-state toll take permit could buckle down legal and legislative redtape. For now the good news, in recognition of needing additional parking on local Ponce Inlet business community has come together to support this event. We all look forward to and I have spoken several business owners were expressed a willingness to allow visiting race fans to park on the properties. Alleviating the shortage of parking spots that gave rise to the chairman's concerns. With your permission, like the opportunity to submit with you a formal plan that will achieve this objective in time for next year's event. And save County staff a great deal of time, money, and effort. I would be willing to organize this, formalizes, and bring this back to you in an upcoming meeting. I will be happy to answer any questions you might have and look forward to hearing from you about the proposal. (Bell rings) JEFFREY S. BROWER: Thank you very much. Don't go away. We usually do not allow questions to the public coming in but this is unusual and we have two members of the Ponce Inlet Council and staff here. So, if anyone does have a question for them, Councilman Reinhart. MATT REINHART: Thank you. How many, these locations you are talking about that are willing to support this, they've been in business for a long time, correct? SPEAKER: Right. Some business owners but also private landowners. And if I quickly tell you, Jerry's Pizza across from the offstreet parking, Frankie has agreed to allow us to use the parking lot but just to the west of that, is about a 2 acre field that is actually owned by Bobby Blake who is a friend of mine. MATT REINHART: He has been there for a while. SPEAKER: Bobby has committed to doing that. The other opportunity we have is at Winterhaven Park across the street, 711, Mr Singh. There's actually about 2 1/2 acres of vacant land behind the 711, which have already contacted both of those individuals, friends of mine. They've agreed to allow us to use that parking lot. We utilize the parking lot in Ponce Inlet, as we always have our events, Christmas parade and things like that. So you are looking at a little bit over 4 acres of open field that we can utilize, if need be. We have never been in this position before. It continues to grow, which is wonderful we don't want to see the parade go away. The town sponsors the parade. MATT REINHART: Those spots you referred to, were they utilized last year? SPEAKER: No. MATT REINHART: I was at the legends parade this past year, I will say I commend your law enforcement as well. Which was entirely handled by the town of Ponce Inlet. They handled all of it. There is no Sheriff's office, it was strictly done by the town of Ponce Inlet and they did a phenomenal job. It seemed seamless. In and out and there's only so many ways to come into Ponce Inlet and so many ways to exit. One. That being said, I commend the fact it was handled in the manner in which it was. Now you're going to make more parking available as well. He brought up a good point which is what is going to bring up before. When this parade happens to things. Number one, it's before the state legislature convenes. Number two, we do not even know who, at this point, who that legislator is. That is essentially it is not a vacant seat but it is a vacant seat. Number three, it's right at the heart of the (indiscernible) when you go to rattlesnake island in this sand placement, (unknown name) did a phenomenal job as to the town to secure those 50 easements in order to maintain and stockpile that sand. A lot of people have asked the question when they stockpile the sand will be a big pile? No. There's going to be trucks hauling it. You'll have the truck activity at the same time. SPEAKER: That is correct. MATT REINHART: OK, I will wait to hear more. Mr Chair. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Thank you. All good questions. I was going to ask you as well: have we used those parking places in the past? You said no. SPEAKER: We have not. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Which is my concern. Parking has been an issue. This is not a complaint. This parade runs like clockwork every year. It's really well done. It is one of the reasons it's so popular. People come from all over the county and outside of the county to see this. There has been people that could not find a parking place, even though Councilman Reinhart says, there's two ways, you can come in along the river, along the ocean to get into Ponce Inlet. Took my family one year, and we never could find a place to park, we talked to law enforcement and there wasn't any place so we turned around and went to a restaurant on the river closer to Port Orange, I forget the name of it. SPEAKER: Hidden Treasures. JEFFREY S. BROWER: I don't think. Is there another one? Boondocks. Sat there and had a great lunch and talk with all the people they were in there that had the same thing happened and they went to the parade and could not get in. Not everybody, I did not talk to everybody in the restaurant. That is the purpose of bringing it up is to allow more people to enjoy an incredible thing. I think we should absolutely proceed with having the city seeing what you can do to provide more parking. What I am proposing would not be in time anyway for this year for all of the things that go into it but it provides for the future because things change. SPEAKER: Can I make one comment? JEFFREY S. BROWER: You may. SPEAKER: North turn comes to the town Council every year looking for support. We have new owners, which I think they've been there for about three years now. It is a lot of work for them to put this Legends parade on and we try to support and help them as much as we can for the feedback we're getting from the community about opening up the driving beach is so negative, I don't want to see them stop this and just go away. And that is how serious this is the common that is why we are here today. You want to continue going but if North turn gets enough pressure from the residents, the local residents, they will stop doing the parade. And they are the ones that actually put it on at all want to see us go through it that if we can have alternatives and not go through this process. JEFFREY S. BROWER: I don't either. That would be a shame. If the resident said no to everybody else in Volusia County. You've mentioned numerous concerns about, we went through all of that when we first establish the parade and had to go to the Florida legislature. And found it was not quite as daunting as some people might have expected. I'm not saying it was entered here, but there has always been that fear factor from some in the public that if you ask for anything with IDP it's going to go away. And that was not the case. SPEAKER: One other point if I could, Chairman. If you look under special events, there is very strict rules on special events. And the reason that the cars were allowed on there, is they have to go through individual training before they are allowed on the beach. It plainly states on table 30, and again I have copies, it plainly states on there for special events, they have to go through training. And if you look over on page 30 also, the public has no access ever, period, to driving on this private beach. I'm sorry, the natural beach management area. If you look at the documentation that I supplied to you guys, it's pretty cut and dry. So I don't think we will have our trainer out there training each resident that wants to drive on the beach. It stipulates that in the rules. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Right. And we would need to. We can handle it the same way we handled beach driving in the rest of Volusia County, where you have somebody in a tollbooth telling you to turn on your lights, do this, it takes a few seconds and then we can have, that could be a volunteer. We could even have volunteers like we do at the fairgrounds directing the traffic and showing you where you are supposed to park. And you asked how much. If we had a mile of beach to allow parking, at 12 feet apart we could have 880 cars double parked. And when the parade goes on, it's a wide beach. And that could be permitted. So, I'm absolutely thinking we need to proceed with what the city has offered to do. I'm a little concerned were disappointed that it has not been offered before, but sometimes, the parade has grown. Every year it gets more popular and more people come. So that could be the reason for that. Matt Reinhart? MATT REINHART: Chair. One question. The special event, and forgive me because I was not on counsel back then. Does that include parking? Or just the route of the vehicles to go onto the beach? SPEAKER: That was just the route of the vehicles. MATT REINHART: That special that we have done or that we have passed is just for the route of vehicles to go and not parking? SPEAKER: That's correct and they have to be trained on exactly where to drive on the beach. It is not just make a left. You turn your lights on and roll your window down. They have to drive on the wet sand from the highest tide of that morning, 2 o'clock after the morning until 2 o'clock in the afternoon. They have to be driving on the wet sand. MATT REINHART: On the wet sand. And just so many things that have been brought up with what you said about the special training. The fact that we got the special event without affecting the incidental take permit, the fact that Ponce Inlet is willing to go out and secure that parking. That is something you can do every year, because they come to you for that assistance anyways. That being said, I am a no on this as far as us seeing it any further. I know there is no motion, I'm just making a point. Thank you. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Thank you. Vice chair Kent. TROY KENT: Thank you, chairman. To the town Council of Ponce Inlet, I applaud you all for coming up with a solution. It is rare. A lot of times people present a problem but do not present the solution. And I thank you for doing that. Town Council member What, you mentioned briefly driving on a private beach and I went "uughh" when I heard of. SPEAKER: That was a misstep. TROY KENT: It was but it did not get past me. Is this what the town of Ponce Inlet thinks? Is this a private beach and how dare anybody access it? SPEAKER: Not even close. Let me address that one piece. You and I have had this discussion before. A lot of property owners actually physically own to the main high tide line which is based on a 10 year average. And our attorney had addressed it earlier, the majority of the property you're looking at right now is all the way into the main high tide line so I know, you know, ITP and control of the sand. That comment was not made that we think it is our beach because we don't. All we are trying to do is protect the environment that is there and not confuse people that are coming there right now. We're having a ton of issues all across Volusia County of managing the rules and regulations, the codes and ordinances we are putting into place right now. It just adds more to it. TROY KENT: Yeah. I appreciate you clarifying that and I will just say briefly, on the comment of the ownership to the main high tide water line, I had a meeting back in 2005, 2004? With a group that was trying to do high-rises in Ormond Beach. They did not like my answer and they told me in that private meeting, look right at me and said "Mr Kent, who do you think owns that property behind my hotel?" And I said "the people on that property." He let me know real quick, "I own the property and I pay the taxes on that." And I told him "you can keep people off of that beach?" He said "I cannot do that." But he wanted me to know that he owns that he pays the taxes. And it made the hair on the back of my neck stand up back then, if there's one thing I want to make sure I convey. I started this conversation I will end it with, think you for coming with a solution. That beach is not private, that beach is a public beach and for anybody to access. Thanks. SPEAKER: The way it was conveyed to me from the state, yes you own the land to the main high tide line but we have jurisdiction over the sand. That is the statement. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Thank you for bringing that up, it was troubling me when the attorney Michael Dyer said, this is a private property. At the public beach, it is always been a public beach. The public has been greatly restricted from using that beach. It's been established for decades that vehicular traffic is public access. I'm reading a letter from the county attorney from 2022, it said the special local law should be amended to expand allowable forms of vehicle traffic including public parking is an exception to the statute. The previous consulate approved the parade did not take that up but I think that we should. So in the future, if things change, the public's ability to participate in this parade does not go away. I really appreciated the offer that the city is making that you will go to the private residence, private businesses, but we will not always be able to depend on that. TROY KENT: Chairman I appreciate everything you're saying, you may not agree with this which is OK you. Are the chairman you can put things on the agenda. When I first got elected, I read this thing front and backwards to see how Angus get on the agenda. Maybe like I said, maybe don't go along with it and that's fine. If the town of Ponce Inlet has come to us with a solution. Why cross the bridge and get stuck in it? If this solves the problem, if the problem comes up again and it's not solved, when we jump feetfirst at that point and tackle it then. I do not know, but I think this might solve the problem. Again, I commend the town for going almost door-to-door to Doctor these business owners. Listen, this is good for business and Ponce Inlet needs to make sure you all say that your doors are open and that you want you down here, come and spend your money, we are one-of-a-kind. I found no place anywhere in the world with the town and the beach, and access to the river, and an inlet like you all have. This is a gem. Your business owners deserve every bit that they could get. I'm just saying maybe this fixes it, if it does not, the latest on the way to fix it. JEFFREY S. BROWER: OK, Councilman Robbins wants to speak but I will answer that really quick. Let's do it the city wants to do, the reason I think we should also pursue this is because it's a long process. We could find out fairly quickly if FWC says that this is a major or minor, and know if we should pursue it at all. What I'm asking does not require us to say OK, it is done but just take the next step. Councilman Robins? DANNY ROBINS: Thank you chairman, Geiser think we are getting into debate. This is just an observation, we are not here yet, I would like to hear from the rest of the public. Thank you Ponce Inlet, I have nothing for you guys. JEFFREY S. BROWER: A city manager, I thought you said you wanted to say something. SPEAKER: I appreciate your comment about having certainty, this is where the town properties can at least come in. There are at least 160 spaces are not being used or owned by the town for that purpose. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Thank you very much. Mike Dennis, I believe that was the last public speaker? SPEAKER: Hi, thank you, my name is Mike Dennis, 177 blue Heron Lake Circle Ormond Beach Florida. I think it's great, how often you get a problem and a possible solution and the same thing. But if I am driving down there and my choice is to park in Jerry's Italian grill parking lot, and to lug my chairs and my cooler to walk over to the beach, I do not want to hear the dum dum dum. And feel the vibration and the shirt and flathead V-8, back in my day flathead V-8 were all over the place. I was born in '47. A lot of those cars are older than me and probably older than some of you, all of them will be. But anyway... one of the things about the ITP is at St. Johns County has a similar ITP. And guess what? 4 July, untrained drivers can go park on the beach at night and turtle season. Let me repeat that, untrained drivers can park at night on the beach during turtle season for 4 July celebration. The ITP is not this big clamshell that is restricting us, I will email you, all of you the ITP and the page number that has that. But anyway maybe we can make 25 legislature but boy we should be looking at it from 26 and beyond. Because part of their parking places are empty lots. How long does an empty lot last on the beach? Unfortunately, sometimes a long time. But really, you are at the whim of the owner and developer. I think you need to look for a longer-term solution while you look at a short-term solution. It's great that you have the problem and the solution, and maybe even a long-term solution to look at. Thank you. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Thank you, that is the end of public comment on this item. Vice Chair, Kent? TROY KENT: I just want to ask the elected Mr White one more question, could you come up, please? I like your sense to solving problems, what is the furthest distance on this possible four acres to get from those lots to the event? SPEAKER: 300 yards, possibly. TROY KENT: I know you cannot speak for the entire town but would you be willing to talk to your town, maybe Ponce Inlet for that event to hire out a shuttle service during that event's office. SPEAKER: Let me make a comment about that, the way the parade comes down, it comes down South Atlantic. If you step right outside Jerry's Pizza or the vacant land I'm talking about, you can catch the cars coming out the road and then if you go across the street to the beach you can catch them again, there's not a lot to shuttle if that makes sense. TROY KENT: Thank you, that makes a lot of sense. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Any other comments? We need a motion and a second to do one of three things, to allow the city of Ponce Inlet to proceed with their plan to create more parking. One of two things, or certainly to allow them to do that and start this long process, so, we are protected for the future. Michael Dyer? MICHAEL G DYER: Sure, just to clarify, the town's proposal on how they wish to handle would not require approval of the county at all. That is a town decision for the additional parking. JEFFREY S. BROWER: I just thought it would be nice to get a sense of the Council, if they wanted to do that. Vice Chair Kent? TROY KENT: Chairman, I just want tell you and the Council and those listening publicly, I applaud your efforts on beach access and vehicular driving on the beach, and there with you 9/10 times if not 10 out of 10. I am not going to make a motion on this and I will tell you why. Even though I applaud your efforts with it. I want to give Ponce Inlet an opportunity to fix this. If it does not fix it, then I will help lead the charge to say, "hey counsel, this did not work, let's do chairman Brower's idea". This may set us back a little longer but from what I've heard today I feel like this is a common sense approach to solving this. And hopefully making this event even better. I just want to make you aware of why I would not make the motion for it, even though I applaud your efforts. JEFFREY S. BROWER: OK, thank you, Councilman Dempsey? DON DEMPSEY: The same thing as my cohort here. Basically I always prefer to let the local government deal with something. I do not think these guys want somebody from the DeLand telling them how to run their business. I think it's great that we're trying to do it but personally, I think beach driving is awesome, I would let the locals deal with the local issues. Which is why will not make a motion. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Councilman Reinhart? MATT REINHART: I am the same, I'm a big home a role guy and that goes to the county being able to tell the city what to do. If you have a solution, which you proposed, I would like to see you be successful on that. JEFFREY S. BROWER: I appreciate your efforts as well to solve this. The home rule for me is at the beach is the county's home rule, this is our responsibility and we were supposed to do this. I was really hopeful that you would move ahead and find additional parking, so, people are not turned away. And that the County would move ahead, so, that was locked in for future generations. Vice chair, Troy Kent? TROY KENT: Just before this is done, town member White, just want to publicly say it meant a tremendous amount to me with my decision today that you showed up. You're here, not just your manager, but you were here. Your mayor could not be here but you showed up. Thank you. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Thank you, I think we can all see where this is going. I will ask one more time for emotion. Without a motion, there is no need for me to hand off a gavel because there will not be a second to the motion. Ponce Inlet, it's in your hands. We are turning it over to you and asking you to find additional parking, and manage this parade on the public beach. That is item number four, thank you both for coming in, town manager. That brings us to item 5. Which is another beach access issue. I will start with that in just a moment. We do have numerous members of the public that want to speak to this. This item comes to me, I think you will hear this as we go along, but this comes to me from the public. And specifically, from the Main Street merchants Association who came and asked for help in restoring the crowds of people to this very core part of our beach between the boardwalk and East ISP, which was closed about 22 years ago. When that was closed, that whole area died. It had nothing to do with parking. This is not about adding parking to the beach, this is about making this section of beach a destination again. Which it was before, this attracted locals from all over the county, and attracted out-of-towners. This was a popular part of the beach that was not seedy, there were people of all ages there. However, since we remove vehicular access on the beach, we have lost... I do not know what the percentage is, maybe one of the merchants will tell us, but we've lost a lot of what used to be mom-and-pop owners of establishments up and down that section of beach. So, there are many storefronts that are empty. There are restaurants that have gone out of business. The boardwalk is empty, do you have those pictures? Can you just put a few pictures up for me? And I will tell you, this is the boardwalk. This was last week, I went to a graduation at the ocean center, I walked down to the beach to see what the crowd was on the boardwalk. That is the crowd, next photo, please. This is the entrance, a very iconic entrance from Main Street, this beautiful arch, Daytona Beach is investing a lot of money into restoring. "Welcome to the world's most famous beach", there might as well be a sign that says "do not enter", this is blocked off and you cannot use it. While I am standing there, one of the few remaining business owners from the boardwalk came to me and asked me if I was Jeff. I said I was. He asked if I could help him restore this area. "My business is not what it used to be". He is a long-term business owner there and has seen changes. Next slide, please. One of the business owners came to me in person, I've been talking to business owners for several months when they came to be and asked me for help. This was from the Association meeting. This is the beach, there are no people on the beach. Very, very few. There are chairs and umbrellas anticipating, but the people are not there. Next slide. Is that the picture or is that the last one? Pardon me? SPEAKER: I believe you only sent four. JEFFREY S. BROWER: OK, I just was not counting. That is the state of our beach since we decided to do this. Again, just like in the last item, I'm not asking for a vote to put cars back on the beach. I'm asking for a vote to start the process in a timely manner so we will be ahead of the March 4, 2025 legislative session. This does not, in any way, interfere with the city of Daytona Beach's redevelopment areas of the ocean walk, the Hilton, or the Plaza. It is not interfering with that. It does not go that far north. What it would do, is to make this section of beach from East ISP to the boardwalk the destination once again that it was before. This is a core section of our beach that was once thriving and a favorite destination for the people that we represent, our local represent... And tourists alike. At the time, when you could get to the beach there, again, it was not seedy or an eyesore. It was vibrant, fun, exciting and it attracted people from all over Florida. Since this essential beach access was closed down, has declined. The people stop coming. They didn't come because they could park on the beach, they came because the beach was there and it was a beautiful beach to enjoy, and on top of that there was a boardwalk they could go to, Main Street, the businesses along the way. Many of those businesses have closed. Most of them were locally owned by residents who loved our beach and love Daytona as much as we do. The boardwalk has declined. I told you about the business owner that I met there. This is not about making this section of our public beach a parking lot. This is about restoring it as a destination, our own residents. The people that we represent can enjoy once again, and have asked for repeatedly for 22 years. They have been against this closing of the beach. This is a simple ask. Send this back to staff in order to lay out the steps necessary for a timely, to bring back in a timely manner, to comply with state law. I am asking this counsel to make a decision that has proven to have the opposite of the predicted results to reverse that decision. The reason this was done was for economic development, and the belief that it would bring a flock of people in. The exact opposite has happened. It has been devastating to the beachside community, to the businesses that are there, and it took away a favorite part of the beach, from people like me they grew up and worked on the beach. So, I'm asking you to respond to the business owners who still remain and have asked for our help this is both a real economic development question, and a reversal of a failed policy many of our constituents have never liked. It lets remain the 60% of the beach that is closed. It does not touch that. We once had 47 miles of beach that we can drive in and now there are 17. There has been far more beach access taken away than what we have left. This has been a disaster for beach access, as predicted by the late T Wayne Bailey. And I will end my comments here with a quote from him when he chaired the Volusia County charter review committee. It says "the right of public beach access and enjoyment should be clarified and codified. The committee has found that there is a definite need to protect the traditional rights of public access and enjoyment of Volusia Beaches. Today, the public rights of access to the beach, which is a legally protected right, would be meaningless if vehicular access was not allowed." Volusia County charter review committee, final report in 1986. Vehicular access is beach access. Finally, what has changed since 1986? Has this... I got a letter from a constituent that says "you are living in the past. You are living in the 70s and 80s." Let me tell you what has not changed. What I'm asking to do is not create a parking lot on the beach, but create real access for the people that live here and the people that come here who can drive right on the beach, park their car, and for a couple of hours or half a day, the beachside property owners. They get everything they need. They can have it in their car. They can bring out their Hibachi, floats, kids can play, and yes, beach driving has been proven safe for decades. I worked there and we would get maybe one person per year hit by a car and that was somebody backing up and usually didn't even break a leg because the sand would absorb it. That has 10 miles an hour. It has been proven safe. So we allow people to come down and enjoy the beach with everything they need. When we have parking, and we do have parking, right across the street from this area, right across the street from the boardwalk, I parked there. I was one of about seven cars that parked there. People are not parking there and going to the beach and going to the businesses. They are not going to the beach because they don't want to haul there cooler full of food and beverages, their floats, their kids, and granny, and walk across all of that traffic and try to get to the beach and at the end of the day, reverse that process and all of that stuff back. It's what made Daytona Beach famous to begin with, that you could park there and have everything you need to enjoy a day coming from DeLand, DeLeon Springs or Daytona Beach. So that is the purpose of this. I'm asking this counsel to start the process so that we can bring some relief to the business owners and our own constituents who have asked us to open this beach. Councilman Jake Johansson. JAKE JOHANSSON: Thank you, sir. We have done this before, but you are staff in this case as you are proposing this or bringing the facts. I'm not familiar with the Main Street business Association. Will they be presenting or are they here today? JEFFREY S. BROWER: We do have some members. JAKE JOHANSSON: Got it. Did we include, do we need to include other stakeholders? The Chamber of Commerce comes to mind. Did we talk to them about this? What is their input? Are there any other stakeholders, like the city of Daytona? We just saw Ponce Inlet chime in and provide us with some information on an item. Have they chimed in? Those are questions I would ask. This seems something I'm willing to talk about but it seems to be, seems to have come up with not a lot of time for me to ask those questions of those people to prepare and make sure all of the stakeholders have been notified. Plus, as I think we all have, we got a lot of emails this week about this item. And by and large, I would say 85% of it is stick with what you've got, don't allow it. There were a few people that wanted it. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Can you pause for a second? Since you are asking questions I will answer. That is what this is. This is starting that process of reaching out, what you just said has already started. We are getting a lot of emails. This is a long process that takes time, and it gives everybody a chance. Probably the most important thing for the chamber and other stakeholders to find out is the same question that has already come up. What with the FWC say? Is it a major or a minor change? It should be a minor change because this is not a turtle Beach. It is not during turtle season, and it is not at night, which the F WC is allowing other counties to do. I'm going to just stop there because I don't want to… So conclude your questions. JAKE JOHANSSON: I think that is the extent of my questions. I go back to a comment made earlier, which I respect, in the charter it says you can put anything on the agenda. Usually, we discussed things that the agenda before and we agreed to set a date downrange for an item to come back to us so staff can do research or we can do research. In this case, this did not happen. I need more time. I personally need more time. So I have too many questions to ask right now. I will and that right here and wait for the conversation from the business owners and the debate. Thank you. JEFFREY S. BROWER: OK. Again, that is what this is. Time for everybody to do the research. Because it's not going to happen today. It is a long-term process. I don't see any other council members up yet so let's move to the public comments. Derek Green. SPEAKER: Hello, Derek Green from Ormond Beach. Can we ask we go to the third slide that was up earlier? I'm in management with beach rentals and refreshments of Volusia County LLC, we are a contractor with the county to provide beach services. I am an operator of beach rental concessions in the traffic free beach. My family and I have been in business there for 43 years. In that third picture you had, those were my umbrellas, and they were all down. And if all the umbrellas are down, we were either on a red light with lightning in the area, or the wind was 20 miles an hour or greater. So not very representative of a good beach day. I remember 25 years ago, councilmembers discussing this issue for the proposed traffic free area. I remember phrases like "revitalizing the core" and "having an option for beachgoers to have additional beach experience." I have been here these last 25 years and I'm here to say that these statements, as I remember them, have worked. It is a different type of beach experience from a traffic beach. And I understand, cars on the beach in areas without offbeach parking available. But there are people who seek out intent to park in the off beach parking in the core and is popular and it does get crowded. The whole mile on weekends gets packed with people and high tide begins when the incoming tide condenses and forces everyone together. It's hard to keep people out of the one lane emergency lane set up for emergency vehicles. To add another lane to make it two way traffic, and a row for parked cars, and increase the conservation zone from 15 feet to 30 feet, and had space for a U-turn at auditorium, as there is no beach approach at auditorium, will leave no room for the beachgoers who utilized the offbeat parking, and have come for the traditional beach experience. I do not have pictures and I know it's hard for people to get to the beach on say, high tide we can come I have a couple WebCams that usually showed good view of the crowds. Ocean deck, spectrum news 13 WebCam, this usually points to the north showing the south side of the peer. And the Hilton (indiscernible) W KMG click Orlando usually faces south showing the north side of the peer. And you can see the activity and talk about on weakened or high tide weekend and we just do not have the space for what is being proposed. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Thank you, Thomas Caffrey? SPEAKER: Thank you counsel. Thank you Steph. My name is Thomas Caffrey, I am in Ormond Beach resident and a business owner on Main Street in Daytona and current Vice President of the main street merchant Association. He driving for us, I grew up here, I went to Bonner Elementary the other end of Main Street that was called Fairview back then. This is always been here and this is always been something that I thought was wonderful. We did this as a family, when I was a kid, into my early 20s, they got rid of it in March 2000. Right around there. I guess there was a vote that it would be revitalized, I was too young to pay attention to that. I do not see any revitalization over there. All I see is vacant lots and vacant buildings. Torn down monuments. I get a little emotional about it because it really is terrible what is going on over there. There is nothing good about it, it's really, really, poor. The homeless that hang out under all the monuments that are there, are terrible. It's not because they don't have other places to go but there is nobody there to kind of shoo them off. I watched all the buildings get torn down, historic buildings, buildings that were near and dear to me. On behalf of Main Street Merchant Association, we really want us back. We want this to be a discussion, we want this to be better for the area. I do not think was being done right now is there. The parking lots that are there are not parking lots, they are torn down shelves from buildings that they are using to park parks on. Nothing is revitalized. We used to have the busiest McDonald's and Taco Bell in the country, we do not have anything over there. We strive some really exceptional places over there, they've all gone and they did not stop leaving until after 2000 when the beach was closed. It is really all I have to say, I appreciate you guys having this, it's really, really important to us. This is an amazing situation that you guys are hearing it kind of quick, in your opinion, but this is a conversation that has been had by this counsel for a very, very long time since it was closed. This balances back and forth. I note the difficult one, and I appreciate it. Thank you. JEFFREY S. BROWER: John Nicholson. SPEAKER: John Nicholson, Daytona Beach side. I've only been in Daytona Beach 40 years. When I hear people say that they have been there and this is what used to be like, they are wearing rose-colored glasses. I've heard that they lost all the speech, there used to be a place called adults and on the walls had all these old pictures. In the water you to go out to the casino, 50 years ago, hundred years ago. Now the water is only going out to the casino, the exact same location. How much should we actually lose? When I first got here we used to walk the beach, about 5 miles. When I go up towards Bel Air Plaza this is the old Bernardini house. The sand dune in front of it was 20 foot high. And then hurricane Floyd came in and all our sand dunes vanished, guess what we found at the very bottom of the sand dune? A seawall. Nobody builds a seawall 20 feet down under the ground without a reason. At the time that place was built in the 60s, the seawall was needed. The sand was that far down. We went 26 years without a major hurricane before Floyd. Now they are saying there is no development, but what you do not understand is that the reason that it stopped, the city stopped it. If you look at what Anderson proposed, it worked. In front of my house, there are seven properties developed. There is the old Marriott, the Hilton, Ocean walk, Wyndham, Daytona grand, the resort. All of that was built until we got to the portion where the pictures were taken. The boardwalk is, 20 years of a lawsuit. This was just settled last year. Like a week before Anderson died, and he did not have enough time to build it. It was prevented from being built and in the area south of Main Street, where they are talking about there were seven proposals in the city turned each and everyone down. Three condo hotels, and the Hall of Fame, the swimming Hall of Fame from Fort Lauderdale was supposed to go in. They turned it down. Just two or three years ago, there were two hotels for just south of Main Street and the city felt them up and would not let them go in. The city is causing all of this. It is not the project, the project worked. The city prevented it. Yes, it is true, when Main Street stopped, this was the highest grossing approach in the county. Tons of money, it stopped dead. And that really if you watch the stores close down mainstream. (Bell rings) SPEAKER: Alright, do not vote for this. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Tom Guest (?). SPEAKER: thank you Mr Chairman and members of the Council, city and county staff. My name is Tom Guest, I reside in Ormond Beach. I've had businesses in metal properties on Main Street since 1985. I've seen a lot of things that have happened you depicted some of those very, very well. I do not have to repeat a lot of that. But you did say that this was a project that was brought up and did not work. It has not worked. So, let's try something else. When there was beach access and driving and parking on the beach, I'm also president of the mainstream merchants Association. We have discussed this and everybody in the Association is pretty much in tune with getting it back to what it was. When we go back to 22 years ago, or 25 years ago and driving was taken off the beach, people used to come down and go to the beach. They used to park on the beach and if they got titled in on the beach they would come walking up Main Street. Main Street was a thriving place back in the day. There was a lot of things that happened to make Main Street what it is today, there is no need to go into all of that. But the first year that driving was taken off the beach, the first summer the main street merchant suffered a 50% loss of their business. That is how much it has hurt Main Street. It is very important to us, you said that this was a long process to get something done, let's get the process started, so, we can get back to what it was when I opened the business there in 1985. I have seen a lot of businesses go away, this was not the only thing that, there were a lot of other things. A lot of us have been concerned with Main Street and beachside and know some of the things that have happened. I do not have time to go into all of this but I came down, I moved down here from Maine. I lived it down at Wells Beach, there is a section of that beach that is Moody Beach which is now a private beach. The people that own houses along that beach on the beach. We want to see something like this happen? Let's open this up and draw some of these vacationers back that want to drive on the beach. Thank you. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Thank you, sir. Amy Pyle? SPEAKER: Hi there. My name is Amy Pyle, I am a 14 year resident in the Daytona Beach Main Street redevelopment area, I live two blocks from Main Street. I sit on Daytona Beach Main Street redevelopment board and the bike week a task force, not representing those boards are the people on them with these comments, but you might find that both of those boards would support this move. During many of our meetings, we discussed how to bring more activity to Main Street. I believe when Main Street access to the beach was close to driving, it seriously inhibited the business and activity there. MainStreet is essentially a dead end and it looks like one, you saw the pictures. Right now the beautiful coquina archway at the foot of the peer is dingy, dark, and unattractive. It's a mess. The gates at both Main Street and Harvey Avenue look kind of pointless and uninviting. Sometimes in a state of disrepair or hanging halfway open. The properties on either side of Harvey have become blighted and trashy, played with graffiti. For decades it has looked like something is really missing there. As if we were waiting for something to happen, and someone to care again, maybe this move is the way to do that. I have a few neighbors who would rather have no driving on the speech. But we can still have it all to ourselves, most of the year, and especially at high tide, during the summer, early mornings, we have plenty of time to enjoy that on our own. You will hear from the main Street merchants, which you just it, opening it up for driving will bring customers to their starving businesses, shattered buildings will be reopened, activity will discourage vagrants and vandalism. Parking woes can be alleviated, we always talk about a lack of parking in that area. Beach access will instantly improve for local underserved families, as well as physically challenged individuals. It is good for everybody. But most importantly, it's the restoration of a legacy of beach driving in Daytona that must be preserved. This is something that makes us unique, I hope that this discussion is fruitful, the city of Daytona and Volusia County will pair this with the momentum for massive improvements to East (unknown name), and initiate a promotional campaign that will make headlines and call the tourist boom. Imagine the headline that people will be the first to drive for Main Street to Daytona Beach again, the first time in decades. You always have a chance to vote no later, but let's get the information. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Mike Dennis. SPEAKER: Mike Dennis, Ormond Beach Florida. And traveling around Florida, I have seen success everywhere on the beach. Except here. One suggestion is to just put blinders on and say this is the best we can do, but why not look into it? What will it cost? Staff time? No, you guys are supposed to direct staff. So, if they come up with a whole lot of problems, then we can't do it. But if they come up with none, geez, maybe we can do it. Again, as you travel through Florida, look at other beach towns. I am amazed at some of the West Palm Beach for example, last time I was there there was a three foot cliff in the sand. We have the most beautiful beach in Florida, I think, but I am prejudiced. I have been here since '56, so, I am a long time... I have a lot of sand in my shoes and so on. Take the blinders off and look at what it will cost us. Look at what the possibilities are. Thank you. JEFFREY S. BROWER: Ann Ruby? SPEAKER: Ann Ruby. In my 50 years I never thought I would go of the drive and say this a beautiful, what I do find puzzling is how do Daytona Beach look as bad as it doesn't I think we have a rebirth of the Merchants Association, I think they are asking for one lever, to consider pulling this lever to get the information. You are not voting today to approve or disapprove of this get the information. There are so many things the city and the county could do to work together to improve Main Street, parking lot C is a mess, we need a trolley system to connect then lot and Granada to beachside Beach Street, there are so many things the city and the county could be working together on and this is one of them. It could take years to get beach driving actually restored, at that point you can hear from the other people, you can actually make the definitive vote. But without the information you are just hamstringing them, saying we are going to take that solution away from you. So why not look into this, get the information. And the stakeholders you want to hear from? The chamber, the hotels, let them come up solutions on how they can help make the beachside be less blighted in the core tourist areas. They don't get to say no we don't want that. It's gotta be a joint solution. And I think tonight this could start with just asking for the information, learning about what it's gonna take, how long is it gonna take? If this is the tenure process the merchants could've revitalized it all by themselves by then, but let's start it, I think it's important and I never thought I would ever say that. Thank you. JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you. That's the end of the people that signed up to speak during public comment. One of the things I considered when the merchants came to me and said do this, I have spent a lot of time in this area on the beach, but one of the things I considered was the vendors that are there, a long time ago when I worked there and the beach was absolutely packed, the concessioner there was Bill Finley, floats into chairs and umbrellas, he became a millionaire there, and he paid the lifeguards who sat in front of his concession – he would pay them extra to keep the floats in waist deep water because he didn't want to lose any of his floats. But the fact that it was beach driving didn't hurt their business. When I was there and took the pictures that you saw, and I'm not arguing with the vendors that came here, I support the vendors and I think – have looked at your business and it looks good, it looks sharp, your equipment looks good, you are doing every thing right. But I walked the beach, I walked the boardwalk, I don't know – it was overcast but there was not lightning there that day. What I did see, somebody sent me this morning a video I did four years ago during the campaign, same area took a video of the beach took a video of the boardwalk it looked exactly the same as those pictures that I put. There's not a soul on the beach. Finally, I said in the video oh wait here comes to people walking down the boardwalk. This is revitalization. You have heard from local business owners that have their life invested in this and they are asking us for help, the help is not some scary thing as the last speaker said it is taking a little step forward, an incremental step to get the information that we need to know if this is wise or not. I believe it is wise, I'm not asking you, I'm not pushing you, this counsel, into making an all or nothing decision, I want to help you get the information that will need. There's absolutely a direct correlation between the death of this section of the beach and the removal of beach driving in that area. Don't take this away from the merchants that have come here and asked us for our help. Vice chair Troy Kent? TROY KENT: Thank you, Chairman. For recognizing me. But also thank you for bringing this up. In advocating for a possible change here. Council and those listening, those of you who know me know I was born in Halifax hospital, you know that I've lived here my entire life, I wasn't surprised to find out that in the early and mid-90s Taco Bell in Daytona Beach Beachside at the number one sales - I wasn't surprised when I heard this - for the entire nation. When you went midnight to three in the morning, there was a line out the door, behaviors were appropriate and the place was making money hand over fist. So to hear that there were others that had the highest sales in the area doesn't surprise me Heather, do you mind if I asked Mr Cafferty to come up? Is that OK, Mr Chairman? JEFFREY S BROWER: Is OK for the rest of the Council doesn't object. TROY KENT: Mr Cafferty, how long have you owned your business on Main Street? SPEAKER: Six years about. TROY KENT: Had the doors open for about six years? SPEAKER: Yes, sir. TROY KENT: Why knowing beach access would shut down there? SPEAKER: Probably a longer answer than I would have time for. We bought the building as an investment, we planned on doing venting like every one else does in the area, so we started doing it that way, first October we didn't occupy the building, we rented it out for a handsome amount of money. Then we decided we didn't want to do that anymore, we wanted to develop the building, we wanted to restore the building and make it better. Not just do this, to something better. So we started with pallet classes and a wine bar on Main Street. We did it that way. That was the whole thing, we didn't even want to be a bar, they wouldn't allow us to do BYOB as an art studio they said that's Bottle club so we had to revamp that. Then for the hop cycle we do the pedal bike don't do that anymore too much insurance too expensive to maintain, that we became a brewery and we had to go to the city and change the law to promote a brewery in the district because they wouldn't allow it. TROY KENT: I applaud you for trying. And you are open year-round? And you keep people employed? SPEAKER: Yes. TROY KENT: I applaud what you're doing it takes initiative and guts, thank you, I don't have any other questions. Mrs Ruby and Mr Cafferty, others who spoke, I want to tell you over 10 years ago I served on the beachside redevelopment committee. I was Ormond Beach's representative. There were roughly 15 to 20 people on this committee. There is a novel of recommendations that this very smart group of women and men who work for a year presented to the County of Volusia and the city of Daytona Beach. I would recommend you go to the city of Daytona Beach and say, "Where is this document? And why haven't you implemented any of it?" I think it's a great first step because like I said this was a lot of work by a lot of people for a year of their life for it to be shelved somewhere and it is just collecting dust, so I want to make sure that that is there. I grew up in Ormond Beach and surfed across the street that I tell you I would go to this location often when the surf was good and we would drive on the beach we would park right there, there were appropriate behaviors, back then beach Rangers were there, lifeguards were there, concessionaires were there and everything seemed to work. There's no doubt in my mind that this decision back in 2000 created essentially a private beach and I can see why certain business owners who make money from the people that stay in the hotels don't want anything to change, but you have a Main Street that is starving, and for you sir, sorry I don't remember your name, but you said the first year it was implemented there was a 50% decrease in sales, it just is gut wrenching to hear that. Who thought this through? Stop the insanity, OK? The proof is in the pudding, look at the results. This isn't a happy, cheerful place. I want a place like Shells to go eat at like I did when I was younger, go me with Lynn Flinders, Director of the Oshin center, lovely lady, thank you George for hiring her, but you go meet with her and then say, "Hey let's go to lunch around here." I don't know where you're going. So Chairman, I will make a motion after I hear from everybody else to direct staff to bring this back for more information. We are not voting on this tonight to change it, you know, the things we have to do, but this is one that there is meat on this bone and I want to chew on it a little bit. JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you. Councilman Dempsey? DON DEMPSEY: I agree with everything you just said and thanks, Chair, for bringing this up. He's not bitter. I don't go to the beach anymore because I'm old, but when I was younger back in the 1900s with Mr Nicholson down here, watching him with his swimcap. I remember it was busy at those times, we would go to the boardwalk play video games and the arcades, get ice cream, walkaround, get my seafood, McDonald's, filet of fish. I always remember being busy. I'm a Westside guy, haven't been back there, but I will take your word that it's dead, the economy down there is dying and we do a lot to help other businesses in Daytona we did Daytona one we do the main Street revitalization which I've always said makes it even harder for the Main Street people to survive. I knew some business owners on Main Street back when it was thriving talking about how difficult it was to maintain a business year-round, I know some seasonal guys that did very well during bike week events and race weekend all that but I think it's great, we need to look into it, I don't necessarily trust the wisdom of our predecessor councils so this is something that is important enough to revitalize, I wish you could go back and undo some other stuff from previous councils, but at least this is a good one to start with, so I am in favor of looking into it. Not saying I'm voting for but we do need to look into it to help the merchants. So I'm supporting you to. JEFFREY S BROWER: You Councilman Reinhart? MATT REINHART: Thank you, chair. Again to echo what Mr Johansson said didn't have a lot of time to look into it and I understand. As far as getting information to give us time to have those conversations. I actually only had the ability to talk to a few people, one of which was the sheriff's office because public safety is a big concern of mine and maybe I dig too deep into it inking about the type of vehicles that we are driving on the beach when that driving was allowed. Different from what we have now. I mean we did a great job getting rid of the squad of trucks with visibility, I think that is a plus. We are asking what emergency response in that area, and oftentimes they said that they wanted to drop a line to get people out because at certain times it is packed and people have become accustomed to the fact that it is one area of the beach that is not driving. That being said, I understand your concern, too, and the fact of your businesses. Knowing all this, I have a question for you, George... We are not going to be able to do this until November, when we can talk with the individual that is in the seat, whoever that may be or any of the state legislatures because they're all up for reelection so there's no guarantee of who the individuals will be, so you are not to have the conversations until that time. I'm a step-by-step person and I like to know what those answers are. Does it warrant taking it further? I leave it to you, George, if that is a question you can ask, is that true? GEORGE RECKTENWALD: Well... The timing part is correct. It will take time to discuss with our legislative delegation, and really, that is something they are going to look to what you guys are saying. Is this something that the body wants? Of course, also, it would be on the constituents that will be in play. Like I say, the city of Daytona Beach, what does their body want to do? So, I would say, before we approach anybody that way, we need to know what our official stance is and what their official stances. MATT REINHART: Before you can take it to the state? DANNY ROBINS: Point of order. JEFFREY S BROWER: I have a reply to your question as well. What is your point? DANNY ROBINS: Just to stay in process, we are always in debate, if we can call for a motion and second so we can do it by the book? Thank you. JEFFREY S BROWER: We are doing it by the book. He asked questions of the County manager. There might have been some debate. Troy asked questions. Don, you are guilty. Unless you want to override my vote, I would say your point is not well taken because everybody is asking questions right now. This is important. DANNY ROBINS: Chairman, respectfully, I do not see it was not important. I get we need to talk about it but I want to follow the process because there is 30 minutes of statement. I will do whatever the rule is, council. JEFFREY S BROWER: I have a question for Michael Dyer. Matt said the process was going to the state legislature first, in my opinion, the way I understood was, what was laid out here was the first step is to look out the incidental take permit and find out whether or not the FWC thinks it is major or minor. Am I wrong? Is that the first of? Or is the first of going... I think the legislature needs that information, as well. MICHAEL G DYER: I mentioned before there's four issues we have to deal with, silos of issues. You have to really deal with them at the same time. So, you have the state law issue to restore beach driving, you have to get the delegation and after support before moving forward. You have the federal department, as you said, about working with the service on whether they were treated as a major or minor amendment. You have the issue of the customary use and also contractual commitments. There is a development agreement between city of Daytona and Ocean Water Properties, and there may be others, things that are potential obstacles at this point. I think we need to explore all of those. JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you. It's a long process. Vice chair Kent? TROY KENT: George and/or Michael Dyer, what elected body makes the final decision on the beaches in Volusia County? I don't care who answers it. One or the other. MICHAEL G DYER: it depends on the issue. The council has sole regulatory authority. The legislator has authority over the beach driving issue, and federal government is ATP. TROY KENT: I do not hear you say any city. GEORGE RECKTENWALD: The city would come in with whatever contractual relationships that may exist due to the fact that we made agreements at the time, when it was taken off with, I think, some of the development committee that was there. That would have to be researched. TROY KENT: Gotcha. I don't know that I am going to eventually vote in support of this. I never would have voted to take the driving off, ever, I never would have done that but what is done is done and I don't have a DeLorean or any type of time machine to go back, at 88 mph. When I was a city commissioner, city of Ormond Beach, there's a lot of things I wanted to change but the beach because I felt like this beach was mismanaged by this county and I will just say, I can appreciate that we want to hear from Daytona Beach, but it's one of the reasons I ran to have a seat at the table instead of being served on the menu. Mr Reinhart, I appreciate your comments, but as far as what staff is working on, and George do not take this the wrong way because I am the fan of yours and what you do with staff – you do what this directive bodied directs you to, period. You do not lead us, we lead you. We set policy direction, period. If we wanted to go on the front burner of staff, we tell you it is on the front burner with staff. That is how it is. That is how it is supposed to be. I will, make a motion at this time, to direct staff to bring this item back to us and look at all the pros and cons of bringing beach driving back from International Speedway Boulevard to Auditorium Boulevard. In the motion, George or Mike, do you need a date certain to bring that back? You don't? OK. I am not going to put a date certain on that, I am going to say whenever staff can bring them back. There is my motion. JEFFREY S BROWER: We have a motion on the floor by by vice chair Kent to send this back just after look at all the different parameters, the good and bad, and pros and cons. No date certain. Is there a second? DON DEMPSEY: Second. JEFFREY S BROWER: Second by Don Dempsey, thank you. Now we are in debate. Councilman Johansson? JAKE JOHANSSON: Thank you. I am really not opposed to this discussion, however, I do want to reflect back to our early in the year, I think it was February, I know is February 20. We had a conversation about our goals, and where this particular item fit in a goal, as it pertained to the state of the county. I suppose it could be loosely placed into one of these goals. But, I don't know where. If it does get voting from following discussion, I would really like to know where it fits, and why it is important enough to bring right now. It was not a County Council goal, we never talked about it in goal setting, and I am not opposed to this, but it is not a goal. I think it takes away from some of the stuff that we would rather – well that council would rather do, not individually. With that, I am trying to, like we sometimes say, I want to try to stand on task. I think the conversation and the communication with the stakeholders, the Chamber, the other stakeholders, the city, who we do impact. We just said we did not want to impede on Ponce Inlet for their program. It is our beach. I don't want to impact Daytona without having a conversation. I think those conversations can be had without directing George to have that conversation. Up until this point, I have not heard people clamoring to put driving back on the beach in this area. Although, again, I am ready to discuss it. But they are talking about flooding, and talking about other things. I'm wondering what the importance of this is. It doesn't, no cost, it is not like we can have a conversation and not incur lawyer time, and executive leadership time, talking with all these people. It does come at a cost. Danny and I were talking about a book I am reading on acquiescence – maybe this is not the right time. Maybe it is, but maybe it is not the right time to talk to the state on getting driving back on the beach when we have other things that are important that we discussed with the state and resolved. I have seen asking the state for too many things at once means you get none. I am a little conflicted right now on the timing of this. Those are my concerns. Appreciate the time, thank you. JEFFREY S BROWER: Councilman Robins? DANNY ROBINS: Thank you, Chair. I want to talk about the correlation between business and why things are the way they are in Daytona Beach. At times I have known every square inch of the city. In the 90s and 2000, what is different? How do we get there? What do we have that we do not have now? We had over 100 special events, that is the start. I have set up before on the Council, Daytona Beach as our economic driver, we better be thinking about other things because we don't have special events. We claim to be a special events town that has no special events, or very few, I can count on one hand. We had MTV. We had Hawaiian Tropic events. We had a wide open spring break, no hold bars. When I was a kid in my eyes light up, "Oh my God, this is amazing!" Why got here in 2003, little bit different. It wasn't just that. We heard vending like everybody else, it's seasonal, why is that? Is that the business model? Is it because we don't have special events? Crime. I can tell you firsthand, crime in Daytona Beach is worse than Deltona. Back then, we do not have the population that we have now. It is doubled. OK. Staffing police officers is an issue, we cannot get them in the city. It has always been that way, it was like that before I was a cop there. It was like that when I was a cop there and it's going to be like that after I was a cop there. The transients. We have a lot of transient activities in our beachside and business and core area. You have to ask yourself, once again, "Why aren't businesses coming here? Do you want to bring your family here?" I will not bring my family through or to Daytona Beach without the scanner app on my phone to see what is going on, and when. Because I know that some of these core areas we expect our tourists to go, their public safety issues, graffiti, transients, drunk, prostitutes. They are everywhere. Beach driving is not the sole issue or catalyst. It is not. I agree with Mr. Kent, if it was up to maybe us, I would not have messed with it. I would have tried cleaning up some of the other areas before taking this big leap. But to go down this road, and try to do some of this stuff now, there is a lot of other things that need to be cleaned up before we put this cart before the horse. I believe this is premature, I don't know whether the motion on the floor, that's just my opinion because I've, like all of her other council members, this isn't the first time the subject has come up. At any point in time, we can request information, we heard this chairman 2021 when we took office, I believe you brought it back in 2022 for discussion, then now we have all the information. All we have to do is literally type the two line email, staff may I have the background information on this, enter. Then we get it. What I don't want to see now is getting bogged down, even though this is a valid issue, we had members of-- let's say there's a way to do this, an efficient and effective way to do this, we have unanswered issues right now with the city of Daytona Beach. This is going to affect them and their merchants and their businesses. We need to have them at the table so we are not on the menu OK? We have thousands of yards of linear feet – sorry, thousands of yards of easement between (indiscernible) and Main Street we would have to lock down we don't have beachfront hotels beachfront residents here we have mainstream merchants which is great, we don't have FDEP here. One thing with our state we can tap into lobbyists. We haven't done that, anyone of us could do that and initiate conversation. Council, I have a couple more things, 30 seconds? Thank you. State Representatives. We haven't contacted the sheriff yet to see how much manpower we will have, see what kind of lifeguards we are going to have, but with all this my point is it's a valid topic. All this legwork that I said can easily be done and put together on a silver platter by any individual Appear if they wanted to prior to even bringing this up. We saw with the dog beach we saw when it came to sexual offenders, we saw when it came to public safety issues that several of us initiated. All of this stuff is readily available. Chairman, if you need more time to get this I will be willing to hear your story and bring it back, but I think this is premature. Staff has a full plate. I will support you if you bring this stuff back to us but to have them chasing a windmill is not the direction I would like to see it go. Thanks. JEFFREY S BROWER: Councilman Dempsey? DON DEMPSEY: I was really torn on this. I did some thinking over the weekend and the timing, right now we don't know who the legislature is this going to be representing this area but short of a referendum on beach driving what better way for the voters to express their desires then voting for the candidate that sees us the way they want. You may have one candidate for beach driving one candidate against it. Who better than the voters on election day to determine which person they want in office? The ones supporting beach driving with one against beach driving? I was a supporter back in the times event TV I remember working the substation and the ocean said we had a portable jail, we process people right there in and out for every misdemeanor and it was a mill. But I will also say hello thriving the economy was back then, it was thriving back then even during nonevents times it was always crowded. I just always remember it was a good time, doing beach stuff, walking around, like I said I hadn't been over there in 20 years but I've taken everybody word for it how bad the economy is over there on Beach Street, and we've created competing areas with the Beach Street revitalization in Daytona, these guys really have an appeal bottle on our hands. I do think it's right to talk about. I think the timing of this issue might actually be perfect because it is election season and it might be something that should be discussed and debated by the potential candidates at the legislative level, local level, and let the voters express their desires at the ballot box. I'm actually in favor of this now. I hate to make the staff go through this again but like I said, I don't necessarily like the decisions of our predecessor counselors. If I could-- this is our first time, I've never got to vote on this, 20 years ago. If I could get in a Superman costume and go back in time and go back in time and undo Sunrail I would undo Sunrail in a second if we could. But here we are. If I was on the Council 20 years ago I'd probably be for getting rid of beach driving as well, I just think it's fair to bring this back up for discussion. Thanks. JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you, I will take my second bite. It won't be long. Kind of trying to get a feel for where we are on the Council, there's only six of us here today. If it's a 3-3 vote it fails, so we need a fourth person to say I want to move this ahead and let the public in the cities, everybody, hear the debate which will take some time. Where does this fit into our goals? I don't see them yet, I asked for the goals to be put up with there's a lot going on. But this fits in I would say because of its economic development and we've all stated appear that we want to help businesses thrive, that we want to bring more businesses here. Let them see a council that is friendly to business and giving them just one more tool in their arsenal to be successful. It's not the silver bullet, the Main Street Association has to go out and do other things as well to be successful. But this is a tool that they need and why now? Because they asked for it. Because for three years I've had the public ask for it and it's, you know, to table it, to bring it back I already did that. It got tabled and I brought it back because of this Merchant Association that sits in front of you here in the public that said we really need your help to do this. Why aren't businesses coming here? I'm not even going to go there. But I am going to say this is an opportunity to show them that we listen to our businesses and we try and do everything we can to make their lives-- to make the possibility of them being successful a real possibility, and that we don't stay in their way. It's interesting, everybody is for beach driving, well now we have a chance to vote on. We actually have a chance to say yes, I am for beach driving. Let's vote to see if it's even possible in this area. That's what stands here. We can't say "I'm for it, I'm for it!" And take this tool away from the merchants and the residents. The city will come to the table as we go through this process, the chamber will come to the table, it gives-- that's the process, it gives everybody a chance to come and speak to this. I want to give the people that came here that represents all the merchants on Main Street, I want to let you know that this council supports economic development, and we will dig in and see if this is possible. And it will take a permit, the state legislature, I had a town hall meeting last night with representative Webster Burnaby who was a staunch each driving supporter when he ran for County Council. We don't know if he will get reelected, he's also up for reelection, so with them, let them come to the table. Why now? Because it is a pressing need on the core beachside that has been ruined when we did this. (indiscernible) reverse the decision that hurt beachside merchants and residents alike. I'm asking for one of the three people on this side just to give it the opportunity, the side of the dais, who have reasonable questions and are not ready to vote today for the final thing but I'm asking you to vote a to let it take this little step forward so we can get engaged. I think it is that important. Vice Chair Kent? TROY KENT: Thank you, Chairman. I will make that comment in just a second. I will just say, even though I made the motion for this, I want you chairman to know and council, I want you to know and the public is here this listening. It doesn't mean I'm going to support this, but I'm supporting having the conversation. I promise this Council something, that included all of you. I'm not going to play politics here, I'm going to state some facts. I don't know Jeff Brower, really. I know he didn't support me in the election. Too bad, because I won. But he made a decision. His decision. He didn't know me, he doesn't know me, we've never had a phone conversation, we don't hang out, nothing like that. But I promise this council, if you have something that is important to you, it is important to me. We are moving the three day waiting period on gun sales. Creating a program at the jail so inmates can have a farm to table sort of situation there. Talking about motocross in a wildly inappropriate location. OK? But, darn it, you read our rules. This isn't a one person gladiator show. You better have some people that like your ideas, or you are going to get nothing accomplished. Like me or don't like me, agree with me or don't agree with me come for all of us there are things you bring up that are nice and things you bring up that I think are wackadoodle. Let's have the discussion because each of you represents 100,000 people and if it's important to you it's important to me and I'm going to offer you the exact same thing I'm giving every councilmember, nothing more, nothing less. I think it is disingenuous to not give you that opportunity. That's why I made the motion and that's why I stand by the motion, I hope that you all would do that for me. You can shoot me down with it if you don't like the idea once you've heard all the fact is, but not having the conversation, not having the conversation about getting our local Volusia County residents on the beach for no extra charge with their vehicles. Notice how I said no extra charge and not free, because they are already paying for it. And guess what the consultants gave us 8 million reasons why this is such a good idea, 8 million new dollars, which I'm hoping will be there soon. If you did allow me to have a conversation it would've been dead in the water and that doesn't feel good. And I want to give you the same opportunity. To be successful on something that is important to you, which is why want to support this today. JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you. Councilman Johansson? JAKE JOHANSSON: I want to add to the public is aware, we had a few merchants here that supported driving on the beach, and thank you very much for coming. In addition to that, we received a bunch of email from a bunch of hoteliers in the area. I consider them business owners in the area, too. By and large, not 100%, but by and large, they are opposed to it, for opposite reasons, different reasons. They don't live here. One of them is a foreign investor. All of that. Doesn't matter. They are business owners here. And they have a right to express their thoughts of how their tenants, the people that fill the beds, and what they think and those folks get feedback and provide it. Part of that input is important to me, too. Like I said, the majority of them are not for it. I have to take that in to consideration as well. And by the way, getting that information, happened pretty quick, happen within days. So I'm a little bit... I go along with Mr Robins on this. I think more homework could have been done prior to bring it to us. I don't necessarily see the rush and therefore, I am a little less torn than Mr Dempsey on it, at this point. Thank you. JEFFREY S BROWER: Councilman Robins. DANNY ROBINS: Thank you. I want to offer some clarity. Karissa, can you restate the motion for us? KARISSA GREEN: The motion was to direct staff to bring the item back to us and look at all of the pros and cons to bring back driving from International Speedway Boulevard to Auditorium Boulevard in Daytona Beach. DANNY ROBINS: Thank you. That was awesome. OK. To bring back information, my point was, council, we want to take a vote to request information that none of us need a vote or permission to ask for that information. That is the motion, essentially. None of us need the permission or the boat to ask for information, for staff to bring it back. To paint this picture that this council does not support economic develop and, Chair, or the prior council, is highly false. And to the point, Chairman, about two years ago you voted to cut the economic development budget by 2 to 4 million, so I just want to be clear on that that that statement is false. I don't want this council or myself or anybody to get that black eye or paint a picture to our business community that we rely on, that we do not support our businesses because we absolutely do. At this point, we are looking to bring back information. I don't have a problem with that. But, at this point, we know that we do not need a vote to ask for information from our staff. This isn't our first rodeo. It is to be politically symbolic? I want to be effective and efficient with our time. There is a way to do this in a process. It is not against the merchants, nothing against beach driving. There is some political theater here. It was impeccably timed, and we are voting on essentially something we don't need permission to vote on. We don't need permission, the council's permission to get this information. Essentially, that is the motion. I'm just putting the dots together for you. JEFFREY S BROWER: Was that it? OK. I don't see anybody else up. That was almost an accusation. So I'm going to respond to it. I do not use my five minutes. What you just said is actually false. I did need to ask for that information. I went to the County Attorney, and asked him, and he said, "Bring it before the Council. Get them to agree to allow us to dig in and bring you back this information." There is a lot here that has to be done. This vote, I am not asking you to vote on beach driving today. I am asking you to allow the County Attorney to do what he has told me needs to be done, that he wrote in the package for this item, of the four things that have to be done. In order to do that, he needs this council to direct him to do that. That is what the vote is for, and that is what I am asking. I don't see anybody else that wants to talk. So I am going to ask Karissa to call for the vote, to move this ahead in an incremental step to bring back the information that – to direct the county staff to bring back the information that they have told me they need County direction, County Council direction for. Councilman Robins? DANNY ROBINS: For the record, I believe Mr. Dyer did provide this information on beach driving, sir, when you had brought a backup in 2022. We had an agenda item on it. He did provide information and I believe it was in, attached to the agenda item. I saw the headlines for last night when I google searched it, I saw the TV update on it. It was from somewhere in 2022, maybe October. JEFFREY S BROWER: Different council. MICHAEL G DYER: You and I have the information from... JEFFREY S BROWER: It has not been voted for on this council. Karissa, can you call the vote? (Roll Call) TROY KENT: Point of clarification. JEFFREY S BROWER: what is your point? TROY KENT: Mr. Dyer, if this is 323 vote, does it die? MICHAEL G DYER: that is correct. TROY KENT: If I am on the winning side of it, can I bring it backup? The answer is, I want to hear it publicly. MICHAEL G DYER: You can make a motion to reconsider. TROY KENT: Mr. Santiago is not here and we are not a full council. I'm going to play a little chess right now, news Journal, any media that is here, I am going to vote no on this so I have an opportunity to bring this back about Mr. Santiago is here because I think this needs a full discussion of the entire council. It puts a lot of weight on Mr. Santiago. Hey, that is part of the job. Mr. Dyer, is that correct? I can bring this back up if I am on the winning side of this? MICHAEL G DYER: if you are on the prevailing side, yes. If you are on the prevailing side you make a separate motion to reconsider, it would come back. TROY KENT: I would need majority. Mr. Santiago to be with the majority, and he may not. To the Main Street merchants and all of those out there, this is strictly a chess move. No. KARISSA GREEN: Mr. Brower? JEFFREY S BROWER: Yes. The motion fails for this time, 2 yeses, 4 nos. thank you. Don't come up yet. Thank you, all, who came in. We will take a break until 7:30 PM. It is almost 7:00 PM. It is almost 7:00. (Break until 7:30 PM) (Music plays) SPEAKER: Welcome to the Volusia County Council meeting. The meeting will begin in five minutes. (Music plays) SPEAKER: Welcome to the Volusia County Council meeting. The meeting will begin in two minutes. (Music plays) JEFFREY S BROWER: OK, we will resume the meeting at 7:31, with item 6. Amendment number one to agreement number WGO36 from the Florida Department of Environmental Protection and budget resolution appropriating grant funds. BENJAMIN BARTLETT: Thank you, Chair, everyone, before you on this item as an amendment to our grant agreement with the DEP for an additional revenue of $25 million for the upgrades to our Southwest regional water reclamation facility down in DeBary. This brings our total grant funded amount of money on this project to just over $60 million. We are currently in design anticipate awarding for construction in this fall and completing said construction at the end of 2026 and recommend approval of the amendment as well as a budget resolution for previous grant from the water management District as well as this amount of money. Happy to answer any questions you may have. JEFFREY S BROWER: Motion to approve? Motion to approve by vice chair Troy Kent. Second by Councilman Johansson. You don't mind if I give it to him? JAKE JOHANSSON: He can take it. JEFFREY S BROWER: Any questions? We also have Michael Ulrich here-- oh you are here for the next one. BENJAMIN BARTLETT: Showed out to Mike, he's doing all the work on this one. JEFFREY S BROWER: Any questions? Motion carried 6 to 0. Item 7 contract with AMCON Development Group LLC for the Spruce Creek fly in water treatment plant improvements. BENJAMIN BARTLETT: This is an update for the Spruce Creek water treatment facility much needed work needs to be done of their, blood work needs to be done there to bring up to current standards. Those responsible bid was 1.8 billion from AMCON and we move for approval. JEFFREY S BROWER: Vice President Kent moves to approve, second from Councilman Reinhart, staff discussion? All in favor say 'aye'? All opposed. Motion carried 6 to 0, well done. Item 8. Discussion on removal of criteria four and five from consideration and review of variance applications and approval for the growth management Director or designee to waive a two-year severance for variance applications. CLAY ERVIN: Good evening, Clay Ervin, back in March Councilmember Santiago mentioned there was some conflict with staff and making recommendations, and the PLDRC, sorry the planning land development recommendation committee reviewed it, going back to 2021 with the planning and land development relation commission plan was to drop 2/5 criteria completely out of consideration. We currently have five criteria staff evaluate, they have to meet all five for staff to recommend approval. First where conditions exist as circumstances exist for the circumstances and recommendation are no results of the property owner and literal interpretation of the code will deprive the property owner of rates shared by others. To we were talking about possibly getting rid of our the variance granted is minimum variance that will make it possible for reasonable use of the property, building, or structure or sign. In the granted variance will be in harmony with the general intent and purpose of this article in the county's comprehensive plan. So if this is done, what would happen as you would have those three criteria that are still, as I said, really tied to making it a unique circumstance it is not going to make it necessarily easier just allow for those three criteria. The Council is also being brought up to speed on what we require for a variance. Currently, we require a variance survey no older than two years. We want to make it consistent with what we do with other applications, which allowed up to five years, and typically what we are looking at is if you have a survey three or four years old if we can verify from aerial photography the survey is accurate and precise we would be able to accept those. Staff is really here for your direction if you feel this is an appropriate action and we can prepare an amendment to the zoning ordinance presented to the Planning & Land Development Regulation Commission and bring it back for your action after that. JEFFREY S BROWER: Councilman Johansson? JAKE JOHANSSON: Clay, why- is there any merit to having five and three of them be mandatory in two of them be optional or are you – CLAY ERVIN: That was the original plan of the committee, not that you had to meet all them but to meet enough with the recommendation from staff. JAKE JOHANSSON: But the importance of one through three, more so than four and five? CLAY ERVIN: Yes, sir. Again that really identifies why variance is needed. You just don't want to handle variance because somebody doesn't like the set back they are facing with a height restriction that they have. You want to make sure there's a unique circumstance that allows for this deviation from the zoning regulations that can no longer be applied that's why you see one, two and three. But again if the Council feels keeping all five and making it such that staff only has in their review, if they find that a majority of the criteria are met can make a recommendation of approval, that's another option. JAKE JOHANSSON: That's the end of my question. JEFFREY S BROWER: Any other questions? Any comment? Jake Johansson. JAKE JOHANSSON: Thank you, sir. I'm-- we are going to have a workshop this year or next, and to talk about permitting and whatnot. And I want to allow staff to be smart but agile and let them engage their brains and be able to make decisions. I would like to give them as much latitude as we can possibly give them to get things approved and go to PLDRC with a good product. So I'm inclined to give them the latitude to give them the option of picking the three that fit, if you will. Or that they have to have a preponderance of the criteria enough to waive the survey, I think that is important. So, is that clear, Clay? I make a motion? CLAY ERVIN: I think in order for us to take action we would want a motion specifically directing staff to prepare an amendment. If you want me to I guide that. JAKE JOHANSSON: Go ahead and I will tell you of thoughts what I want CLAY ERVIN: What I'm hearing is prepare an amendment to the zoning ordinance to allow for staff to utilize three-- a majority of the five criteria in making recommendations to the Planning and Land Development Regulation Commission on applications of variances and granting the growth and resource manager availability of waiving the two year (indiscernible). JEFFREY S BROWER: Karissa, did you get all that motion? Motion is, as just stated by Don-- I'm sorry by Jake Johansson, looking at all the names here. A second came from Matt Reinhart. Any further questions, Jake? Do you have it-- JAKE JOHANSSON: No. JEFFREY S BROWER: Any questions comments? All in favor of the long motion just stated say 'aye'? Any opposed, motion carries 6 to 0. Item 9 appointment of three members to the personnel board. In this, Karissa, you can correct me and get more detail but I believe any councilman can make this nomination? KARISSA GREEN: Correct any member can make this nomination I did just want to make note Vince Ryan was recently appointed to educational facilities authority, that is a dual office holding boards or he would not be able to serve or be attended to the personnel board at this time JEFFREY S BROWER: That would leave? KARISSA GREEN: That would leave Mary Anne Connors and Paul Chipok. JEFFREY S BROWER: That would be to today and KARISSA GREEN: I did also want to note that between the time this agenda item was posted. Another member did resign. So there are actually two additional vacancies if you appointed these two people today. JEFFREY S BROWER: Is it that tough of a board? Busy board, active board? GEORGE RECKTENWALD: It's not that tough of a board. Usually three or four cases a year, our pressing part is to make any changes or changes to worker regulation the personnel board has to review that as well that's the logjam we are facing right now. There are rules that are dated that need to be changed and updated as laws have changed. MICHAEL G DYER: If council acts on the two today we will return with the other two shortly. JEFFREY S BROWER: OK, Matt Reinhart. MATT REINHART: Would like to nominate Mary Anne Connors. JEFFREY S BROWER: Matt Reinhart nominates Mary Anne Connors. Do we have another? Jake Johansson nominates Paul Chipok. And that's all we have today. OK, Jake, any question or comment? I thought you punched, you just didn't punch hard enough. All in favor of the two nominees, Mary Anne Connors and Paul Chipok? MICHAEL G DYER: I'm used to you saying additionally you bungled it up. JEFFREY S BROWER: I heard four different responses all in the affirmative though. The two are nominated and approved. 6 to 0. We have one more, an item 10. At large, Westside in District 4 points to the cultural Council. KARISSA GREEN: Correct in these nominations would have to be within the council members districts what would need to be on the west side for Mr Johansson, within District 4 for Mr Kent. JEFFREY S BROWER: It says District 1, Westside. Would that not be Don? KARISSA GREEN: Mr Johansson had previously appointed Reggie. Even though it is District 1, she is the only Westside applicant. JEFFREY S BROWER: Gotcha. OK. By sheer can? TROY KENT: I will nominate David Hart for the Eastside from District 4. JEFFREY S BROWER: Councilman Johansson? JAKE JOHANSSON: I would like to – I will do Westside, Don. Because I care about the website, and I get to choose. Reggie Santilli was removed, missing two or three meetings, but she had some personal issues that have been resolved and she is willing to jump in again. I would like to nominate Reggie Santilli to be reinstalled. JEFFREY S BROWER: No applicants for district 5, still. We have Reggie Santilli nominated by Jake Johansson. Vice chair Kent nominated David Hart. Any comments, questions? All in favor of the nominees say aye? Any posts? Appointment are approved, 6 to 0. That brings us, at 7:46 PM, to public participation. John Nicholson. SPEAKER: John Nicholson, Beach side. You should've got these on your desk. I was sitting on my porch and some to give me an magazine called New American, and gave me a headache and I jotted down things. Better location, wearing other people on the land and have a possibility of having a fantastic location. Sorry, Don, don't want it small, I want a huge America facility. If you would, please, take a look at it, see we think about it. I know my handwriting is the pits but you can read most of it. Secondly, with regard to the comment on five, sorry, Jeff, those pictures, it is the slowest time of the year. Secondly, the weather was not great. Third, I understand it is not really great on a beachside, but it is not anything that the County did. Thank God, Troy is here. There was and asked to look into this was of Our mayor is on the committee and did not show up. It was brought before the commission and it lasted all of two minutes, that was the discussion, and they refuse to discuss it. That is not working with the county. In the beginning, if you looking drive over the bridge, take a look at the north end of the CRA. Seven buildings built before (unknown name) show here. If you get an argument with the beachside and says he cannot work with them. For seven years nothing was done on the beach side. That's a long time, we went through three economic booms and nothing was built. How can you have it where they are building everywhere? We had seven property, or seven... People trying to build hotels on the beach side, in that area. The city voted it down seven times. The Bellagio – who would not want a Bellagio? The city said no. You cannot do that and say you are for development. No matter what you do, if the city is not behind you, and they're not going to help, it is a waste of time. Like the meeting we talked about, alright? The city didn't back it, years worth of work by a lot of people and nothing got a accomplished. I'm asking you – all of the communities got to be involved in Daytona Beach because it follows you all up, get the money we are missing. (Bell rings) SPEAKER: $10 million with the taxes and they did not want to. JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you. That brings us to closing comments from the County manager, George Recktenwald. GEORGE RECKTENWALD: Yes, sir. First, I want to bring up motocross. At the last meeting, at the end of the meeting we talked about other locations and we sent out – you requested and were getting together maps and stuff of other lands. We are diligently working on that, as we speak. I guess, I am just looking for direction on the landfill site because of the concerns that are out there. We are looking at other areas. I wanted to know if you guys wanted me to stand down from that site and put our efforts into the other sites we are looking at? JEFFREY S BROWER: OK. Let's find out. Councilman Johansson? JAKE JOHANSSON: Yes, I fully support bailing on this site at this point. The other thing that Don mentioned the other day is that the $10 million price tag, if it is a different place and it costs more than 10 million, I think I am still out. At this point, there is enough concern from a plethora of East and West side constituents. I think it is in our best interest to look at other places. On the same vein, I am hoping you are talking to other cities to find out, because another's other lands you might have access to. (Multiple speakers) GEORGE RECKTENWALD: We have talked to the city of Daytona Beach of what they are doing, and we are leaving no stone unturned. The importance is the overall price tag. That was on our land we already had but if it is going to be super high to develop it, might be better off getting land that is easier to develop. Hopefully we will have a couple of options to come back with this time. JAKE JOHANSSON: Thank you. That is my opinion. JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you. Don Dempsey? Sorry, Don, hold up. We need to hear something about corrections. Councilman Reinhart? MATT REINHART: No, not going to bring it up. You lost a bet. I was going to say the same thing with respect to location and price tag. Are you looking for a motion and a second? Do you need that? GEORGE RECKTENWALD: It would be helpful. Not for me, but for the public to understand... (Multiple speakers) MATT REINHART: I will make a motion to look for different location for this. TROY KENT: Councilman Reinhart I'm a tad bit disappointed you did not take the opportunity now to say, yes, you are going to create program for small engine repair and have this thing working out of the jail. Darn it! SPEAKER: (away from mic) JAKE JOHANSSON: Second. JEFFREY S BROWER: We have a motion by Matt Reinhart to direct the County manager and staff to look for alternate locations, and seconded by Jake Johansson. JAKE JOHANSSON: I think, and ignore this one... DANNY ROBINS: I need some clarification. Is this to abandon the proposed location, excuse me, the location we had at the meeting... Or the landfill property, as a whole? SPEAKER: (away from mic) DANNY ROBINS: Just that specific? I will wait for discussion. JEFFREY S BROWER: Councilman Dempsey? DON DEMPSEY: I seem to be the point guy on this issue, and for the record, I know, and I've said this over and over ad nauseum, and if not for the consulting group I would not have been labeled to be the councilman to bring it in $10.3 million facility right next to Halifax Drive. I never said 10.3 million, I don't want to spend anymore on this and we do a pickle ball which has been totaled at 3.5 million. If were going to spend three and half million dollars to spend people play pickle ball, we should spend three half-million to help kids have a place to write because I think we all know there is any for it. There is a demand for it. Even people who are opposed to it, they all agree, there is any for it. I don't want this location, I did not want from the beginning, but somehow it ended up in my lap and that is how the job work. I agree we should find a new location, I am not trying to impose this sport in someone's backyard. I told the nice lady at the last meeting, I don't want this in my backyard, I get it. I agree there other location. We should've probably hired Mr. Nicholson as a consultant before we flew these people in from Chicago and spent all this money to have them come up with a $10.3 million price tag, which, to me, is absurd and I would never support a $10 million price tag on this either. The location, I don't think they look into it at all. It's a terrible location but there is a need and we have to go somewhere with it because there's a demand out there for it. I would like to explore the other areas of the landfill, like John pointed out, because I actually met with an environmental consultant about John's proposed location to the east side of where – the north side of where the meeting was held. It seems that might be a feasible spot, and I believe that it is far enough away that the neighbors to the south would not complain. But I would like to explore that, as well. So, yes, 100%, no 10.3 million, and not the particular location on landfill property. Thank you guys for at least entertaining the motocross discussion since I brought it up over a year ago. Thanks. JEFFREY S BROWER: Vice chair Kent? TROY KENT: Not only entertainment, but close to unanimous support to entertain and talk about it which goes to my point earlier tonight of, this is not a one-person show. You have to have support if you want to get anything accomplished. On this issue, I publicly want to thank John Nicholson because you came with a solution. You don't just come here and tell us we are doing good or poorly, you came and thought this out and a putting effort into it. I will leave mine to be included for the official public record, I am pleased you have the. Don, I do not know you – I never met you until our first day when we got sworn in. For a guy that has voted down everything I have ever wanted to do, I always tell people, they say, "How about Don Dempsey?", I say, "heckuva nice guy, he cannot support anything, but a nice guy." I never heard you talk about $10 million were the specific location so I am in agreement, when Jake spoke first, he said something about, nix the location? You said something else? JAKE JOHANSSON: I said nix, cancel. TROY KENT: We can look at other locations, he would not bring something as outrageous as $10 million, I will not bring up an idea of how to go Volusia County residence on the beach with no charge without a solution which is $8 million. I'm still working on you, Don. Thank you. JEFFREY S BROWER: Councilman Robins? DANNY ROBINS: Thank you. I just want to make sure that listening to the communities concerns, I just didn't want to take the north side of the landfill off the table because traffic is not going down that way and it can be still used as an outlet and help alleviate any traffic impacts in the area. We would not be able to, obviously, use that corner there. I'm not in favor of Halifax but I don't want to take the north side off the table yet, because we have some good buffers there, and some get area. I would also like to see – I looked at a lot of the proposal. It is like the Taj Mahal press. Just like Rome was not conquered in a day. I think if we get not just the Taj Mahal price paid, get our foot in the door price and see how this works out and involves, maybe we don't need a blacktop area. Maybe we can get away with shall or buildings. Maybe we don't need electric. There are plenty of campgrounds that don't have – the Porter truck comes in pumps your stuff. Take it with you. I would just go with the bare basics for now. We can get almost different levels, you know, whenever we are looking at it. Let's get a bare-bones price on these projects and then the power windows and power receipts price. That's it. JEFFREY S BROWER: I agree with everybody. George, I think – I don't want to change the motion, but I am going to have a hard time supporting anything on county property. My preference would be – and I think you have some options, is private property by a private operator and taxpayers of Volusia County have pretty good protection from liability. So, Don Dempsey. DON DEMPSEY: This motion, we are voting on is not the entire landfill. And it just remind you what Russ said, their educations, to remind you, Daytona Speedway is a much more dangerous location that (unknown name) risks his life on frequently. (Laughter) JEFFREY S BROWER: You said that last time. The Speedway was County property. I am not sure it is that clear cut. MICHAEL G DYER: There are differences. Last probably different with their own liability of their own. Whether they kill the project or support the project, they are just liability. If we are negligent, which the people alleged that, whether they are right or wrong, often have to defend that. We can provide more information on that. And I think a lot depends on how you structure it. Whether it is third party operating it. Whether we are operating it is our problem, there is lots of different ways. SPEAKER: Tenant respond to that? No, I will be quiet. JAKE JOHANSSON: Other alternatives, and if it does not, it is a conversation for later. DON DEMPSEY: I will back down, but I respectfully disagree with that line of thinking as well. I think it is exactly the same as what NASCAR (indiscernible) on this property with the proper structuring. MICHAEL G DYER: I am not sure we are disagreeing. JEFFREY S BROWER: What is your point? JAKE JOHANSSON: The banter that is going about, does not germane to the motion. Are we going to abandon the current motorcross location, and as George said, leave no stone unturned in finding an alternate location. It was clarified that it does not include getting rid of any other part of the landfill, including whether garbage is now as far as I'm concerned. So the only thing that we are not doing anymore, is considering the current location that Huntman provided us with the diagram. I would like to call a question. JEFFREY S BROWER: Mr Kent was talking, to answer your question, nobody has abandoned the motion. It has not changed. Vice chair, Kent. JAKE JOHANSSON: I did not say abandon the motion... JEFFREY S BROWER: Vice chair Kent. TROY KENT: If this gets voted on, I respectfully request you direct a pressure release to go and ASAP about badgering this location, and then we recheck to the good people on Halifax Drive and let them know, so they can sleep better. JEFFREY S BROWER: That is exactly our intent here. The whole intent of bringing it up is to put the people at rest. OK, this motion on the floor still stands. Seconded by Matt Reinhart. Motion by Matt Reinhart, second by Jake Johansson. We talked around all in favor say I. Any opposed? Motion carries six to zero. GEORGE RECKTENWALD: I was going to say, I will be out next week for a few days. I am taking a few personal days. (unknown name) will be in charge in my absence. I am always available via phone. With that, I hope everybody has a great holiday weekend. We will have a lot of people busy. I like to remind everybody that the county government has a lot of people that work through holidays, night shifts, so when we are out there enjoying the holiday, I just always like to think about all those who don't get to do that because of the nature of what we do. I send out my appreciation to all of them. Thank you. JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you. Michael Dyer. MICHAEL G DYER: Good evening. JESSE HAVEN: That brings us to Councilman Reinhart. MATT REINHART: I want to pray everyone has a safe holiday. Set on a couple other boards, the six that were assigned from the county, one of which was Boys and Girls Club, which I'm very passionate about. It was a terrific event. A lot of money was raised. I have help with that project quite a bit. If you get the opportunity in upcoming years, I would recommend you attend. There is another one. I sit on the Domestic Abuse Council. There is an event coming up on Saturday, June 8. We are attempting to get a rehab dump to the current facility, which is well needed. A lot of these dollars will help with that for individuals that are in need better victims of domestic violence. Lastly, happy Memorial Day to all. JEFFREY S BROWER: Councilman Robins. DANNY ROBINS: I don't have much. I was looking for a showdown between (unknown name). But, no. Everybody did a good job. Staff, thank you for everything you guys did. Have a good holiday, be safe. JEFFREY S BROWER: Councilman Dempsey. DON DEMPSEY: I think I was fishing Saturday night with my son watching soccer. We just started thinking, I wonder if the liability for the Speedway would be the same for the liability of the motorcross track if we structured it in the same way as the Speedway. Mike, what do you think? Could we structure this motorcross site on county property to have the same protections that the Speedway employees? MICHAEL G DYER: You could probably get there if you are leasing to a private property that are responsible in defending and identifying us. That would be one structure. DON DEMPSEY: That is one of the options presented to us, A, County operated everything, B, private public partnership, or C, the same thing the Speedway enjoys. If we choose option C, we are right in bed with Speedway with the same protections. If Jake gets hurt, he has as much chance silly us from his car as he would on his dirtbike. So, I would ask that the staff continue to look at the other locations at the landfill, because they may work best. That's all I have. JEFFREY S BROWER: OK, there have been no objections. We will go to Jake Johansson. JAKE JOHANSSON: Quickly, (indiscernible) counsel this week with Danny. A few things that I want to have a few situational awareness on. A couple months ago but weeks ago, our counsel for the regional planning Council passed away unexpectedly, so we put out an RSP for a new law firm and it will take over October 1. Until then, our previous law firm will pick up with this lawyer who is newly enforced. The regional planning Council will have an EOC tabletop our crew coming up in the next – I think next week, if I recall. They will help facilitating that. They spending a lot of time working with military resilience. Mimi on the space Coast in Orlando. Some minimal effects on us. Onto the career source board. As I think you recall, they are going through a merger where Bovard is merging with (indiscernible). They are absorbing the (unknown term) the Volusia Career Source Administration. The resort will be a three-person consortium which will be one Bovard Castle County member and one Volusia County County member and one (unknown name) County Council member. Most major decisions for the career source Bovard Flagler Volusia that have equity in Volusia County since we after all pay, all have to be unanimous decisions for the most part. So we will not be – I don't want to call it (indiscernible), but will not be guided by Bovard. We will now have some say in it. The board positions as it turned out based on the data, Bovard will have 13 board positions, Volusia will have 12, and Flagler will have three. The board sits right below the three-person consortium and the staff will answer to for day-to-day operations. Laura Coleman and the Bovard and Flagler attorneys have been working very hard on the ILA. I am pretty satisfied. She has done a great job in getting us equal footing with the new organization and we are looking at the bylaws right now. All this will happen on July 1 with the main intent of ensuring that our own Flagler Volusia career source services are not hindered. Having said that, there are already one or two that will fall off the plate, at least in 2024, just because of all the things that are happening. They cannot juggle that many plates. But I will work with my counterparts to make sure that they get at least considered the budget for 2025. One of the things that I will ask, and it will – I think it may come to you as part of the ILA that we need to discuss at the next meeting on June 6, will be my standby or my alternate. The suggestion from career source is that alternate be a staff member. I am suggesting that Suzanne, unless George and counsel say otherwise, should be the (unknown name). That is it. That ILA will be on our agenda for June 6. Something has to be done prior to July 1. Take a read through that. Ask any questions you have. Motorcross, we talked about. I would like the public to know yes, Matt, Danny, and I are friends. We find ourselves in the same place a lot. We are not buddies and talk (indiscernible). Just to be clear. I think you handed this edge everybody, George? GEORGE RECKTENWALD: John put that over everybody. JAKE JOHANSSON: John give you this. These are some talking points that have already gone I think to Congressman Wallace and Mills. I just happen to have an old Navy buddy that is on one of the subcommittees in Congress to bring this to. In total transparency...to get funding since we missed the cut off this year. And then we talked about it a little bit this afternoon and everybody kind of talked about staffs work this weekend. I appreciate that very much. Don't forget that this holiday coming up is memorial day and a lot of people aren't able to sit in these chairs and state their are one of opinions about the freedoms we don't give them were the freedoms we do give them because they gave their lives for those freedoms so I hope you all at least take a second to think about all those people. And if you don't grasp how many it is, YouTube video, take a look at a YouTube video of somebody walking through Arlington or the veteran cemeteries around the nation and see how many white tombstones there are for the folks that have passed for our freedom and that is just stateside. There is plenty of others in Europe. So it is pretty amazing and it is important that we take the time to remember those gentlemen and ladies that gave their lives for us. Thank you, sir. JEFFREY S BROWER: Vice Chair Troy Kent? TROY KENT: Thank you, chairman. At-large member Johansson, I can't say it any better then you just did about Memorial day. Thank you for bringing that up and sharing that with anybody -- everybody. If anybody doesn't know where to go to a memorial day ceremony, Ormond Beach at Rockefeller Gardens on Monday will have, yet again, an amazing event. I believe it starts at 9 AM but don't hold me to that. I would love to see you there if you can make it. A couple things. The first thing I want to do is think this counsel. The gentleman that got up and brought his wife and kids to the meeting talked about how he had to take off time from work to attend this meeting and it is my hope that he only had to take a couple of comp hours because this council voted to have half of our meetings in the afternoon/early evening. George, thank you for being thoughtful on the agendas, on our evening meetings. It is much appreciated and I think this council for their support with that. Yesterday, I had a great district dialogue for residents meeting. At the Ormond Beach Library. It was a wonderful turnout. There was excellent conversation and discussion. My next district dialogue for residents will be in four months on Monday, September 16 at the holy hill City Hall from 5 to 6 PM. We talk about anything that any of the constituents were members of the public want to talk about. Two more quick things. George, I love, loved what I heard tonight. That you are taking a few days off. You and Mike are the only employees that we can direct. I almost feel like we should direct you and Mike to take time off! I'm not saying that to be funny. I think we are all better when we stopped to recharge our batteries a little bit. You too,5\ it's almost like you are married to the job that is not a dig at you. It is the job. It requires a tremendous amount from you. And I'm going to say, take this time and I am going to ask you to please take more time when you deem it appropriate. Aunt George that's not just for you, that's for Mike. No unfortunately, you two, I'm also going to ask you to keep your phones on you because if something happens, we need you. My hope is that what I am sharing with you, it will then transfer to all of your employees. The only difference is, please tell them to not take their phones with them. They need to go and enjoy ended recharge their batteries and get away from it and just enjoy. Been married to their spouse. At the end of the day, this is just a job. And I am appreciative of the work that all of your staffs do but George and Mike, you are the lightning rods at times. But that is why you get paid the big bucks. So, take your time and take more time. I loved hearing that you are taking some time off. Mike, you are up. You need to do it next. Last but not least, my baby, who is 17, is graduating on Friday. I can't believe it. So I want to congratulate him and all seniors throughout Volusia County that are graduating this week. You know, hard work equals great results. I am proud of all of the seniors and especially proud of mine. Thanks. JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you. Just a couple things. I also had several town halls in the last week. One of them was not advertised at all because it was a Halifax yacht club which is a private organization and they asked that it not be made public so they invited their members. It was quite interesting, a good turnout. It was like Mr Kent just said, when I go I do not go with a canned speech. Introduce myself, might say a couple things, then open it up for questions. The public loves to ask questions and I think it helps with the constant complaint we hear that government doesn't pay attention to us and nobody listens. It is good to get out and listen. The one last night that the City of Lake Helen actually did with Webster and Barnaby, their local representative, it was very interesting questions and I'm glad that we went. Did a lifeguard proclamation at headquarters and he is standing in the back of the rooms when going to say this. I was really glad that Mark Swanson attended that with me. I think the staff that was there appreciated it. It didn't surprise me that you were there, showing interest in the men and women that worked there. I enjoy their questions and their update on what – everyone knows it's been a tough year for them with the change in law enforcement responsibilities and the retirement of their director. Of Andy. So Mark, thank you for coming to that. You didn't eat any pizza, did you? No? OK. Also one of the things I enjoy most is an opportunity that I get from serving on this Council, was also working with the IRL counsel. And being able to work with the private clam farmer who has leases from Saint Augustine all the way down to Oak Hill and he periodically deposits young clams in the water because it helps clean the water. Clams and oysters are very helpful in cleaning water there. It is an all day affair except for this time. Last week he deposited 10 million clams about the size of the head of a pin. (Indiscernible) looks just like a clam, shall, everything. Just tiny. But it took a few minutes because for the first time he deposited those clams from a drone. So it was really interesting to see the blend of technology and God's creation of clams to clean up water and I look forward to that. Mike Sullivan and I, and the director of the IRL, Doctor Dupree's, are working on a program to restore the seafood industry in Volusia County and it will start with clams and oysters. It has started now what it means to greatly expand. And he, Mike Sullivan, just has tremendous ideas on how to do that along with Doctor Osborne at Witney research lab in Saint Augustine. So I'm excited about seeing that develop. Clay is not here? Oh, he is, shoot! I was going to talk about you if you weren't here! I want to thank Clay and Cary Lusinger. We've all had residents call in and say they had trouble with something in the county. I had – well, he's not really a constituent. He's not a full-time resident here, his homes are in South Carolina and Volusia and Lucia is his secondary home but he had an issue he could not get solved with permits, with fence and windows. Used good competent contractors to do that who did not call for the final inspection. And the resident didn't know he was supposed to. He thought – anyway, I spoke to Clay about it and this part-time resident has a home up for sale and it was closing in a few days he was in absolute panic. Now, I don't know what he sounded like when Cary spoke to him but to make a really long story short, they were able, because the permits had been pulled, they expired, they were able to resubmit the permits and get it taken care of in a really timely manner. And I love seeing that. We are not always able to act that fast and to be that responsive because Clay's division is one of the busiest in the county. But Clay, I wanted to say, Cary is not here. I hope that you will pass that along to carry and tell him that the resident appreciates it. He went from "I never want to come to Volusia again was coach to "maybe I want to buy another property". So we will see what happens there. The next thing I want to say, I wanted to preface this with that because I do appreciate the hard work coded enforcement does. Mike, Mike Dyer, I'd brought up for the possibility of code enforcement officers wearing body cams because it protects them from hearsay, from, you know, it protects them. It also protects business owners and property owners that they know – it helps them trust us more, that they know what we say stands. Mike, you sent out an email and said there are some considerations about that they are not pure law enforcement. So my question to you is, I would like to continue that discussion. What do we need? Do you need to bring it back to counsel and to discuss all those different parameters and the way it will affect us? MICHAEL G DYER: We are in the process with my office, my office and Georgia's staff of bringing something back to you. JEFFREY S BROWER: OK. MICHAEL G DYER: So we can have that discussion. Based on prior counsel direction. We can have that discussion based on prior counsel discussion. The best we can tell, it has not been fully embraced by nonlaw enforcement officers. I think the reason, is we can't do it. I think the reason is because of the privacy statute, because they are not law enforcement, they have to get consent. Violations are scary. It is a felony. So, you might have to get consent. JEFFREY S BROWER: Before the overturned. MICHAEL G DYER: And or, because I think you can do this to save time, you say this when we have the fall presentation, we can have some legislature to change that privacy law to include the officers in that exemption. I will say that the way the law is written out, it does put your staff that will be using it that are law enforcement in a more difficult position. They are not trained in how to do that and obtain consent. If I came up to you and I am a code officer, I have to gain consent before I can (indiscernible). (Indiscernible) in writing, or I can be charged with a crime. It does put a little more burdens, obligations on your staff if you were to do that. JEFFREY S BROWER: OK. Councilman Robbins? DANNY ROBINS: Just to support that, I don't know if I brought it up or not, street crimes and when we did not have talks and things like that. Even though we had a body camera we would always have (indiscernible) maybe the reason you are there, to 10 seconds, file it away in (indiscernible) around with the proper protections. I want to support it with as well as make a legislative priority. At least will have the form in the event that legislative action is taken. We can still push for it I think, thanks. JEFFREY S BROWER: OK. Next to last thing. We've talked about the writing. Your idea was for competition. Since that note, the motocross track. Get off the phone! (Laughter) Since that, even before that has come up, I have gotten a lot of questions from people. There is no place to ride in Volusia County. That is a common thing I see on Facebook. There is no place to ride in Volusia County. I asked (unknown name) Berball, about that, and he said we have 36.2 miles of where you can legally ride an ATV. Not for competition, but just for father son, daughter mom, daughter dad. He sent them out. I think Councilman Robins has posted that information before, about when you can ride an ATV. In any case, I am going to post it. Most of it is around Lake George Forest. Not all of it, but a lot of it. I will ask Brad to email that to you as well. I can email it. GEORGE RECKTENWALD: Brad is going to send it out. I already talked to him. JEFFREY S BROWER: It is a very popular sport. It would be nice. I have heard from several writing clubs that have asked me "Why do we have no places to ride?" We can give them this information. I have not ever ridden there. Have you? DON DEMPSEY: You understand, that is unmonitored, very dangerous (indiscernible) system. There is a lot of add-ons. I am not talking about any controlled environment where there is flaggers and easy access for personnel like yourself. I know people that have been severely hurt writing these. That is completely different. JEFFREY S BROWER: It is. I understand that. I am hearing from the public. I went to that argument in New Hampshire. I never lived there, but I would go up there every winter and drive snowmobiles. Same thing there. You are talking about narrow paths, not two lanes, and you are always looking for the other guy coming towards you. Some of the population tried to get rid of it completely, and they did for about a month. And then the riders banded together. It is kind of like the dog beach, what is being done. We will pick up, we will make sure there is no garbage there. We will – anyway, that has nothing to do with us in New Hampshire, except that it could be similar to this riding ATVs. Clubs to lease it to keep it clean and do what they can to keep us safe. Actually, in New Hampshire, the fear was head on collisions. But it fortunately never have been. You can go just as fast on a snowmobile. DON DEMPSEY: (Indiscernible) (Laughs). Dirt biking up north. JEFFREY S BROWER: Alright, thank you. Thank you, George for sending that out. I wanted to mention Memorial Day. My family enjoys Veterans Day because there is a bunch of Vets, but Memorial Day takes it several notches above. About three weeks before my father died, 89 years old, he has served as a medic in the US Army. He served as a medic during the D-Day invasion that (indiscernible), he was not on the beaches of Normandy. He was in London at the hospital that received the guys that got their legs and heads blown off on the beaches. He received those guys that were flown in. I had no idea until the last two weeks of his life, when he finally opened up. He told me about an 18-year-old kid that came from Normandy. My father knew he was going to die. The kid did not know it because they probably don't want to admit it. He was literally in my father's arms, and the kid said "I don't want to die, but tell my mom." Those were his last words. When he told me that, it broke my heart in a whole other light because so many people – Jake has already said this. So many soldiers did not get to come home. They gave their lives for us. They put everything on the line. Even some of the guys that came back like my father, and thousands of others will forever change because of what they saw and for their willingness to go up to that line and put themselves on the line. Memorial Day is really important. We probably have listed on our Facebook page or the website different Memorial Day events around the county. Pardon me? SPEAKER: Yes sir, we will post that as we get closer to the date. JEFFREY S BROWER: Alright. That is all I have. We will adjourn the meeting at 8:39 PM. (Meeting adjourned)