*Captioners standing by This is a test for captions. Captioners are standing by. SPEAKER: Welcome to Voluisa County. Meeting will begin in 10 minutes. (Music plays) SPEAKER: Welcome to the Voluisa County, County Council meeting. The meeting will begin in five minutes. (Music plays) SPEAKER: Welcome to the Volusia County Council meeting. The meeting will begin in two minutes. (Music plays) (Captioners standing by for session to begin) SPEAKER: Are mics on? Good morning everyone nice to see you here this beautiful morning in March. You will notice our chairman is running a few minutes late he will be here from what I hear. But we are going to go ahead and get this meeting started. We start out with a prayer and today, we will have a moment of silence. So, after the moment of silence we will have our Pledge of Allegiance so, if you would at this time please stand. TROY KENT: Thank you very much. ALL: (Pledge of Allegiance) TROY KENT: You very much. Please be seated. Madame clerk at this time if you can do the Roll call. KARISSA GREEN: (Roll call) Mr Santiago? Mr Dempsey? Mr Johansson? Mr Kent? Mr Reinhart? Mr Brower? TROY KENT: Next we will have our public participation, do we have any public participation this morning? I'm seeing a headshaking yes so, it's coming. Thank you very much. I will read these in order that they were received. Please know whenever you come up you have three minutes to talk about anything you would like to talk about that is not on the printed agenda. Please make sure your comments are directed to this entire counsel. If you need to raise, or lower the podium you can do that. Please speak directly into the microphone. First up, we have Jack Enphalt (?). When you come up, for security purposes, you do not have to give us your exact address but please tell us where you are from so we know which district you are in. Go ahead Jack. SPEAKER: My name is Jack, Martin Street for the past 30 years, over 30 years in northwest DeLand route 15 a and railroad tracks. We've had flooding there for about the last flooding years, the last two years was worse. I have live oak trees dead, the first problem started when heritage place was built and that's gotta be 2006. Mallory Square was next and out spring garden townhouses. I put marker flags after large rain events and a week later the water would be a couple inches higher. It had not rained in all that time. All three developments have designed storm waters to flow into retention ponds near our flood area. This practice is easily explained with the last site development spring garden townhouses. The site is 15 acres that has naturally sloped to the north and east. Northside was built up with hundreds of truckloads of fill, now slopes from South to a dry retention, near us on the south. 10 acres of the 15, is allowed to be impervious surface. That 10 acres all drain to a 1 acre retention next to us. 1 inch of rain on 1 acre is 2700 gallons, 113 tons. 10 acres 1 inches 207 1000. 1130 tons. Average rainfall, 54 inches. 14 million gallons. Hundred and 13 million pounds forced into the ground through pressure. Years worth of rain on 1 acre, is a box, 200' x 200', 54 inches tall. About like this. A years worth of rain, on 10 acres, forest into 1 acre retention is a box 200' x 200', 540 inches. That's 45 feet high. Groundwater moves down until it hits a clay layer and then can only go laterally, 10 acres of rain and storm water was not given to me by nature, but by man. Designer, engineer, or councilman. If we get 50 inches, that seems fair but why should I get and another guys 50 inches because they don't think they should share? City engineers tell me planning and development is all legal but someone's blowing smoke. How could it be legal to ruin someone's property and dreams. About 12 properties are affected by this flood including Duke energy, CSX railroad, Volusia County school, FFA fire. We need help, thank you so much. TROY KENT: Thank you Jack. (Applause) TROY KENT: Lorna Larson is up next. Ms Larson, welcome when you start talking you will have three minutes. SPEAKER: Hello. Good morning counsel. Voluisa County counsel. My address is in DuBerry Due to health reasons I've been living with my son in DeLand. I have both residences, this is about the one in DeLand. My front yard isn't available to park in, the house doesn't have open windows to throw tires and waste in, the rotting tree, that covered most of the backyard, creating a barrier for the neighbors to be able to throw human waste, human diapers, all of this I have to clean up in the back. Before I purchased the property, I had all of this, so I knew what the property was like. Someone has claimed, that we need to abide by rules that even they do not abide by and don't seem to be required. The code enforcement notice, on the front gate, over the no trespassing sign, posted there, was addressed to Tanner Larson, ADA and part owner of the property. Who is it that I should ask for harassment charges? County or state? This is Tanner Larson, my son. He has been working really hard to do what is required… OK. Did somebody have questions for me? TROY KENT: Now is not the time for that but I am going to direct her son, before you start talking, go see our County Manager and get a card from him he will raise his hand for you, so you see who he is. Head there and grab a card because you are up next to speak. Thank you Ms Larson, you may have a seat. Thank you very much. SPEAKER: Thank you. TROY KENT: Next up is Tanner Larson. SPEAKER: As my mom identified, I am under the ADA. Information. My mom has submitted her statement, for reference, the actual statement is in record. She also submitted some pictures. Those pictures are identifying specifically on the left-hand side of the paper, the different pictures taken were for, on the far left-hand side, when they put the code enforcement, notice, sticking them onto the no tresspassing sign, came back later and then after we complained about that and we identified it. All the pictures on the right-hand side are pictures of the neighboring area and different issues that are visual, visible from the street. The code identified me, directly, to begin with as me being the only homeowner which was not in record. Which identified that they were not going off of record when they came out. He also identified that he had taken pictures of a code violation from someone else's backyard. This being said, I understand that is not according to code. There are so many other code violations constantly in the neighborhood, and around town, that are definitely visible from the streets. This individual coming to my property, seeing nothing in the front yard, being of code violation, and then going into someone else's backyard to identify any form of code violation, I think should be addressed. I don't know how else to say it. Other than, I feel it's a direct attack against me. TROY KENT: Tanner thank you for your comments and you have Mr Recktenwald's card and give them a call later. Next up, Raymond Parker. SPEAKER: Counsel/Chair, councilmembers, my name is Raymond Dave Parker. I am in district 1 and live at 1800 Glenwood Reserve Drive in DeLand. I approached you today to request your guidance, assistance and action to have our homeowners association, leadership itself and other cease-and-desist posting off (indiscernible) signage in Glenwood Reserve. Repeatedly (audio issues) I met twice with Volusia Growth Resource Management on this matter. I filed a formal complaint with the (Unknown Name) and I filed a formal complaint with the Volusia Growth and resource Management, but to no avail. Last Friday, March 1, and then on Saturday, March 2, two and then four, off premises sale signs were posted. These abuse Volusia's common violations as dictated by code compliance. Homeowner Association Corporation leadership itself asserts that they need not comply. Volusia County code section 72 – 298 releases them and others from compliance. I vehemently disagree with such. I ask your, our Volusia County Council, to act to cease and desist this practice, signage practice in our community. Please do so in accordance with Volusia County's common violations. Thank you. TROY KENT: Thank you, Mr Parker. Next up is Joe Tremmins, just so you all know, for recording, our chairman has arrived and I will pass everything back over to you can take over, absolutely. Joe Tremmins (?) SPEAKER: I also have problems with a code enforcement. (Unknown Name) had been targeting me. When I turn in a complaint, the complaint does not get searched at all. I turned in 335 complaints of the same thing that he got my yard for because my neighbor turned me in. I turned my neighbor in and he does not have to take his fence down. I had to take my fence down, to this day, two years later, they do not have their fence down. I asked Mr Hutchinson and he says, "Well, I did not know." So he did not do my complaint. Then, he come on my property, the first day he was there and he states to me, "The only thing you can do on this property is walk." That is not what you people are here for. You don't tell a disabled veteran he can only walk on his property. This is the United States! And then he held up my permit for my fence by six weeks for a gopher thing. And the lady who came out to do the gopher thing said, "Man, yours must have been stuck at the bottom of the pile for a while. I am doing tomorrows and yours is three months old." This is what the gopher lady... That had to do with Mr Hutchinson. That is not even it. Then, Mr Hutchinson, I called him on the phone and asked him why they would not approve Volusia County, would not approve my solar panels on my roof? You know he told me? "Well, you have an open fence permit that has expired. And that stops us from issuing your solar panels." So my solar panels have been waiting for three months! That is money out of my pocket because he wants to play with me. This is wrong. Then he sends, Freddie something, a code enforcement officer to my property to find something on my property. I can't think of his name, Freddie... I've got it here, just give me a second. JEFFREY S BROWER: You've only got 30 seconds. SPEAKER: Well, it was one of the code enforcement officers. He says to me, "he is the one who wrote the ticket." They told me they cannot write tickets. They cannot stop at the road and say, "That bench is too high." And yet, you stopped at my house and I got summoned (Bell rings) JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you, sir. We hear you. SPEAKER: But nobody is doing that JEFFREY S BROWER: Your time is up. Thank you. Troy, thank you for stepping in. This is why we have a vice chair. We will try to plow through today. Next up is Joe. TROY KENT: That was just Joe. JEFFREY S BROWER: Did JC already speak? JC? I am glad I did not miss you. SPEAKER: My name is JC Figaretto (?), I live on Jackson's Woods Road in DeLand. I printed a couple of topography maps of the area and what I have here is a pretty accurate morning to the Council that they need to start taking action and start preparing. What we have here is, we have Blue Lake Avenue running vertical and horizontal is Orange County, sorry, Taylor. The retention pond at the bottom right is that pond you see on Taylor Road. All of the property that I colored on here is hundred 70 foot elevation above sea level. Now the current water in this retention pond and on my level which is connected to this average is about 76 and half feet. What I'm showing is any type of rain event that we are going to get, this is all area that is going to be covered under water. It is time that you guys, not all of you, but some of you, start addressing this and taking it seriously. It is not just me and my neighbors, it is a lot of people. There's a couple more... Where you are doing the new development, this is 44 and Keplar (?). What you see colored is what 72 feet above sea level. Everything that is not colored, is up to 10 feet below, 15 feet below where the water is at my house. So, again, what is going to happen is when we get a storm, a hurricane or tropical storm that drops feet of water, all of this property will be flooded. I said this before, I gave everybody a warning, this is going to happen. The crazy thing is, this just got approved with the publics and hundred or whatever houses. All of that water is going to add up. All of this is under the current water table heading that way. Why is the Council not pursuing the city on legal charges will why are you helping us? I have the data. I can show you the city is causing flooding on county property. I know you are being sued by a county resident for water on his poppy. I have the data that shows the waters coming from the city. George, County Manager, another guy came out and saw water elevation differences flowing in from the city onto my property. I am in the county. Why is this not being taken more seriously? And you guys paying attention to the problem? You are doing a horrible job and you are messing up for all of us. We work hard for money and what we have and you guys are treating it like it is garbage. (Bell rings) JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you. (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: Skip Simmons? (Bell rings) SPEAKER: I think it went up about 1/4 inch (Laughs) hello everybody, my name is Skip Simmons, I am the Executive Director of longer Fatherless. I live in Port Orange. We founded this right here in Volusia County. We became incorporated in 2016. We got our 501(c)(3) in 2017. We started our first class of mentors in 2018 and I have been able to be the first employee since 2019. So, our mission is to recruit, train and match mentors with boys growing up without a father figure. We have grown to nearly 60 mentors matched with 60 boys throughout Volusia and few in Flagler. I am here to spread awareness. To let leaders in the community know this resources out there for any of you who know single parents in need or man who would make a great mentor. We are here to spread the word. United States has the highest single parent household rate in the entire world out of any other country so this is a massive issue throughout our nation, and in our area as will. I believe Volusia County has somewhere in the range of 24% single parent household rate. We have three main programs that we focus on. 121, weekly mentoring. Each mentor is matched with one young man. I have been mentoring, not so young anymore, he actually just turned 18, I have been matched with a man named Liam for six years. His father passed away in the military. We also have life skill classes and group events. We have one event each month. We have had handyman classes, job interview skills classes, showing them anything that can get them excited, new experiences that can turn into a hobby, a passion, or hopefully a career. Last weekend we were in the Spruce Creek Fly in, partnering with the young Eagles. The boys were able to fly up in these private planes with pilots who offered their services and time. Boys who had never been in a plane before, never thought about becoming apply -- pilot, now they can fly over the ocean. This puts ideas in their head of what can be possible so we are trying to do everything we can to grow. We were awarded our first grant through DCF last year which funded another full time employee, which has been incredible. So, if you guys know single parents in need, send them our way. If you know good man, we have mentor classes four times a year. You can find is that no longer fatherless.org. We are also on social media, Facebook and Instagram. I gave brochures over there. (Bell rings) JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you, Skip, for coming in. (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: Everybody is afraid to speak in public. He just made it look easy, didn't he? (Laughs) Elena Craft. (?) SPEAKER: Hello, my name is Elena Craft, I live in Ormond Beach. Today I just want to discuss what happened during the last council meeting. At the 11th hour the majority took it upon themselves to ignore the dictate of the Volusia County charter and stripped Chairman Brower of his right to independently report the Volusia County residents. In the off the agenda vote, the majority will now review the chairman speech ahead of time, censoring the content to ensure that it fits neatly into their template. As this latest time waiting political theater progressed, the Council took the opportunity to cut into Chairman Brower over his single-handed attempt to protect our environment, ensure water quality and quantity and make our beach more accessible. Then, after spending the last year posting and ridiculing him at every turn, they painted Mr Brower's unprofessional. In addition, the majority also demanded that Mr Brower stop using county letterhead to correspond with state officials and thus, strategically blocked Mr Brower's future efforts to bring attention to pending destruction of the Spruce Creek watershed, his staunch opposition to Belvedere terminals plan to put a 13 million gallon bulk fuel storage site in Ormond Beach, destructive flooding and other ecological disasters in the making. The fact is, our county charter directs the Chair to address both the Council and Volusia County residents annually. And this cheap power move does not take away that responsibility. And it also set a very dangerous precedent of censorship which must be corrected immediately. Most of that was taken from Parker's View which was published last Friday and I hope that each one of you take the seriously. I did email each of you and only Mr Johansson answer. I expect that our staff, the County Manager, also addresses this because it was a very, very worrisome move but each one of you. It has to be discussed and it has to be corrected. I also want to say, I will not be here for the next agenda meeting, but I am opposed to the dissolution of all the committees that is on the agenda today. And he moved away from community engagement and representation is not doing as any justice so please move more in the direction of community engagement, then the other way around. So, thank you very much. (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you, that is the end of the list for public comment. So we will move to item number one, the consent agenda. Does anyone have an item they would like to pull for comment or for a vote? DAVID SANTIAGO: Moved to approve. SPEAKER: Second. KARISSA GREEN: Before you take a vote there was a public participation… JEFFREY S BROWER: I will call him up at the appropriate time. This is unusual, George Recktenwald? GEORGE RECKTENWALD: I wanted to reiterate that we have someone here who would like to speak to you. JEFFREY S BROWER: I was not gonna forget you, thank you for coming all the way from Oak Hill. It's always good to see you. We have a motion by David Santiago to approve the consent agenda, was there a second? Vice Chair Kent. Gave the second. Before we vote, Mayor Gibson, would you please come.... SPEAKER: Before the before he speaks I want to introduce the item. A lease between Voluisa County utilities in the city of Oak Hill to operate... Sort collection service to serve 280 homes and remove all the aging septic systems that are adjacent. Cooperative project between the county, city, DPN water management District. I will turn it over to the mayor. JEFFREY S BROWER: You don't think he could say that? SPEAKER: He was afraid what I would say. County Chair, County Council members… Mr Recktenwald. I'm here because I want to tell you, this project cost $90 million. It will remove 280 septic tanks. That drain directly into the mosquito lagoon. Not only the citizens of Oak Hill but the county. That utilize the mosquito lagoon for recreation purposes, is going to benefit from this. Because we are removing the phosphates and nitrates that go into the lagoon. I'm a firm believer that if we don't start, we will lose. This could not have been... Implemented, could not of been completed without all of your help. I call out Mike Allrich, utilities director. For his constant help. Councilmember Danny Robins from our district for his undoubted belief that we can save the lagoon, but we have to start. Oak Hill, and its citizens, want to thank each and every one of you, for what you all have done. Thank you. JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you, Mayor, for coming in, and the wise words. I have a motion and a second to approve the entire consent agenda, so let's vote and see if item O gets passed. All in favor say 'aye'? Any opposed? It passes, thank you. That brings us to item number two, you are ready. Discussion and direction of the disillusion… Oh my. (Laughter) JEFFREY S BROWER: Of advisory boards. Did you see these? SPEAKER: Just now. JEFFREY S BROWER: So, you will start and then we will move into public discussion on this item. SPEAKER: Good morning, Mr Chairman Russ Brown, Deputy County Attorney. At that December 5, 2023 meeting, Council directed staff to bring back a list of Boards that can be combined with other Boards. Many of the County's Boards are statutorily required and cannot be resolved. The agenda summary contains research conducted by staff, any impacts of sunsetting additional boards would have on the county depending on the Board that is dissolved. I'm here as well as other members of staff to answer questions you may have and await the direction you give the staff of (indiscernible) the Boards. At this time, I will turn it over to you, if you have questions I can answer. JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you, with this many people that want to speak, 31… We should probably… And growing… We should probably hear from the public and then we will call you back up for questions. George Recktenwald? GEORGE RECKTENWALD: I want to reinforce what Russ said, this was for the benefit of the audience. You know, the ask here was to look at these boards and see about combining them, or which ones may have needed either repurposing or the purpose had passed. And then there was one board there that we are having trouble filling that board on a constant basis and it's a big time commitment and a special magistrate could be used. I'm speaking of that, the code enforcement board. I just wanted to add, I know there is concern about funding except for the fact that maybe some of these boards, they don't exist, we can get funding. I think we have that listed in there. But today's discussion, at least as written, was not intended to get into the budget. That was something for a later date. Today was really about these particular boards, as he said, combining or repurposing, or elimination, if they don't serve the purpose. We certainly do support community engagement and that may be the purpose in some of these cases, and some have other forms of community engagement. The library has Friends of the Library groups as well. That was really the intent today, I think, for Council, to give us direction, and I want their thoughts on some of those boards. JEFFREY S BROWER: I appreciate you saying that and I think it's also worth noting that this is not on the agenda because you or Mike Dyer decided to put it on the agenda. It's here because the Council asked you to put it on there. It was our request, not yours. David Santiago? DAVID SANTIAGO: Thank you, Mr Chairman. Thank you, George, for bringing clarity to it. I think I have received several calls and many of my colleagues already have on this topic. Possibly, I could say and did say, not maybe… The messaging may have been off on this… (Laughter) DAVID SANTIAGO: Right? I agree with you. I think the purpose, that people understand the root cause and the intent from my perspective, colleagues can speak for themselves, was programs in general, the government should always be reviewed from time to time and I think it's healthy. Not that it is focused on any particular one entity within it. But the discussion is healthy, not only for government operations, but also for the organizations that operate out there and participate in some of these programs. I think, many of you, at least in my opinion, will be in very good shape. But the discussion, I think, is still healthy. I certainly have some thoughts I will share at the end. Asking some of these boards, if the Council so agrees, to expand some of their processes and look at ways to enhance some of these programs at their individual recommendation. So, just wanted to put my thoughts out there, Mr Chairman. JEFFREY S BROWER: Matt Reinhart? MATT REINHART: Thank you, Mr Chair. Mr Santiago, you clarified it. I wasn't sure if we were in approach another direction on each board individually. I think a lot of these people are here about one board in particular, which I have answered, I think. Everyone knows where I stand with respect to that. I did not know if that would make the process easier because there are a lot of people here passionate about every board but there's one in particular, I believe. I didn't know what would make that easier to move this process along quicker. I don't know what, do we want to hear from everyone and then start piecing every board, every single board we have out there? JEFFREY S BROWER: I want to hear from the people that came in today and then we will...I will open it up for discussion and we will see what questions we have. I don't know that we need to do each board individually. I hope that is not necessary. Pat, I'm sorry, but you are first. (Laughs) (Laughter) JEFFREY S BROWER: Do you want me to bury you in this stack? Pat Northy. So do I today… SPEAKER: You know, I have a speaking disability. Here I go. Council, I'm here to encourage you to reject item 2. Vaguely, as a former County Council member who sat in your Chair for 20 years, I call BS on this agenda item. Advisory boards are an important part of Voluisa County government and represent the most engaged citizens in our communities. They give up their time, provide their talent and accept no treasury for serving. Over the years, they have done important work in providing great insight into the County and for the Council. I'm particularly concerned about the sense of Volusia Forever and Echo boards being combined. Part of the success of these programs is they operate with full transparency and oversight of citizen advisory committee. Both instances, each ballot question spoke to a specific advisory board in a matter of echo here are the words directly, in order to ensure proceeds are used, finance acquisition, restoration, construction etc. for public use, the County Council shall appoint electors through an advisory oversight committee to provide for ongoing review of all projects and consideration to make recommendations to the County Council. Language in Volusia Forever filed closely the Echo language and reads, "in order to implemented program to finance negotiations… Etc. they County Council shall create an advisory oversight committee for this... They should recommend land acquisition program with policies, procedures, standards and criteria for and purchase of endangered and conservation and water resource areas." As a former Chair of the committee to reauthorize the two programs it was never intended that Volusia Forever and Echo would share a joint recommended committee. The battle language in both referendums reflects that. The work is important, is hard and different for both boards to combine them would break faith with the public who want to continue the good and independent work required to meet obligations of these boards. Please keep these boards separate. In addition, you have several other high profile boards that should be saved including (unknown name) historical preservation and the Cultural Council. All board speak to quality-of-life whether it be CFAB, affordable housing, library board or any other board, now on the chopping block, they work hard to advance Voluisa County, kill this agenda item. Thank you. (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you Pat, for speech impediment. That was pretty flawless. (Laughter) JEFFREY S BROWER: We now have… DAVID SANTIAGO: Point of personal privilege that may help the Council for me… JEFFREY S BROWER: You may. DAVID SANTIAGO: John Pat. I think it's important Mr Chairman in case there's others in the audience, I don't recall ever this counsel discussing about combining those two boards. I don't think that's ever been on the agenda and I thought it was important Pat for you to know and maybe others. (Multiple speakers) JEFFREY S BROWER: OK. Mayor Chazez from the beautiful city of Dewberry. And well run. You have three minutes. (Laughter) SPEAKER: Thank you very much. I'm here as a resident and tax payer. I live in Dewberry and I'm going to speak to two of the boards listed in this agenda item. Specifically because they are high priority for me but it does not mean I wouldn't have a feeling about the other boards being disbanded. Or combined because I do believe we need to hear from the residents. The first one I would mention is the cultural counsel. Around $600,000 is directed towards the art for the County, a discussion for another date, as the County Manager has had. However, that is roughly 1 dollar a day per person in Volusia County. And, we have supported a large number of cultural organizations that provide services throughout the county. I looked at the boards meeting schedule, they meet six or seven times a year and they cover both the Westside and the Eastside. And they provide the input that is needed to reflect the needs of the art community and residents. I believe that pairing back that input while we have money to support the arts, is not the direction to go. The direction to go is when we have a modest amount to support things that are important to all of us, that we have citizen input and we have volunteers that donate their time. I think we should not do that. In the interest of efficiency, assign that to staff, to bring to Council and then have the only public input on the awarding of these funds come at the very 11th hour, in a meeting with the council votes yes or no. That is my objection to the elimination of such boards. On the proposal which is in the agenda, Mr Santiago, to merge, or combine, Echo and Volusia Forever, in addition to what my friend Pat Northey has said, we also have the situation where the skill set, the knowledge and background for the people that you all have appointed to these boards, has only a modest overlap. Trying to get people with a broad background and knowledge in these areas to be on one board, I think, is foolhardy. Forever has land acquisition Emma conversation and environmental. Go has environmental, cultural, historic and outdoor records -- recreation. These are different skill sets. Combined there would be 12 meetings a year, which is impractical. My time is up, thank you very much. I appreciate you being interested in your fiscal response ability to residence. (Bell rings) (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: We have a full house. Obviously this is important to you. I want to let you know that what has been discussed, but David Santiago has already mentioned, apparently, everybody has read the item, which is really encouraging. I am glad that you are paying attention. (Laughter) JEFFREY S BROWER: I am serious. Everything you read in there did not originate from the Council. The staff did their job and told us what could be done. And so some of the things like combining boards could be done but they are not suggesting that it is done. They want us to decide that. So there is a lot of information in there that is just for all of us to consider and make a decision on. It is not because Michael Dyer or George Recktenwald one of those things to happen. They are doing their job and telling us decisions we might make. That might help in your comments this morning. Sydney Johnson? SPEAKER: Sydney Johnson, 535 (Unknown Name) Avenue. 32720. Thank you for your service to Volusia County residents to maintain our advice. As 1/5 generation native of DeLand. My ancestry includes early settlers who arrived before there was a city of DeLand. When enterprise was still the seat of county government. My ancestors have enjoyed and contributed to Volusia County's historical organizations and paid taxes to our government. I paraphrase founding father, President John Adams, "I must study politics and war, that our sons have liberty to study mathematics and philosophy to give their children the right to study painting, music and architecture. From politics and war, architecture and music." President Adams understood the deep value and hard work to be able to prioritize the arts in their many forms. President Adams was also concerned about his place in history, and the storytelling of history accurately. I agree with our founding father about the intrinsic and economic value of our culture and history. I would add to the list the environment, as witnessed by the many thousands of persons and millions of dollars that flowed into Volusia County each year due to events and festivals associated with the arts, culture, environment and heritage. The Volusia Echo Program designs many of agencies and buildings in nonprofit organizations, engaged in history and outdoor engagement. Exactly how it was voted with an approval of over 70% will please do not combine Echo and Forever programs because they have different funding sources with very different missions, objectives and requirements, and were voted for as separate entities. (indiscernible) and a key feature of Volusia County's heritage, the Volusia County Historic Presentation board represents one of the longest-serving and significant of our boards and flex our history. Constituted in 1992 and reorganized in 2007, it's roots run deeper to 1951 with the Florida legislature county government created the Volusia County Historical Commission. A historic presentation – my preservation board is vital to the county's qualification as a certified local government. Since 2009, our C LG statistics and certification have given the county preferred status to apply for historic preservation grants and review authority for properties to be listed in national register of historic places. Please do not eliminate or otherwise diminish Volusia County's art, culture, historic preservation and historic committees. In the name of good government. Thank you for your service. (Bell rings) (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: OK, I'm going to call several people up so that you are ready. You come up one at a time but next will be Gary Swanson, followed by Nancy Vaughn, followed by Melissa (Unknown Name)'s you can be prepared. SPEAKER: My name is Gary Swanson and I live in Bethune Beach. I want to thank you Council members for the opportunity to speak to you today on behalf of the Southeast Lucius Volusia Society. You have all received a letter yesterday via email and a copy is being provided today at this meeting. Our Board of Directors appreciates your efforts to streamline our local government processes as it relates to the Volusia County citizen advisory boards. We would, however, ask that you consider the fact that some of these advisory boards work on Volusia County's behalf to facilitate processes tied directly to the county budgets fiscal year. The Volusia County Cultural Grant Workshop, grants submission and review process was due to begin by the end of January. Grants are due in May, reviewed during the mid summer and ordered on by you prior to the end of September, as the fiscal year ends. By suspending the activities of this particular board, along with others, you have eliminated County's process that initiates reviews and rewards these grants. Though it may not have been the intent, the action of suspending all advisory board activities has the effect of jeopardizing the funding that would be available through this program for the coming fiscal year. The Southeast Volusia County historical society would ask that a motion be brought forward at today's meeting to reinstate the functions of all the citizen advisory boards that have activities related to funding in the upcoming fiscal year. It is not necessary to suspend the activities of these advisory boards in order to review the work they do and make changes in the coming years. Suspending the activities of citizen volunteers also does not save Volusia County money. It does, however, put harmful stress on the budget processes of the many cultural entities that count on these yearly grants. Please restore the process by which these important grants are awarded today. Again, we thank you for your time and the work you do on behalf of the citizens of Volusia County, and thank you for your support of culture and arts in the community. JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you, sir. Nancy Vaughn? (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: Nancy are you speaking for the league of? SPEAKER: Good morning, Chair Brower, councilmembers, and county counsel member Recktenwald. My name is Nancy Vaughn, I live in Port Orange and I am representing the League Of Women Voters in Volusia County, a nonpartisan organization that has been representing voters for years. We believe strongly in citizen engagement and government at all levels, but especially locally. We respectfully ask that you not disband the environmental and natural resources advisory committee. The purpose of ENRAC, basing their work on provisions in the Volusia County homeowner charter is to recommend minimum standards, to protect the environment, recommend corresponding implementation ordinances and taking these recommendations to you, the Council. The ENRAC committee is made up of engage, thoughtful members of the community who have long-term expense in their field. From professionals and engineering, to environment a law, city planning to real estate development. They can, and have worked collaboratively to address the many issues this councils -- county faces. Some include wetlands protection, river and waterway protection, stormwater management and protecting our designated sole-source aquifer which means the aquifer is our only source of drinking water in the county. Much of what this committee does, ultimately, protects our water. The Counsel, as a body, has the opportunity to ask this advisory board to explore these topics and others that are within the scope of ENRAC. This board in particular is poised to work to address the sustainability and resiliency issues your environmental management team is already doing public outreach on. Many of us attended the Volusia County forward sustainability workshop, it was well received. These are real issues that will continue to challenge us. Working together proactively to address issues from beachside erosion to chronic flooding is the better option than reactive crisis in a judgment, although both may be necessary. In closing, advisory boards are a good tool to engage citizens and government, and to provide meaningful input to elected officials that can assist in their decision-making. JEFFREY S BROWER: Can you pause one second? Hold her time. Whoever has the phone going, can you turn it off? It makes it hard for everybody to hear. I do not want to rob you of your time. Thank you, go ahead. SPEAKER: In closing, advisory boards are a good tool to engage citizens and government and to provide meaningful input to elected officials that can assist with their decision-making. Final decisions on any ordinances or options still reside with the County Council. We respectfully ask you not to disband ENRAC. Thank you for your time. (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you, Melissa Lammers (?) while you are on your way up, I want to make a brief statement. I think we have probably all received emails about, questioning what we do up here. If we talk to each other, look at their phones or whatever. Well, everybody just saw Mr Reinhart speak to me and leave the room. I'm not quick to tell you exactly what he said, but I will let you know he wants to be here. He has a family emergency he's dealing with. I mean a critical, family emergency, so, I'm glad you are back and if you need to go at some point, go. Melissa, thank you. SPEAKER: Good morning councilmembers, Mr Reinhart I hope your situation results happily for my name is Melissa Lammers, I live in Ormond by the Sea, District 4. I believe a strong democracy requires citizen participation. Advisory committee members are some of the most civic minded and engaged citizens in our community. They give their time, their talent, in the form of their expertise, and their treasure. It costs money to drive to and from DeLand. All were free. It is one of the most fiscally responsible aspect of our local government and also one of the most representative. Most advisory committee members are appointed by you. They extend and increase your ability to take deep dives into matters that are important to constituents. The role of an advisory committee isn't to make decisions. That is your job. But rather to provide you with current knowledge, critical thinking and analysis so you can have greater confidence in your decision-making. I chair the environmental and natural resources advisor Canon committee, an extension of the county's charter requirement to have minimum standards to protect the environment. Members come from very different backgrounds, including agriculture, commercial development, environment of science, accounting, land-use law, and for mental engineering, community planning, real estate, environmental NGOs, government affairs and business consulting. What we have in common is a commitment to our work, to balance the needs of development with protection of the environment by thoroughly examining the questions before us, making sure each of us is heard. We have meetings before the three hour meetings of which we have always had a quorum of ENRAC's 14 member board has had two replacements in almost a year and half. I believe there are good citizens capable of keeping an open mind to do the hard work of advisory boards because I sit on a committee with a number of them. Of some committees are struggling, please address those but do not throw out the good with the bad. Finally, as vVce Chair of the campaign to root new Volusia Forever and Echo I keep a close watch on both programs, our campaign progress to accountability and transference to the public in the form of oversight committees. Establishing these committees was included in each of the separate resolutions reauthorizing the programs. The careers antithetical to the intent would make them unwieldy less effective and inefficient. I'm sure that's not what you want for the advisory board that is so popular. Advisory boards do important work for free that helps you get a handle on many issues you must decide. Members give free expertise to the county and represent our citizens. Please continue to work with them, thank you. (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: Paul, is it Paul Crosey (?) then Patricia Miles. and then Kathleen Thompson. SPEAKER: Thank you for the opportunity to address you on this important issue. My name is Paul Crocce. I live in DeLand. There are costs for groups like this, like ENRAC and others, but the plan and investments ahead make it worth it. Chairman, you are a better teacher than I am and you got most of your students to read their homework. So, well done. As a teacher myself, I notice we can't all study all issues. The advisory committees will do that homework for us. If you don't like their findings, their advisory, you can roll past them. But they are citizen voices. So please do not silence them, or divert them, or divert their work. The voices of the advisory boards offer potential, not to be political. That is not the point. It's good democracy. And it's good government. Carry-on and do the right thing. (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: Patricia Miles and Paul… I don't know how you knew that, but we had a rule in our house that if you didn't do the work, you didn't eat. That solved problem. (Laughter) JEFFREY S BROWER: Patricia? SPEAKER: Good morning, Chairman Brower, and councilmembers. I am a retired art teacher. I am a Voluisa County resident for more than 55 years. I live on Eureka Palm Drive in Port Orange Florida. I'm going to know something I don't typically do and I will go off script because many of the things I was going to say have already been said. Several times. One of the most important things I think, is how the Florida Art's Council, came up with data that said that the major contributing industries to Florida's economy, our retail, construction, arts and transportation and utilities. So, in pondering what could be happening as far as our cultural boards are concerned, I thought, "there is no way. These guys would eliminate any help in those areas." Because, we don't know what we don't know. You need help and input from your citizens. The arts and cultural economic activity accounted for $39 billion of Florida's economic activity. 33.1% of Florida's DPP, GDP is the monetary value of the performing arts, museum design services, fine arts education, and educational services. As far as jobs are concerned, Florida's nonprofit arts and organizations, and their audiences, supported over 90,000 full-time equivalent jobs and paid, $3.7 billion in Florida resident household incomes. That's an important factor. But here in Volusia County, audience attendees demonstrated a real appreciation for how the arts and culture impact their own lives and the well-being of our communities and residents. Your constituents reacted this way. 92% said, "this venue or facility is an important pillar for me within my own community." 95.5% said, "I would feel a great sense of loss if this venue were no longer available." 95.5% said, "this activity or venue, inspires a sense of pride in my community or my neighborhood." And 92.9% said... (Bell rings) SPEAKER: Do I have to stop? JEFFREY S BROWER: Yes, three minutes goes by so quick. Well done, and thank you for coming in. (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: Are you Kathleen? SPEAKER: Yes. JEFFREY S BROWER: You will be followed by Steve (unknown name) and Kara. SPEAKER: Good morning, Council and Council staff. Kathy Thompson. I live in Ormond Beach in Mr Kent's district, but I'm President of Daytona Playhouse in Mr Reinhart's district. I planned to attend the meeting to update you on Echo, which we plan to complete in April, which has been an incredible project for us, and I do want to take the time to thank every citizen of Voluisa County who voted to continue the Echo program. We can never have done this renovation without that. I will take the time to remind you of what you can and cannot do within Echo. It's a brick-and-mortar only expansion of your building. You cannot replace your 50-year-old roof. You cannot redo your parking lot. You can't use Echo money to get an air conditioning system that is not working, or a heating system. Echo requires you to sign a 30 year contract that you will stay open, offering your services to the community, but they don't offer you a dime to accomplish that. The vast majority of grants across this country only fund something new. They want a new program and event that serves some new part of your constituency and they only fund you for one year. If you want to continue that program, you have to find the money to do that. That is why the Voluisa County grant is so important to the arts and culture organizations who work very hard to obtain the limited grant dollars we are eligible for. It is one of the very few grants that actually allows money to be used to support the expensive programs we put on for our community. Royalties have increased, as just one example, going up 40%. That's the fees we pay to even put a show on. The Voluisa County grant has primarily been used at Daytona Playhouse for the children's musical production in the summer and that has allowed us to keep ticket prices to the Voluisa County camps, including from your area, Mr Santiago, and Daytona Lake Elementary School as well, that we have served faithfully for 12 years every summer, and we charge $6.50 per child. Counselors attend for free. If we don't get the grant, we cannot afford to do that. We have to raise ticket prices across the board. The Cultural Advisory Board services the county so well. They are all passionate and knowledgeable about the arts. They may have their own personal preference for a particular art but they never let that override their decision of how they support all of us. They are not politicians and they are dedicated… (Bell rings) JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you. SPEAKER: Pass a resolution to get our grants. JEFFREY S BROWER: Steve, Tara, followed by Samantha Stern. SPEAKER: Good morning, Chairman Brower, Council and staff. My name is Steve Wander and I live in Daytona Beach. I'm here to speak in support of advisory boards in general. Government works better when citizens are engaged and that's what you have with the advisory board. Smart people, volunteers, who support efforts by dedicating themselves doing research and other work that wouldn't get done otherwise. They provide you with knowledge you wouldn't have otherwise. Knowledge is power, and advisory boards give you more power to do your job well. Making government more efficient is a laudable goal. But dissolving functioning advisory boards would do the opposite. It would make you make less informed poor decisions making your government less efficient. Dissolving advisory boards would make it clear that you choose to not use all tools provided to you and make your decisions unless information and you don't value the contributions of engaged citizens. The rest of us, the people affected by your decisions and who rely on you to make wise decisions, deserve better than that. Thank you all. (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you. Tara Kisling followed by Samantha Stern, Jason… SPEAKER: I'm Tara, I'm up now. Good morning, everyone. Thank you for having me here. My name is Tara Kisling... And I've lived the last 30 years in Port Orange with my husband. We are both veterans and I'm very invested… I will talk fast, I don't know how this goes. I'm very invested in all of Voluisa County and I love it here. I dispatch 13 years with Armand. My last job was eight years at the airport here in Voluisa County so I'm invested in Voluisa County. When I retired, I immediately went to the Daytona Playhouse and threw myself into volunteerism. I have a passion for it and… These advisory boards that are made up of volunteers that are not only the experts you are all talking about, but they have the passion, they not only have the knowledge but they have the passion. So please don't think of combining them, this is too important. Let me tell you my favorite part. I have time to. My favorite part of volunteering… Let me tell you because it is interacting with our citizens. With constituents. That's my favorite part. Not only do they enjoy the show but we are part of them and their part of us. The good and bad times. When we had storms and they had… I talk with my hands. When we had the storms and we had damage at the Daytona Playhouse, they wanted to hear about that. I wanted to hear about the storm, the problems they had… We are part of that. There are health issues, coming back the joy of coming back and talking to people who are newly… I still have time. Talking about, talking to people who are newly widowed or people who are just moved in to the area and they used to be here part-time and they are so thrilled with what Voluisa County does for them. So, please do not think it is a small thing. These advisory boards, it's not been a streamline, what it will do is take away from that individual, the expertise and passion. It's extremely important that you hear from people from my angle. That's all I have but thank you and it was nice to meet you Mr Robins. I sent an email to everyone but I did hear back, thank you Mr Brower, Mr Reinhart, heard back from both of you so thank you and have a wonderful day and thanks for having me. (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: Smith, I am sorry you have to follow. (Laughter) SPEAKER: OK. Good morning, my name is Samantha Stern, I live in DeLand. I am the director of theater at Daytona State College and an assistant chair of the micro College of music entertainment and art. Thank you for hearing just a bit of my perspective today. As an arts educator in Volusia County, I get to work together with local theaters, artists, audiences and especially, students. In a tightknit community that brings invaluable enrichment to this area. There is some amazing talent in Volusia, as many of you know. Let me tell you, many students who have grown up in our local community theaters have received scholarships to our college because of the opportunities and expenses they have received right here in DeLand. Our graduates go on to work in New York City, on cruise ships, regional theaters, theme parks, national tours and as arts educators themselves. I am not only an educator and performer, but also the parent of two children, Leo and Stella, who take classes and perform at the wonderful Athens Theater here and participate in a plethora of cultural experiences through their school at (Unknown Name). These opportunities come directly from the support and input of the Volusia County Council Cultural Advisory Board. Their roots in our community serve as part of our lifeline. As I drove into downtown DeLand this morning, I pastor sign that says, Arts, culture and entertainment district. I had an incredible sense of pride and gratitude come over for me. Support for the board makes an incredible difference in so many people's lives. And while it may not always be quantifiable, I see it every single day in my work, in my community and in my family. I hope you will continue to allow our experts on the Cultural Council advisory board to help make decisions that make Volusia County an amazing place to live. (Multiple speakers) SPEAKER: Jason and Summer, you will be followed by Craig, followed by Ruth and (indiscernible). SPEAKER: Good morning, Council. The key for having us. My name is Jason (Unknown Name) we live in DeLand, my daughter Summer, is 11 who attends Athens Theater. She is here today because we homeschool our children. Mrs Baldwin, Ms Angeline and their staff are absolutely incredible. Cutting their funding, sunsetting or dissolving or combining this group with another with the a detriment to the program. Tuition is already expensive and cutting their funding would likely result in further increases. This could result in lower participation to the -- to the current economy. They have a record number of kids joining and the kids are awesome at their craft. Many children are not in traditional sports and this is their passion. We should not be looking at children's activities and art as a way to cut expenses. The tax impact per household is estimated at about $1.25, which is minimal. Athens brings value with all of their productions. Patrons come from all over to watch these performances, which in turn, drives revenue for our downtown business owners. I'm asking to please consider an alternative measure rather than impact the children. SPEAKER: Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. I am Summer (Unknown Name) and I am 11 years old. If it were not for Athens Theater, it would not have the courage to stand up here and address you today. I love to do theater and this is what I want to do when I grow up. I want to follow this through to my college, through these years and beyond. I love the entire staff at Athens, as they are sweet, kind and positive influences for all of us. I would hate to lose any funds for the program would cause. **Audio Lost/Video Rendering** **Audio restored** SPEAKER: ... The Cultural Council as you know, the citizen staff volunteer driven communities, including the esteemed Cultural Council are not just bureaucratic. They serve as a vital ridge between the government and the public. The Cultural Council is unique among advisory boards. It played a crucial role in the direct distribution of funds to arts organizations and applicants. These intricate processes involve careful review of extensive documentation, interactions of public minis, scoring applications and serving the public face of the granting process. On average, each councilmember invest considerable volunteer hours, contribute into the consensus driven decision-making process. Now let me emphasize the direct impact on our students and families. Arts organizations heavily depend on the annual cultural grant dollars provided by the Cultural Council, which in return, allows the organizations put additional resources into our public schools. Disbanding the Cultural Council would severely jeopardize these essential funds and consequently hinder the growth of our students and schools. Recognizing the economic impact in arts and prosperity study, cultural grants are critical. The EEP6 information was hand-delivered to you this morning. They promise to give that to you today at the end of the meeting. The designation enables the county to access funds from the arts license plate program and apply for state funds specifically designated for local arts agencies. Losing these income sources would not only hurt our cultural organizations directly impact the programs and initiatives that benefit our students and families. I urge the County Council to carefully consider these consequences this morning, prioritizing the well-being of our community, as you always do. The educational experiences of our students and the vibrant cultural landscape that defines our public and beautiful Volusia County. Thank you so much for your attention this morning. (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: Ruth Andrade Faye, followed by Traci (Unknown Name) followed by Jessica (Unknown Name). SPEAKER: Several of the groups I belong to open with the American's Creed. I believe in the United States of America is a government of the people, by the people, for the people. Who's just powers are derived by the consent of the government. We are a bottom up country, not a top-down country like Russia and China. Though cultural events, you will kill the town. When people come to theaters, museums, art fairs, they go to our restaurants and stores. They eat dinner before the theater and they visit all of the booths at the art fair. Without cultural events (indiscernible) entertainment will be jumping out of airplanes and hoping the parachute opens. When I moved here 30 years ago, (indiscernible) played beautiful music that was destroyed by a hurricane. Now there is only a mausoleum with the president and Mrs Holly bear there. I am looking forward to it being rebuilt. Tiger the Tugboat is not a cultural venue, it is more like the Liberty Bell in Philadelphia. An important part of the role Volusia County played in World War II. Tiger does not belong on the list. Nor does the (Unknown Name) station. I was treasurer of the Shoestring Theater for seven years, the grants do not begin to cover the needs of the 105-year-old African-American schoolhouse that was turned into a theater. Never forget our history. People will not want to move to DeLand if there were no cultural venues. Good, we have overbilled, killed too many trees, the traffic is horrible, the roundabouts are challenging. There is already anywhere to park. Go ahead and kill the town, get a mausoleum, thank you. (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: Traci? Followed by Jessica Gao, followed by Bill Wright. SPEAKER: Good morning, members of the County Council, my name is Traci Fulmer, Executive Director of Volusia immunity arts located here in DeLand. Stand before you today along with others part of the arts and cultural community to ask each of you to allow the advisory boards the Cultural Council and the grant to stay in place. Before I go further, I would like to share just one quote that spoke to me and I hope it does to you as well. "Arts and culture are not just frills but crucial elements of human life." We stand here today asking you to reconsider your potential decision on eliminating a program that brings a huge return of investment into the county and helps to enrich and benefit the community. The money received from the program is not what we exist on, it is more than 20% of our expenditures but it helps us to enrich the lives of those who are behind a pay wall and turned away from experiencing any number of programs. It allows the opportunity to be a part of a program that gives them a sense of ambition. If a tax rate of $0.25 per household, per year, is something this board feels is not a worthy amount, then engage with us. Contour establishments and events to see what we use these funds for. I know I, myself, have invited you in the past to see firsthand what we do. We look forward to a day that you do come. And the rest of the arts community filling this room today would probably do the same. We ask that you not cut the program until you are truly aware of what we all do. By allowing us to continue to enrich the tourism that Volusia County is well-known for, the return of investment continues to help in the growth of this community. It educates those who travel here about who we are and how the arts and culture are a integral part of the community. This grant is more than you realize. Those who acquire it are grateful for the use of it as well as those in the community who benefit from it. As you may or Mott -- may not know, there are no longer state funds available. I will end with another quote, which we use a DCA, "The idea is not to live forever. It is to create something that will." By Andy Warhol. Today, this is what we are all doing. Here in this room, and with your cooperation, we can continue to compass amazing things. Thank you. (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you. Jessica Gow, followed by Bill Wright, followed by Ellen winter (Unknown Name) SPEAKER: Good morning, Jessica, I will be brief. I have the honor of serving as a vice chair on Volusia Forever and ENRAC. I want to say, I went to the bathroom, "If I do not get back, you get the five (away from mic)" I think the number one thing, the benefit of advisory boards, is the people who are on them and the people who will,, are the same people who are going to fill this room if an item comes up. But he gives us the opportunity to have a collaborative discussion, not just soundbites arguing with each other. Bringing that collaboration, negotiation and bringing forward a proposal that is not always perfect. That is why we have you guys. But that brings both sides together that says this is our best shot. So, thank you. (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: Bill Wright? SPEAKER: He had to leave? JEFFREY S BROWER: You want to speak for him? Ellen (Unknown Name) followed by Alexa Baldwin. SPEAKER: Good morning, and thank you for the opportunity to let me address you all, talking about item 2. Attending government boards fulfill several functions. Here are some of the reasons you need to keep all of the advisory boards. The typically consist of experts in specific fields relevant to government policy areas. These individuals bring a depth of knowledge and special legislation that may not be readily available in the agencies. By retaining advisory boards, governments can tap into this expertise to make more informed and effective decisions. .. This allows them unbiased (indiscernible) public interest over short-term political considerations and this helps ensure more robust and balanced decision-making process. Complex issues often require a multidisciplinary approach. Advisory boards can provide a holistic perspective by bringing together professionals from various fields to analyze and address complex challenges. This ensures that decisions are well-rounded and consider a wide range of factors. Involving external experts in the decision-making process can enhance public trust. Advisory boards contribute to transparency by providing insights into the rationale behind certain policies or decisions. This openness can foster a greater sense of accountability and trust between government and public. Advisory boards are well-suited for long-term strategic planning. These bodies can conduct, inspect in-depth research, analyze trends, anticipate further challenges, and help governments develop proactive policies that address emerging issues. The boards can streamline decision-making processes by conducting thorough research and analysis and this can save government officials such as yourselves, time, resources and allowing you to focus on policy implementation, rather than spending extensive resources on research and fact-finding. **Audio lost** **Video rendering** SPEAKER: ... Technology process and ultimately serve the needs and interest of your citizens. (Bell rings) JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you. Alexa Baldwin, followed by Stephen and Jack Surette. SPEAKER: Good morning, everyone. My name is Alexa Baldwin. I'm the Executive Director of the Athens Theater and I live here in DeLand. Thank you very much for being here this morning and for allowing us the opportunity to speak. There have been quite a few different variations of the numbers. I believe, this to be correct… That it actually falls somewhere around $1.25 to a $1.95 per year, per household, is what we are talking about for these funds. So, that comes to about $0.16 per month towards the grant program. Based upon the 611,758 allocation. Just to give you an idea, my grant every year runs roughly around 100 pages. Sometimes it's been 97 or 112. It's a lengthy document. There are 32 different entities that come through here. It is the job of the Cultural Arts Council to go through and review all these documents through the different organizations. I would like you to imagine, upon all of your jobs, then putting that on you or your staff because, of course, if it's on your staff, you're paying your staff more which means more money on tax dollars. There's that to think of. You, secondly, you can see dissolving Council doesn't affect money, but it does because, again, you are looking at tax dollars that either A, would pay staff to do that. I would like to know how many of you guys have actually attended different events at some of these different organizations? I took a look into our ticketing system, and only – well, maybe three of you showed up. Mr Dempsey, it's been so long since you've actually attended. It doesn't show when the last event was, so it was definitely more than five years ago. There are several, David Santiago, I cannot tell if it was actually you or not who had attended… (Laughs) Let me see. I have it here. And, Mr Reinhart, I applaud you thank you for coming twice in the last four years. So, this is part of my thing but just to give you an idea, within your district, I did do a breakdown, per district, of how many tickets were sold to people within your districts. So, in District 1, in our last fiscal year, we sold 9498 tickets, to patrons who lived in District 1. In District 2, we sold 17,026 tickets, to people who lived in District 2. District 3, 11,713. District 4, 12,700. District 5, 6311. That also leaves… (Bell rings) SPEAKER: 810 tickets from people who lived outside Volusia County, bringing money into our county… JEFFREY S BROWER: Stephen? (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: Don, I think you and I ought to take our wives to Athens, what do you think? (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: (Laughs) SPEAKER: Hello Council, I thank you for the opportunity to speak. Stephen (unknown name) and I live in DeLand. Some of the folks who have appeared before, who have lived here for years, decades, generations. I'm here to represent the folks that have lived here for one year or less. We came down for an art show in 2023 and discover DeLand. We never left. We can choose to live anywhere. We chose to live here. It was due to the vibrant art community. If there's anything that puts them into jeopardy, I think folks like me would choose to live somewhere else. I think that's really all I wanted to say. Thank you for your time. Please do not dissolve the committees. Thank you. (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you. Jack Surette? JAKE JOHANSSON: Since we have emails regarding people coming and going, I would like to excuse myself to use the restroom. JEFFREY S BROWER: TMI. (Laughter) SPEAKER: My name is Jack Surette and I've lived in Ormond Beach for 60 years and have proudly served on the Echo Advisory Board. For five years also, the Volusia growth management commission. I'm currently a member of ENRAC, but my involvement over those years was for one real reason. That is to improve the quality of life in Volusia County. Either maintain it or make it better. So, I'm here today to just talk about ENRAC, and it's importance to the county. I , like many residents, are deeply concerned about the development, especially when they take a minimum interest in the county's natural resources. This is a serious issue and probably one of the biggest issues we will confront in the course of the next five years. ENRAC is an important part of that. ENRAC involves everything from stormwater runoff, to flooding, wetlands, and tree preservation. There's a lot to be done and it's hard work. Many of these ordinances have not been addressed in decades. The county has changed. We need to adjust to that. ENRAC makes no rules or regulations. We simply evaluate and adjust what we believe makes sense. You, the County Council, you decide whether recommendations are reasonable or ecologically beneficial. In effect, ENRAC is important to help you maintain Voluisa County's quality of life. (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: Deborah Wright, followed by Patty Party, and then Wendy Anderson. I think there are seats in the front of anyone wants to come forward. SPEAKER: Good morning, Council, Councilmen and citizens of Volusia County. I am proud to say that I have always been aware of the diversity of Volusia County. But never have I been more impressed, with the participation of that diversity. We all have unique ideas, opinions and needs and that is why we need every one of our advisory boards. You need every one of our advisory boards. Your staff, while remarkable, cannot do the total job. You need the citizens' advice, good government, you guys doing your job. Great government, is working with the citizens, and the citizens working with you. So, we do a fabulous job for Volusia County. We can only benefit from our cooperative collaboration. We are your resource, we are the voice of Volusia County. Please hear us. And thank you. (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: Patty, party. Followed by Wendy Anderson. SPEAKER: I live in DeLand district 1. I've highly edited three-minute speech so you're getting off light today. I want to thank David Santiago for taking my calls. I reached out to a few of the others of you during the course of the past few months and there's never a reply. I won't call out names, but David knows what it's like to talk on the phone, and yet he still calls me back and I appreciate that very much. I'm not even in his district. My first reaction to seeing this item on the agenda was that the optics are terrible. The cultural funding concern has been going on for almost a year. The arts and cultural community came out in full force in support of the county grant process. Assistance was offered for equivocation of any concerns the Council may have had. I do not believe it was taken seriously in any way. Then, fast-forward to December, came up again. Once more, no move was made to access the CCVC or any leadership of arts works for clarification. Then the mandatory county grant workshop date was pulled and not rescheduled. Last year's process was slow walked on the front end, which meant funding granted to qualified organizations was late in coming. Budget processes detailed laborious and carefully planned around awarded grants. I will skip a whole bunch about stuff. I ask you, please access those who can best provide the information you're seeking. Primarily the CCVC advisory board. And break the stranglehold and let us get to work serving the Voluisa County as we have for decades. Thank you very much. (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: Wendy Anderson, followed by Nancy Normand, followed by Camron… SPEAKER: Good morning, and thank you. I do feel like several other speakers have already spoken about the importance of citizen engagement for democracy so, I too, am going to go off script. Although I do want to share with you my first paragraph, which is that I was listening to Jason Kelsey's retirement speech yesterday, and really noted him quoting several other important people. I want to requote him now that, "no man is an island, we draw strength from each other, we all rely on each other, respect each other, even our differences. Because we know we are stronger together. And we all are part of a team here." All of us who serve on the citizen advisory committee. You've heard from a few people who have served on ENRAC with me and I've been honored to serve on this committee for a year and 1/2. We do take our work on this committee seriously. We showed up, these are long meetings and intense, I do wear a particular hat on this committee and find myself sometimes bringing a more extreme perspective to the committee just to play that role. I don't play that role everywhere I go. But what I have found, in the 18 months that we have been meeting, is that we have all grown to respect each other, to actually create friendships where, "Wow, that's a person I didn't start out liking and now I think he's pretty cool." We have learned from each other, we have grown as individuals and as a committee and we are doing important work for you. For you. We are doing the work that simplifies and streamlines our ordinances to make it easier, not harder. For our developers, our homeowners, landowners, to actually get worked on. And protect the environment in the process. We are looking at some of the changing trends in development like Low Impact Development. We are looking at the current trends in climate to see how the county needs to respond to that. This is hard stuff but we are doing this work and we appreciate the support you've given so far. We work for free, we have no budget as a committee and we appreciate the staff time that is invested in supporting our work and I would really appreciate your continued support unit so we can help you make a decision, thank you. (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: (Unknown Name) SPEAKER: Thank you, good morning. I am nouns -- Nancy Lowden morning, Executive Director at the (Unknown Name) in New Smyrna Beach where I have served for 28 years. I want to thank you for your time today, I would also like to recognize the cultural counsel. Many members are here and I thank them for their work for the questions that you asked during our grant reviews, for making us a better organization and for your support. Today I just want to briefly bring up something tha will be an unintended consequence if the Council were dissolved and it is that the council would lose its status... Next month, Atlantic Center for the Arts, for the third time, has been selected by the department state division of cultural affairs as the workshop retreat space for local arts agencies from around the state. If we lose our designation as a local arts agency, I doubt that is going to happen. This meeting next month gives the opportunity for all of our nonprofit, cultural organizations to have face time with those leadership positions from the division of cultural affairs. In addition, we could also lose our license plate money, which has been used to fund many seed projects for organizations here. I just wanted to bring those two things up. You will all be receiving an invitation to meet with the folks from the state and a look forward to seeing you all there. Thank you for your time. (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: Cameron Vincent, followed by Julie Petrulio(?) followed by Lloyd Bowers, I did not think you were here today. SPEAKER: Good morning have counsel, staff, my name is Cameron Vincent, I am executive of (Unknown Name) and I said on the Echo Gallery advisory committee. I come to you today to not reiterate what my colleagues have done such a beetle – my job to advocate for but to give you the numbers because you are ma'am -- med of numbers, correct? You have to be. The County of Volusia recognizes the unique contributions made by volunteers and encourages involvement and interest in the policymaking process through service as an advisory board member. The county advisory board is created by... To provide advice and recommendations to the Volusia County Council in diverse matters of public (indiscernible) On average our advisory committees, we have over 33, with 274 participants, on average about 40 hours a year. If we just do half of that, that breaks down to about 3400 hours a year. That is 500 hours a year for you to dredge up from your busy schedule, to try to create the personal connection with our community and their voice. I would like to remind you these advisory committees are volunteers with expertise in their fields. I'm going to pull an example from the cultural counsel, which is an advisory committee. You've heard a lot about it today. I will give you the numbers. 2022, the Volusia County cultural grant, roughly 80 to 90 pages, was able to quantitatively bring up figures so that we could give you a paternal investment infographic. 0.2 percent of the general budget was utilized on the cultural grant. That is an important number. The money invested into the cultural programs in this county that apply for that grant turn a return on investment of (indiscernible) percent. That is an investment gain of $970,000, for less than two dollars a year per household. 48% of all adults, not children, adults attended cultural points in 2022. I took all of this information generated from that extensive grant that the Cultural Council puts together to deem whether we are worthy of that counties money. This is just one example. 33 advisory committees that you have working for you, to benefit you. (Bell rings) SPEAKER: Vicki. (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you. Julie (Unknown Name) followed by Morty Bowers, followed by Chris Kemp. SPEAKER: Good morning, gentlemen, I will be brief, as most of my colleagues have covered a lot of these points. I am Julia (Unknown Name), a native of Daytona Beach Florida, born and raised. I am also a former member of the Cultural Council so I know what kind of work is involved. I am currently the vice president of Volusia County Cultural Alliance which as you know, is a nonprofit, on its own feet that advocates for arts and culture in the county. The Cultural Council is just one of these very valuable assets that you have. In case you do not know, when the Cultural Council receives these lengthy grants, each member must read the hundreds of pages involved, interact with the applicants at the public meetings, score the applications and work as the public face, your public face, in the arts community. That requires somewhere between 40 and 60 hours per member, just for the grant writing process. Highest and lowest scores are removed. The grants are averaged in that way, the funds are allocated by staff and approved by you. So, there is no grandstanding, no favorites, they fill in the forms. What they do, is ranked, scored and averaged. I just want to make that clear because I think there is a feeling that some people get better treatment than others in this process. They do not. I also want to point out that in that volunteer time, those 60 hours, it is about $1700 per person, using the average cost of a volunteer our. A lot of these guys and women are professionals. Their rates are considerably higher than that. So, 12,000ish dollars a year just from cultural counsel in kind gift. Multiply that by the number of boards, you have a lot of value coming to the county from those volunteers. In closing, I want to say, like the other speakers, I hope you will retain all of the advisory boards. Please take the time to make them better. I hope you will. But don't throw the baby out with the bathwater. Thank you. (Applause) SPEAKER: Lloyd Bowers, followed by Chris Kemp, followed by Steve (Unknown Name) SPEAKER: Chairman Brower, members of the Council, I appreciate this time. I am not going to go through what everyone else is already said because obviously you have heard a lot from us last year. I have been on the council Cultural Council, for over 12 years. First appointed by Josh Wegner, which is how long that goes. Currently I serve at Councilman Reinhardt's pleasure on this will following last year, we had a great discussion, I had the opportunity to meet with Chairman Brower. We talked about many things and many conceptions and misconceptions about the grant process itself. I recommended to him at that time, that we have a workshop at the Cultural Council, and this counsel, to address all of your questions, concerns. See if improvements need to be made, changes need to be made and go from there. That is in the process, the Cultural Council had their last special meeting, adopted a resolution setting up that workshop. I spoke with Chairman Brower yesterday and confirmed he was aware of that. So, we are going to be talking with you to see if there were ways we can improve that in a public forum. However, we are already way behind the eight ball for the second year in a row in reviewing these grant applications and even receiving the grant applications. Before an entity can file a grant with the Cultural Council for consideration, they must attend one of two mandatory workshops to discuss the grant process, qualification, how it works and the timeline. That was scheduled for January. We are already in March. If we are going to meet the work that we do, we need you to give us some guidance today. That we are OK for this year. That is the main thing I need to know from you. And the other people need to know from you. George Pappas came in, he is the current Council chair, I'm sure he has of the disease will. That is my primary concern, we want to do the work for you. Julie (Unknown Name) was right, takes us about 40 to 60 hours. I will defer to Councilman Dempsey to speak about the lawyer charges and how much those hours take of my time in George Pappas's time every year to do that. We enjoy doing that because we see the need, we see the support of the community and we see the effect, the positive effect, it has in this community. So please give us some guidance today that we are OK to go forward this year. Thank you. (Applause) SPEAKER: Chris Kemp, followed by Steve Tonges, followed by Susie Peace. Did Steve have to leave? Susie, if you want to take a seat at the front, followed by (indiscernible). SPEAKER: Sorry, had to take a temporary leave. My name is Steve Tonges (?) I live in DeLand in Mr Dempsey's district. I am speaking today for the flooding committee of faith. I brought some words of profound wisdom but there is really nothing I need to add to what is been said already. So, I will just point out that I walk funny because my toes are not getting signals from my brain. Excuse me. The means of communication, the nerves, have been damaged. Advisory boards are like those nerves. Irreplaceable means of communication and coordination between the citizens and the Council. We need to keep them otherwise we are going to walk funny. (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: Susie Peace SPEAKER: Hello, hello. Thank you for giving us this opportunity to speak her mind. My name is Susie Peace, I have lived in DeLand for 30 years. I feel like a déjà vu. I feel like we have to defend ourselves for parks and environment on a regular basis and I do not really understand why. As all of these people have said today, there is no reason to do away with these boards. To examine them is fine. Why don't you visit them? And visit the theater and visit the ENRAC meeting and see what is going on? As Pat says, I do not want to see you break the faith, the faith with your constituents, with your citizens. The definition of constituent is being part of a whole. I think you should trust us. We got you elected, we are the voters. I wanted to end with one quote from Clay Henderson, when he heard about this reaction, again, the doubt that you are having with citizens advisory boards. He said, "I hate watching these people with no institutional memory trying to dismantle good projects, we developed over time, which continue to have broad, public support." (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: Doug Bishop, followed by Donna Craig and George Pappas, you will be the clean-up guy. SPEAKER: I am representing myself and my wife Kelly Brown who is out-of-state. 11 Orange City. My wife is a board member for the little theater of New Smyrna Beach and I am a scenic designer. I we are asking you to reject item number two, and I had a whole long speech-everything, it has been said. I can go over it and over it, the numbers are the numbers. The one thing I would like to add into this is trying to merge or dissolve the Cultural Council a year after making an attempt to defund the same program is acceptable. It makes it feel like, after being told no, someone is trying again at one level higher. As a voter, that hits me. So, I would urge everyone to vote this year, get your voices heard. Any notion of cutting funds for the arts under the guise of being fiscally responsible is a disregard for the economic well-being of our community. Thank you very much, appreciative. (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: Donna Craig, and the last speaker is George Pappas. SPEAKER: In morning, my name is Donna Craig. I live in Ormond by the sea. I'm a member of the PLDRC and I'm speaking as a private citizen and I'm encouraged to see the number of people who have been standing up to speak on these issues today. I have heard a lot of support for the arts which is certainly very important. It is one of the sexiest things that you people can work on and I think a lot of people feel like that makes it all the more important. One of my guiding principles in my life has come from an old boss of mine, who I resented at the time, when he said, "Just because we can do something doesn't mean we should." I learned in the years that I worked for him how important that was. Just because we can do something, doesn't mean we should. This staff is made some recommendations, and my experience with the staff is that they are hard-working group of people who are even handed in the considerations for the different issues and I respect what they have to say. I also think that they should include in their report, just because we can, doesn't mean we should. The PLDRC, for instance, serves, in my opinion, a very important advisory group, bringing to the Council important considerations and recommendations on certain issues, having to do with variances in the county. We listen to not just the applicants but also the people who are immediately affected by the decisions that are made on the board. To me, it is the individuals who are affected by these decisions, whose voices speak the loudest, to bring things to the attention of the board, that we might not otherwise know about, or consider. So, I think the input of the citizens is important, and considering what goes on by all of the boards, and I hope that you will retain all of the boards because the citizen voices speak loudly and in an informed way, that you would not necessarily have. Thank you very much. (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: George Pappas. SPEAKER: Thank you. George Pappas, chair of the Cultural Council of Volusia County, and today, as we speak, I was born and raised in this area. Donna and I went to kindergarten and up through school. Anyway. I'm here to speak of the Cultural Council. I've been feeling that sometimes people think we are just handing out packets of money, which is not how it works at all. To be able to apply, you had to have been an organization for two years, you have to be nonprofit, have a Board of Directors, have to reach into the community – every single one of our grants has a portion of the grant that talks about what you do in the community. These grants extremely detailed, extremely detailed. We get about early one year, I guess, something like that. I've been on the committee for eight years or so. I spend when I get them, I spend one grant per day, at the end of my workday. An hour and 1/2 or so for each one and we can say 23. That's a lot of time to make sure that we are doing our fiduciary duty for the money we are doing. We are protecting our taxpayers money and we are giving out over 600,000. The Americans for the Arts, along with the Florida division of cultural affairs did a study, for Volusia County in 2022, and they were as follows: $17.7 million in spending and arts related cultural organizations, an additional $31.3 million in expenditures by the RTE and sis... $31.2 million in personal incomes to residents and generated $9.8 million in tax revenue to local, state and federal governments. Not a bad return on the money spent, I don't think. This – what the grants provided is operational expenses. That's it. Some of the smaller organizations might not be able to open their doors because they won't have enough money to have an event. The larger organizations, even the Museum of Arts and Sciences, they're not gonna get hit bad, but they might have to get rid of an employee, for example that they need. They might have to divert funds so they don't bring in the Megadon, they may bring in the Microdon. I agree with everyone here. I apologize that I got here late, I was in court. I listen to judges first. I hope you listen to everybody about the other advisory boards and I hope we stay a viable board with the grants, to keep the arts going in this community. It's a wonderful thing for the community. Thank you very much, I appreciate it. (Applause) JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you all for coming in. Some of you need to consider running for office. KARISSA GREEN: Mr Chair? I apologize but I like to take this opportunity to note that there are currently three vacancies on the Cultural Council, so we do have it up on the screen where all of these lovely individuals can apply. They would need to live on the west side in district 4, or in district 5, in order to serve, but those are all vacancies that are currently on the Cultural Council. They would click on the big green apply now button and it can be signed electronically and everything. JEFFREY S BROWER: That was K Green. You see me mention all the time, her email address. kgreen@volusia.org, she can help you with that. Thank you for the timely announcement. Rather than go through every one of them here, I would just ask the council if there are specific boards that you would like to talk about. David Santiago? DAVID SANTIAGO: Thank you, Mr. Chairman. All is the ones that I want to talk about and see what my colleagues have to say. Certainly give my individual comments. I think we should consider discussion after talking to staff and getting some historical perspective on the Library Advisory Board, we should have some discussions on, also I think we should have some discussions on the Code Enforcement Board, particular because of the struggles we have had in obtaining volunteers to properly facilitate the board, possibly consider a Special Magistrate as other government entities have looked at, to stream in the service and make sure we are providing the proper service because I think it is struggling now. I think conversations that I would like to have, specifically around ENRAC and its tasks, and really have some ideas on things we can have them work on. And if I may, Mr Chair, I want to make some comments of my involvement on the Cultural Arts Council. My journey regarding arts, and a few other things, but particularly the arts Council, and the impact it has in our community has evolved over the last year or so. I want to thank the conversations I have had with many people, on various levels. What was most impacting, to me, in that journey because I made it clear that I do not have all the answers. I think, the drive that we got here is important for me, as a policymaker and a budget approver. The historical perspective was the one that really hit me the best. And then tying that with the economic impact that it has – it was very moving for me. I am actually turned into – I guess you could've said a critic, I will take that label originally. Not necessarily, I didn't think the program had problems with it, someone mentioned the comment that the way you awarded was being questioned. It was never a question for me. To me, it was, do we need the programs? And what the impact is. That has certainly change my position. So much so, I made a comment in the council, and supports for my colleagues, had we find ways to enhance it and bring new entrants into participating into the program? I made that comment, probably three months ago, I think, or two months ago. I was particularly focused on finding ways to allow other entities that may not have the sophistication or the skill set or capabilities to enter the program, and lift them up. I would like to, as we discuss with my colleagues, is maybe task the board is saying, how do we enhance the program? With the premise of encouraging new participants in it. I will just add this, Mr Chair and we'll go from there – regarding ENRAC and reason why I wanted to discuss it, my historical perspective on that was that when the board was created, they were tasked with some specific areas that we wanted them to look at and come up with some recommendations to the Council. That was the original council that did that. We are a year and 1/2 into it, somewhere along that, I would like to find a way that we can guide the board. Sometimes a little pressure will get them to where they need to be. However, over the last week, for me, reevaluating stormwater, issues around stormwater, in the topic and the heated discussions around stormwater have brought me to consider the be we can task and redirect ENRAC with a specific task. One of the questions I had in our last committee meeting, I asked about the standards that are being applied for development. Clay did a great job of clarifying that. I am open to looking at other methodologies or technologies to implement to avoid any flooding, if we can. We can't predict all storms, but I am open to saying, how do we bring Volusia County to a standard that is viable? That is a key, I don't have the answers, I am not an engineer. I know we have some good professionals that serve on ENRAC, but as an individual council member I would like to repurpose, get them to wrap up what they are doing with the time frame, but repurpose them with one of the potentially biggest priorities, when it comes to development, how do we handle stormwater? And for us to implement something, possibly in the future, that is feasible. If you have followed me over the years, I like to follow the rule of law, so as long as the rules are printed for everyone, I like to apply them to everyone. (Bell rings) DAVID SANTIAGO: We should look at them and possibly re-enhance them. JEFFREY S BROWER: Matt Reinhart. MATT REINHART: I will make mine brief, I appreciate the fact that I may have to leave I have an emergency situation with my daughter. I may have to leave, she is in Halifax right now. What I do want to bring up with respect to the Cultural Council, was support wholeheartedly last time, and will continue to be supportive of this. I have answered numerous emails, I shared a story. We had an inmate that we discovered had a talent that was untapped into, and we used that inmate to decorate a wall. That was my first experience with seeing what capabilities people have out there that are untapped. With what the Cultural Council has out there, more involvement needs to be had. Karissa, thank you for sharing that, because there's a lot of people here in support of it, and they continue that support and I will advocate for that support. Fortunately we don't have anybody in district 2 that was needed. That being said, I was really taken with the young lady Summer. Is she still here? I was really taken with that. You made me think of my situation right now, so good job on that and well done. I have to agree, code enforcement, I served on the Code Enforcement Board for the city of New Smyrna after I left corrections, so I see the benefit of having Special Magistrate handle those issues, I can tell you right now. I know that some of the colleagues that I had on the Code Enforcement Board and the city of Daytona, they do a very great job and it works, it really does. They don't have an issue with finding individuals to fill that. So, I commend them for that and I was very eager to do that. We did not have an issue in New Smyrna, so I commend your area, Mr Robbins. A number of cases get forwarded onto the Special Magistrate, so if we are having an issue, that's warranting a discussion I think we need to talk about that. The ENRAC, I'm in support of that as well. I agree with what you said, Mr Santiago. I like updates. I like knowing where they are at and can we redirect them to focus on an issue that's currently at hand right now with respect to flooding. We are on the backside of two very powerful storm and its a matter of when they are going to hit us again, so we need to pay special attention to that because it is an issue. I would like more discussion about that. Library Advisory Board, I would like to hear more about that. I agree. That was on my list to discuss as well. I do have an individual that's in my district that is very passionate about that. I noticed one gentleman is not here right now that is very passionate about that, so I would like to hear about that more before we make a decision with respect to that. Other than that, I'm with you and I would like to talk about Ccode Enforcement, Library Advisory, and to see what can be done with respect to what we get an update basis about ENRAC. Thank you, Mr Chair. JEFFREY S BROWER: Jake Johansson. JAKE JOHANSSON: I have a few comments but first I will tell you the ones that I think need to be looked at. I, too, believe the Library Board, Code Enforcement, going to the Special Magistrate, I would like to look at the Housing Finance Board and see if there's any slop that can be adjusted. The firefighter, volunteer firefighter pension board, whatever we call that. Animal Control and the Business Incubator Advisory Board, if we can adjust that at all. If you look at most of those folks, they are kind of staff and maybe we can work on that. A couple of general comments: you've heard me many times and I know a staff member will kick me in the shins about this one. I'm a less Government kind of guy and I find Advisory Boards to be an extension of Government, and therefore very bureaucratically hard to manage. Advisory Board by and large shouldn't be talking about issues that they talk about in the board, outside of the board. So let me take for instance, because I had a lot of conversations, the ENRAC board. Doctor Wendy Anderson, who works at Stetson and Miss (unknown name) who is the Board Chair. Technically cannot get together for a cup of coffee and have a very good strong conversation about the way ahead for flooding. That is off limits. What size trees we ought to keep and what size we ought to cut – they cannot have a cup of coffee and talk about that. They cannot talk about sea levels rising or climate change. They cannot talk about anything that may come up for vote in the future. That some very strict – two of the many smart individual people on that board from collaborating, not to mention the rest of the folks. That is just two of them. Do I want the ENRAC, yes. Do I have problems with advisory councils being restricted on what they can do and how flexible they can be? I do. I want to share with you one thing. We have obviously a contentious issue up in Ormond with a fuel distribution placed. There is no fuel distribution or I2 Advisory Board to tell us what to do. Yet, those people came out in force and shared with us their thoughts outside of an Advisory Board. They went and had coffee together, they got their act together and got a lot of information, and they presented it to us. There is a case where an Advisory Board was very instrumental, very influential in getting her attention. I don't want advisory boards for the sake of Advisory Boards. But I do understand that our community has a voice in a lot of these things. And there's a few folks that mention that we ought to strike down item 2. But item 2 is not just about the board you are on. Item 2 is about a list of about 20 boards, some of which do need to be changed. So realize item 2, although all-encompassing, there are some good points that need to be addressed and identified, and may be made a little more flexible and a little more actionable. I know the ENRAC gives us an annual report. I would like to hear from those people more often as well. It sounds like I'm going to hear from now on now that I have established some lines of communication that I will take part in. So, I appreciate everybody's comments. I think you will find that I'm a man that works more on reason than passion, but there's a lot of reason and the passion that you share today and I will be taking them all into account. JEFFREY S BROWER: Don Dempsey. DON DEMPSEY: I'm in favor of retaining these advisory boards and I agree with the majority of people that spoke today. They said that these were citizen volunteers and I think it's good to have these boards because if you want to get involved in your community on a certain subject matter, I think it's good to have a board that maybe addresses your concerns, and you can go to that and give your input. To have a collective advice to give us, I just think the more sources of information we can get on a subject matter is great. I understand what you are saying, Jake. Just having 800 people here on what issue, it might be better to have them go to a Advisory Board and give some sort of collective bit of advice, as opposed to just everybody coming and not knowing where to channel their concerns and information, except directly to us. I'm in favor of keeping all of these boards. I guess there's a lot of fear in the room about getting rid of culture arts funding. It is déjà vu, to quote someone but I just want to remind you and the young lady from Athens, I ran a comedy club here for six years, OK. It was a replica of the Gotham Comedy Club. I agree that the last time we were here that comedy was a form of the arts. I think George's son, as he was trying to get into comedy, performed here a few times. I have a huge interest in the cultural arts, especially stand-up comedy. We have, the improv, there is the funniest competition in Florida... One other club that they chose was my club in Deland. This was back from 2009 to 2015. I had kids and I had to close down because I didn't have time. I have very limited time, so I couldn't be there at the club two nights a week. I just want you to know that I'm not just some evil guy that does not like the arts because I put my money where my mouth was and my time. I lost thousands and thousands of dollars on that club, only because I love stand-up comedy and I wanted to bring something to community. To sit here and say that I don't have an appreciation for it, I mean, it's misguided. To quote Pat Northey, she quoted, "No man is an island", but to quote a comic, "No man is an island but I am a Peninsula." I lost money, probably over hundred thousand dollars that I lost in the six or seven years because I like to stand up comedy so much but I never once thought to even ask these guys to help kick in. I never thought of taxpayers having to kick in to support my passions. I'm learning it's a part of the community and I understand that these things can all be run without Government assistance, so I am sympathetic like David. I have grown to appreciate the arts and that the land is a mecca for the cultural arts. I just don't want to be checked off as somebody who was unappreciative of what you guys do. I think cultural arts is a critical part of our community and I'm in support of its. That's all. Thanks, guys. JEFFREY S BROWER: Troy Kent. TROY KENT: Thank you chairman. Just a few brief comments. First of all, to Karissa Green, I love that the chairman gave the latitude for the commercial that you did. The timing was perfect and I just wanted you to know I thought it was great. That being said, Councilman Dempsey, not that you need anybody to stand up for you and I love what you just shared. I will get to those comments that I have in just a moment but our advisory boards do hard work to help us make the best educated decision that we can. And I cherish the hard work and volunteers and spirit that all of those individuals and the boards collectively, put into to help our community. That being said, Councilman Santiago and Councilman Reinhart, and Councilman Johansson, I think it's totally appropriate to have a healthy discussion and look at these boards that you gentlemen mentioned and see if things can be made better. That's not a bad thing. It's a healthy exercise. I'm glad that we are doing it. I was not put on blast and I don't mind sharing this, but unfortunately, I've never been to the New Smyrna Playhouse. I hope to get there one day soon. The Daytona Playhouse, I just want to tell you all in the 3 1/2 minutes that I have left, a few years back I took my wife and son to a show right before Halloween and it was a radio show. It mentioned in there that it was preferred if you would dress up. I had my son and wife wearing masks of their choosing and I had actual makeup paint on my face. I was Count Dracula during this radio show. JEFFREY S BROWER: Where's the pictures? TROY KENT: I have pictures. The interesting thing is it was packed and there was five people dressed up. And myself and my wife and son were three of the five. But there was only one that had makeup on his face that could not take the mask off, and at times we giggled because I thought I looked like Count Dracula but others might've said Uncle Fester from the Addams family with the white on my face. It was a great moment that they Kent family has locked in our brains and the Athens Theater, I don't get over to Deland nearly as much as I would like to, but I brag about this town. I took my family to the Christmas Story play because we love live performances and I wanted to see if Ralphie was going to shoot his eye out. We have a leg lamp that goes up every year in our front picture window. That's how serious we are about it. I recently took my mother and father to see Misery because I wanted to see Paul Sheldon and Annie Wilkes go at it. The reason I bring that up is that I was going to talk about Don Dempsey and what he did in this town because I didn't know – I didn't know Don before this election. I didn't know Jake, Danny, Don, Matt and our chairman. The only one I knew was David Santiago because he brought home the bacon and did great things for Volusia County when he served eight years in the state legislature, representing Deltona, but you helped many cities. So you are the only one that I knew. My heart was heavy when someone decided to put several members on blast about what they attended or what they did not attend. I wish that would not have happened, free will, do what we want. She can put me on blast for attending two events there, regardless, I love the place. In fact, my notes that I have read that it is a wonderful, quaint first class venue, and I am talking about the Athens Theater. I think the way of getting there and calling people out – not my style. Publicly, and I learned this sitting on the dais with you, that you opened the comedy club in downtown Deland and you put your money where your mouth was and did not ask for assistance. And for that, publicly, I say thank you, sir. (Bell rings) JEFFREY S BROWER: Danny Robins. DANNY ROBINS: Thank you, Chair. Really quick, Troy, trying to picture you with the face paint. Listen, cultural arts identifies communities. I will not get into everything that everyone said, I think it has already been said already. I definitely think it has been worth keeping, not just now but for a very long time. That being said, Councilman Santiago and Johansson made excellent points. My focus was ENRAC and really getting our message through to the members of ENRAC and for their goals, and we had a goal setting session and we want to make sure that we transfer the goals to ENRAC that we were working in the same direction for the betterment of the community. As well, our staff put in a lot of time on top of the volunteers for the board, like every board. I want to make sure that we are working together and on the same page in the same direction. Everything else is been said. JEFFREY S BROWER: I want to make sure that I have all of the boards that have been brought up. I've got for discussion the Llibrary board, Animal Control Board, Code Enforcement Board, ENRAC, Cultural Aarts, Volunteer Fire Fund – is that one that you brought up, Mr Johansson? Who brought it up? I thought three or four people did. To discuss. OK. DAVID SANTIAGO: To bring the clarity, the chairman is partially right on that. I think I had suggested the possibility of discussing how we can task them with looking into how we can enhance the program to allow for more entrance to enter into being participating in the program, that is what I had said. JEFFREY S BROWER: Yes. Volunteer Fire Fund, and the Business Incubator Advisory Board. Was there anything that I missed to anybody wanted to discuss? KARISSA GREEN: I do believe Mr Johansson also wanted to discuss the Housing Finance Authority. JEFFREY S BROWER: OK. We will take each one of those, and I will reserve my comments for when we get to the particular boards. David Santiago? DAVID SANTIAGO: Thank you, I will take a stab at it for time purposes and maybe take on the easier once's first. The Code Enforcement Board, the struggles getting people to participate and apply the court accordingly. Staff had talked about the possibilities of bringing Special Magistrate to facilitate. I will start with emotion, I motion with direct staff to come back to the council with the necessary resolution, ordinances, whatever they need to implement a Special Magistrate in place of the current process. JAKE JOHANSSON: Second. JEFFREY S BROWER: A motion to move to a Special Magistrate by David Santiago and second by Jake Johansson. Do you have a comment, Mr. Attorney? You are just here for questions? OK. I see Jake and Don – is that to discuss this? OK. Jake, go ahead. JAKE JOHANSSON: Thank you. Just so you know where I come from on this, when I was a city manager in Port Orange we moved from a code enforcement to a Special Magistrate, for this very reason. In my research the past couple of weeks, majority of our counties and many of our cities have a Special Magistrate. Some have both and if you have what we have, just the Code Enforcement Board. I feel that, although we have to pay for Special Magistrate, it adds another layer of impartiality to the code enforcement cases. Usually, a lawyer or retired judge or somebody who is not as tied to the elected officials as, may be our appointed code enforcement people are, if we can even appoint them. I strongly believe that the Special Magistrate is the way to move forward here, but I appreciate the time. JEFFREY S BROWER: Don Dempsey? DON DEMPSEY: Are we talking about making a vote to actually switch to Special Magistrate now? Or asking staff to come back with an evaluation – JEFFREY S BROWER: Staff would have to bring it back. DON DEMPSEY: I still would like to know how the appellate review standards of the Code Enforcement Board versus a magistrate would be different, and how a person can seek... MICHAEL G DYER: appellate standard reviews would remain the same, Florida statutes provides an appeal to certain Court of Appeal decisions or magistrate. State law requires the board to have an attorney which you do have in place, so from a cost standpoint, I don't see a huge difference because you are to paying for the attorney who also serves as a Special Magistrate for the county, and some other areas that you have already prior councils have designated such as dangerous to (indiscernible) trust beach appeals. I don't think it would change the review process, at all. It would be a hearing officer instead of a code board making the decision which would be subject to appeal. DON DEMPSEY: What we are voting on is to have staff come back? MICHAEL G DYER: an agenda item for you to consider. DON DEMPSEY: Thank you. JEFFREY S BROWER: Are you done, Don? DON DEMPSEY: Yes. JEFFREY S BROWER: I think that we have – Jake has a motion to send it to staff to bring back an ordinance. I think this does need a lot of discussion, and I think that is probably the way to do it. We can vote on it then, instead of running through it all right now. There's a lot of considerations. I am not happy with the Code Enforcement Board process, that doesn't mean I'm unhappy with any of the people, it is a cumbersome process for our residents to deal with. I would like to see it improved. I am not sure if that is the best way or not, so we need to hear about it. So I think it is a good idea to give it to staff to bring back and give us more information. I would like to ask the staff just one question on that Board – did I learn yesterday that is the only board that gets stipend? MICHAEL G DYER: I need to defer to Clay on that. CLAY ERVIN: Good morning, Clay Ervin, director of growth and resource management, other boards such as the Construction Licensing Contract Appeal Bboard which also gets a stipend. JEFFREY S BROWER: I would like to – we don't have to do it right now, but when it comes back to know how much that is, because one of the things we are considering is cost. We have the pay of Special Magistrate, they are not cheap. We do have expenses now, and staff time, attorney's time, and this stipend because it is a very active board. It takes a lot of time for people. MICHAEL G DYER: I think putting this stipend aside, it probably is a wash, in the sense that you are paying an attorney now to sit there to have the attorney be the hearing officer. From a cost standpoint, aside from the stipend, which is a valid point, I don't expect much of a change there. JEFFREY S BROWER: OK, we will discuss it when it comes back. David? DAVID SANTIAGO: (indiscernible) JEFFREY S BROWER: Let's take a vote on this, if you want to send it to staff to come with an ordinance language to switch from the board to Special Magistrate, all in favor, say aye, and he opposed? That carry 7 to 0, David Santiago for another motion. DAVID SANTIAGO: I will take this on next, maybe a lot of people sitting in the audience might want to go to lunch instead. Regarding the Cultural Arts Council, it has been said that the Council is supportive of it including myself. However, I move that we instruct staff to get with that board and task them, along with all the additional stuff that they do and, thank you, to come up with recommendations for the council to consider on potentially ways that we can enhance the program, which would include a focus on how we can potentially bring new entrants. JAKE JOHANSSON: Second. JEFFREY S BROWER: Motion made by David Santiago, second by Jake Johansson, to instruct staff to communicate with the board. I have a question about that – that is already in process. Isn't it? That you're communicating with the board, and setting up a workshop? GEORGE RECKTENWALD: Yes, we have already had a meeting, several meetings, actually had one specifically with Mr. Pappas, and these folks. We went over the very desires that you are talking about. They're working on that very thing – how to increase people to be eligible. You guys have talked about maybe a system of some coming on and some coming off. So, that is being worked on today. I do have a question, because that is a little bit of a process. Would it be the Council's desire, under the current method, to go ahead and distribute the way that they normally do with the applications while we work this out? And the goal will be for the next cycle. I'm getting concerned for some of them, that need the money, and it occurred today, that they are on thin margins. They need to get that cycle going. DAVID SANTIAGO: Mr Chair, if I could, I could probably withdraw the motion because is not necessary. If you're already working on it I don't want to great emotion. I will withdraw the motion. As far as I'm concerned, business is usual as the board. JEFFREY S BROWER: I agree with that. Jake? JAKE JOHANSSON: Withdraw the second. JEFFREY S BROWER: Any opposed to withdrawing this? Staff and the board, you all can go and do business, as usual, and we will look forward to meeting with you. Thanks for coming in. I didn't think you were coming today. You got out of court! (Laughs) DAVID SANTIAGO: One of my last, Mr Chair. Thank you, Mr Chair, I had mentioned ENRAC and one or two other colleagues. I would like for us to consider, through staff guiding the ENRAC board, to work with staff, and kind of, maybe, sum of the work they have been doing for a year and 1/2. I get it, they are difficult topics, their handling a lot more than can be done in the time frame. But, more so, instruct those individuals to focus on stormwater and how the county can enhance its stormwater development requirements, in a smart way. I would just say this, I want to make the statement, I moved to instruct staff to get with the ENRAC board to redirect the ENRAC committee to focus on stormwater enhancements, suggestions for the County Council. JEFFREY S BROWER: We have a motion by David Santiago to direct the ENRAC committee to include discussions on stormwater. DAVID SANTIAGO: Prioritize it. I wanted to be their priority, focus. JEFFREY S BROWER: OK. To make that their priority. Is there a second on that? JAKE JOHANSSON: Second. JEFFREY S BROWER: And the second is made by Jake Johansson. Is Ginger still in the house? Can you give us a quick update? I've attended several ENRAC meetings and you have a full plate. You have a lot of things you are dealing with. It is a stormwater part of it now? Or, is that something that you need to add in? GINGER ADAIR: Ginger Adair, environmental management director. We've been working on a suite of issues. One of our priorities was the impact development, which is of course a stormwater issue. You voted on that and now staff is working on the low impact audit tool that you directed us to do. That work will come back ultimately to you. That storm water related. Specifically the stormwater code is on the list but it was further back in the list of priorities. There is no reason we cannot change that list of priorities, so we can absolutely do that. I think we have one more meeting tomorrow dealing with the tree ordinance. It would be great for the community to wrap that up at tomorrow's meeting and then at the next meeting – we meet once a month. We could jump into the storm water with folks from our development team, obviously. JEFFREY S BROWER: Members of the Committee are all nodding their heads. I think your motion is appropriate to make that a priority. Any more discussion on this? Danny Robins. DANNY ROBINS: Councilman Santiago, would you be open to adding to your motion, or modifying it? Like we heard from a constituent here today, easier processes, simplifying the process and possibly eliminating codes and reducing, just in line with the direction that this council as a whole, in terms of reducing this bureaucracy in some of this – I just want to make sure we are all less, less. And I haven't seen anything less come from the board and just more, more and more. Would you be open to some of those other avenues? DAVID SANTIAGO: I will just be for myself. I would like for the board to explore all options, including that. There is a lot of discussion in our last meeting about the code and how does the stormwater code affect different storm events? I want them to look at that and find reasonable methodologies or new technology that's reasonable. We cannot overprice the market, but things that maybe Volusia can be a pioneer in, a reasonable pioneer to address some of these things in the future. I don't have those answers. I understand that the board has a very well balanced approach and I hope that individuals from all of those approaches are reasonable. And come forward with some suggestions. At the end of the day, we decide what we want to implement but I don't want to leave it, that issue untouched because of the sensitivity and the urgency. That's why he made the suggestion. Yes, I'm up to it. DANNY ROBINS: I agree with everything you said. If we don't include it. Or, I can make a separate motion. JEFFREY S BROWER: We have a motion to reset priorities to make Stormwater Management a priority, and if the Committee would look at, not only adding regulations, but is there something we can, are there regulations that we can do without? I think that's also going to be a key factor for me in the Code Enforcement Board discussion. What regulations that we have laid onto people, that we could, one of our goals as a Council is to bring more business into Volusia County and sometimes they feel like they are being run off by the amount of regulations that we put down on them. That's going to go for me on the Code Enforcement Board as well. DAVID SANTIAGO: Can I add something? I think the important piece is that I have talked to people in the development industry that often time have to absorb regulations that we implement. I think we will find more interestingly, if we include them, or invite them, even if they are not a board member, to participate you will probably find a lot more consensus in the development industry to include them in the discussions. Just because you are not a board member, they should not be. We should have dialogue that is reasonable and suggestions that are reasonable and apply those to everyone equally. JEFFREY S BROWER: David, just so you know, I'm smiling at the attorneys in the room who are all nodding when you said that (Laughs). Jake Johansson. JAKE JOHANSSON: We are talking about flooding and we are talking about urgency. We are talking about sensitivity. Every Council Meeting we have somebody come up and tell us about their property flooding. And we will make it a priority for the ENRAC, who meets monthly and we've invited smart people from that Advisory Committee to meet once a month for three hours to come up with ways to cure our urgent problem. This is what I'm talking about with Advisory Boards: we have no better way to do it right now, so give it to the Advisory Board but if you allow these people, outside the sunshine to collaborate, you could get it done a whole lot quicker. When you are wondering why the Government is so slow, it's because we just gave a very important issue to you all, to an advisory Committee that meets once a month. They do great work 12 times a year. I urge you all to consider taking a more flexible and collaborative approach to getting things like this done. The tree ordinance, let them go figure it out. Flooding, probably not. If we want to solve that problem in the next three years, we've got to have a more flexible and agile approach to it. That's all I have to say. Thank you. JEFFREY S BROWER: David Santiago. DAVID SANTIAGO: Good point, Jake. Is there anything preventing the board for meeting more often? Maybe they can meet twice a month? Clay or Ginger? CLAY ERVIN: Clay Ervin, Director of Growth and Resource Management. It's a matter to maintaining a quorum and the volunteers being able to attend two meetings a month. And just to be very honest, the workload on staff in preparing for that as well. DAVID SANTIAGO: Maintaining a quorum is up to them, right? Making sure we have this Committees in place, the viability and success is dependent on the volunteers. I would be OK if staff could coordinate and meet more often... I think the flooding issue is an important one, right? Working with staff to come up with some recommendations, I'm open to it. I don't have the answers. I need suggestions from others. JEFFREY S BROWER: I would just add to that, that there's also nothing that prevents us from going to their meetings and listening to what is being discussed, and, for any Committee Member to set up a meeting with any Council member and tell us things that you, that's no violation of sunshine law, to tell us things that you think we should pick up here at the Council to discuss. I would encourage you to do that. Some of you do that now and I hear from you regularly. George Recktenwald. GEORGE RECKTENWALD: Yeah. In response to Mr Johansson, I think we have a long-term issue and where would go with ENRAC, you are talking about a lot of cases in future development and regulations. The people that came in today that were complaining about flooding, the water is in their yard – it's not in their house by the way, it's in their yard. I want to clarify that but I already have a meeting set up with the City of DeLand with some jurisdictional issues. We always say stormwater doesn't know what jurisdiction it is in. I think we will work together for some solutions because some of these cases, the toothpaste is out of the tube and we will have to look at some solutions to deal with issues that are in older neighborhoods, or neighborhoods that were new development meeting older development, that may require different set of solutions then the other side that's trying to have new things, not add to the problem, or maybe solve the problem. But some of these things that I'm dealing with now are now. To your point, that's going to be more staff driven with our engineers and city engineers, possibly some consultants that will have to look at, "Are there things we can do to help in some of the situations where you have high water table around Deland?" And then you have other work being done by the cities and other areas with this upcoming grants for infrastructure, the HUD program, and other FEMA litigation programs. Those are other projects that will be coming forth to deal with the flooding. As a now project, versus the long-term planning type thing that I think you are talking about with ENRAC. JEFFREY S BROWER: Jake Johansson. David Santiago. DAVID SANTIAGO: I just wanted to add, I'm glad you chimed in because the intent is not to stop anything staff is doing. Staff continues business as usual until we change the process. The suggestion is for ENRAC to look at long-term, or whenever they get done, which we would probably should put barriers around that in my opinion. This part, they may not like. Somebody had a famous quote that I wanted to add here. I think it was Ronald Reagan that said, "Nothing last longer than a temporary Government program." Right? Specific to ENRAC, they were tasked with something that was very difficult, but that's why I think this council should be relined it to be more specific on the outcomes in a timely manner. And maybe at the end of this meeting, we can have some suggestions on that particular, lengthen time on that particular Committee, if this council so chooses. But continue business as usual and continue with the biggest issues that we can address and come up with recommendations. Thank you Mr Chair. JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you. We have a motion and a second on the floor. I will just add to what you said, Councilman Santiago. When this first came up I think it was Ben Johnson who proposed this board. I didn't support it for all the reasons that you just said but now that it's in place and I have gone to their meetings, I think it's a essential board. It's pull together people who are, not hateful to one another, but are usually on opposite sides of issues. From attorneys who were hired by developers, by engineers that work with developers, by the educational people from our universities, from environmentalists and just normal citizens. I watch them get together and have conversations and actually form friendships and work together. I think that's essential for our community going forward. So nobody's disagreeing with that and I'm certainly not saying that. I want the people in ENRAC that are sitting here today to hear that and to know that, what you are doing is helpful to our whole community, to have these kinds of conversations. The motion on the floor is to look at your priorities and bring stormwater treatment up. You really just did that with what you brought us on low impact development. I know it's a priority, but as George said, there's a lot of work to be done still. And part of that motion was added to look at things that are required, that might not need to be required. So big task to a big job already, Ginger (Laughs). Job security. I don't see any other discussion. If that is an adequate explanation of the motion, all in favor say aye, any opposed? That motion carries 7 to 0. We've got ENRAC, we've got the Code Enforcement Board, cultural arts Council, done. OK. We will take the library board next. DAVID SANTIAGO: I'll make this simple, I move that we advise staff to come up with a recommendation – excuse me, ordinance – to eliminate the advisory board and how it will be governed going forward. JEFFREY S BROWER: The motion is to send that to staff to bring back a proposal to eliminate the Library Board, and any impacts that would have. Is there a second? Seconded by Danny Robins. Discussion? Troy Kent? TROY KENT: Briefly. I may be in favor of that, but the way it was worded is have staff come back with basically were going to get rid of the board. I don't know if I am there yet. I don't have enough information. I need more information from staff and I may be there after I get that, but I think the way that it was worded, it puts out a message that we are ready to get this one chopped off the block and I don't know if I am there yet. DAVID SANTIAGO: Good point, Troy. I talked about messaging earlier and that is probably not the best way to message that. If I can, Mr Chair, I will amend the motion to direct staff to come up with recommendations on the Library Board, and potential ordinances for us to consider. JEFFREY S BROWER: Second still stand? I think it is better. Any other discussion on that? All in favor say aye, any opposed? Library Board will come back for discussion. We are going to put a lot on you, this morning. He says, with a smile. Jake Johansson, you wanted to discuss the Animal Control Board? JAKE JOHANSSON: The Animal Control Board advises staff, and we have a Special Magistrate that does some adjudicating as well, Mr. Dyer? MICHAEL G DYER: Your Animal Control Board used to give recommendations on changes to your ordinance, which they still do. They also used to have a quasijudicial hearing on dangerous dog hearings, and it was changed to have advisor, and now they are advising on possible changes to ordinances. JAKE JOHANSSON: Are citizens not part of an advisory boards and professionals have input on that to the staff on a daily basis? I would like to make a motion to instruct staff to bring up options for using what used to be, or what could be, the Animal Control Board, to advise staff on ordinance changes outside of an advisory board? JEFFREY S BROWER: OK. I'm not sure I understand that. Options? JAKE JOHANSSON: Option to get rid of the board, otherwise come up with reasonsable options for getting the expertise, without being part of an advisory board. JEFFREY S BROWER: OK. Motion is to have staff bring back options to including to eliminate the board, and get that information by other means, outside of a board. Correct? Before I call for a second, staff is good with that? GEORGE RECKTENWALD: We understand. I want to add, I think you would have the option of an ad hoc committee, if you were going to rewrite the ordinance, like we just did, about two years ago. Of course, we would do outreach into the various animal community groups that are out there, humane societies and veterinarians and other people in the industry. JEFFREY S BROWER: OK. Is there a second on that, then? Second by Danny Robins. Any other discussions? The vote will be to, as you just heard, to have staff bring back the options of eliminating the board, and how do we get that information outside of a board? You're not voting to eliminate the board today, you are voting to have it come back and discuss it fully. All in favor, say aye, any opposed? That carries 7 to 0. That leaves several. Let's do the Volunteer Fire Fund. MICHAEL G DYER: if I can speak to that. That is one that you have recently restored because your staff is working on how to wind down that pension fund, and what our legal options are. Its existence, in our mind, was temporary, because it's focused purely on that wind down effort. That is not going to be a long-standing board. They have a special purpose at this point. JAKE JOHANSSON: Mr. Chairman, I will remove that. JEFFREY S BROWER: OK. I think it's on its way out. Mr. Ryan – you did it right. (laughs) when he stands up, it gets everyone's attention. That one is taken care of itself. The Business Incubator Advisory Board. Jake Johansson? JAKE JOHANSSON: Yes, sir. If you look on, if you care to, page 9 of the advisory boards, the information associated with it is very slim, and if you go to the minutes, they talk a lot about a lot of things that are happening, but they do not happen, in my opinion, because of the advisory board. They are just advisory board members reporting to other advisory board members on things that are going on. It looks like something that possibly Cyrus and his group can do with this group, outside of the advisory board. Again, making them more flexible, a little more responsive, and able to communicate outside of the advisory board. So if it is legally able to do so, I think they can all get together and do the same thing without being in the Sunshine, and having to wait until a meeting, for all these creative people to get together and discuss things. MICHAEL G DYER: I believe that board was created by virtue of the agreement we have in the University of Central Florida. I think that was the genesis of it. UCF also appoints two representatives on the board. If council wants us to bring back options, we can do that. JAKE JOHANSSON: I would like to clearly understand UCF's position on this, I don't want to stomp on them, they are a valuable asset to the county. I would like to retain a motion to bring back options for dissolving the business Incubator Advisory Board, not to interfere with current relationships we have with all of the stakeholders. SPEAKER: Second. JEFFREY S BROWER: The motion is to have the staff bring back options for dissolving the board without interfering with current relationships, we have with UCF, or anyone else. Is there anyone here from the Airport, or economic development? SPEAKER: Cyrus was here earlier, I think he had an appointment he had to go to that I will be certain to relay this discussion to him. JEFFREY S BROWER: If it comes back, the board approved this, we can discuss it further there. I am really hesitant on this, but I would like to have a discussion. I will vote for it to bring it back for the purpose of discussion, and I think that is what the motion is. All in favor say aye, any opposed? KARISSA GREEN: Mr Chair, can you clarify who was the second? JEFFREY S BROWER: You raised your hand? Matt Reinhart, Jake Johansson for the motion, Matt Reinhart as second. That leaves the Housing Finance, and I don't know who brought that up. I did not write the name down. MICHAEL G DYER: That is something you can consider but we would be absorbing their debts. JAKE JOHANSSON: That is me, cancel that one, too. JEFFREY S BROWER: We are done with item 2, as far as we can tell. It is 12:11 PM, does the council want to take a break now? Why don't we come back at 1 o'clock, that will give all of you time to walk somewhere, it's not raining, I don't think, to get something to eat. Matt Reinhart will probably not be back, and for good reason. Matt, you are in our thoughts and prayers for your daughter. I hope everything goes well. So, we are adjourned until 1:00 PM. (Break) (Video plays) (Music plays) SPEAKER: Welcome to the Volusia County Council Meeting. The meeting will begin in five minutes. (Video plays) (Music plays) SPEAKER: Welcome to the Volusia County Council Meeting. The meeting will begin in two minutes. (Video plays) (Music plays) JEFFREY S BROWER: OK, it is 1 o'clock, we will resume the meeting. Before we move on to item 3, if it pleases the Council, I think we can handle item 6, quickly. You want to come and talk to us about that? Item 6 is an amendment to a special exemption to a nonexempt excavation. SPEAKER: Good afternoon, thank you for entertaining us at this point. My name is Jay (Unknown Name), I am the attorney for (Unknown Name). I am sixth on the agenda. We would prefer to have a full commission to hear that item and since Commissioner Reinhart has had an emergency, we would like to have a continuance, I believe until April 2. JEFFREY S BROWER: OK. That is fine with staff? SPEAKER: Based on the request, if we could extended to April 2 meeting at 9:00 AM or after? SPEAKER: Movement to extend item 62 the April 2 meeting. JEFFREY S BROWER: Motioned by David Santiago and seconded by Danny and Jake. I will give it to Danny Robins. All in favor, say aye? Thank you. Now we will go back to item 3, resolution finding public purpose and approving issuance of housing finance Authority of Volusia County housing revenue bonds. SPEAKER: Yes sir, Russ Brown deputy county internal, item 3 is approval of two is solution -- resolutions. Financing for two projects, solely for the purpose of satisfying purposes of Internal Revenue Code. Your purpose today is funding a public purpose for the project to be financed by (Unknown Name). They do not -- bonds do not constitute a debt or liability to the county. If you have any questions... DAVID SANTIAGO: This is procedural, I moved to approve item 3. JEFFREY S BROWER: Motion to approve by David Santiago, second by Danny Robins. We have two members of the public that want to speak. Would you still like to speak on this, Tom Johnson and Glenn Reba (?) is Tom here? The says item 3. Item 5? On both those names? SPEAKER: (away from mic) JEFFREY S BROWER: OK. Alright. We've got it. It is OK. Any questions for staff? All... DON DEMPSEY: Cannot have something, let me get this straight. This is for a project for Lake County and Seminal County? SPEAKER: That is correct. DON DEMPSEY: And we are posting the bond for those projects out of county? SPEAKER: Sarah Metz here on behalf of the Housing Finance Authority of Volusia County. We received area of operation authority from those two counties who do not have Housing Finance Authority's to issue bonds for those areas. We also have the developer here, Scott (Unknown Name) to speak about those as well. Essentially, this is not a debt or an obligation of the county. This is going towards affordable housing in those areas, as well where they do not have housing finance Authority. The allocation of the bond financing comes from the state allocations and so, the short answer is, yes, these are out of county, given authority to Volusia to operate in those areas. DON DEMPSEY: It is just procedural. It sounds weird that we are doing it. It is how the program is set up, it allows us to have a say in how the sponsor done, right? SPEAKER: This is for the public purpose to say that there is a public purpose in having a a for the housing. We get the application, they say they are interested in allocating bond funding for these, if it is state -- available through the state allocation for this month. In this case there were and there was no other Volusia County in the pipeline. This does not come from Volusia County allocation. This would come from allocation and those other counties. The only thing that concerns for Volusia is that we do not have the Housing Authority whereas they do. DON DEMPSEY: Alright, I understand. JEFFREY S BROWER: OK, no other questions or discussion? All in favor of the resolution of finding public purpose and approving issuance of housing finance Authority of Volusia County housing revenue bonds, say, "aye". Any opposed? And the motion carries 6 to 0. Which takes us to item 4, adoption hearing ordinance amending the comprehensive plan affordable housing policies, Chapter 1. Clay? SPEAKER: Before for you is a comprehensive plan to outline the changes based on previous efforts to improve our overall policies and strategies for providing for affordable housing. Those members who were on the Council previously, this was a project that took approximately three years to go forward. In July 2022, we adopted the path forward strategies for success. Part of that was identifying what we would call 'critical changes'in the regulations and growth management policies we have two help beat incentives for affordable housing. Staff initiated changes to the company and supplants, specifically, future land use, housing and other elements. We went to the process, in other words, we drafted it, brought it to the Planning and Land Development Regulation Commission and the affordable housing advisory committee. Both of them recommended approval. It was transmitted to the Florida Department of commerce and to the Volusia Growth Management Commission. Both certified that is inconsistent. We brought it forward for adoption at December 5. There were concerns identified specifically for favoritism and potential negative impacts on private market operations with the specific policies tied to expedite and review. So, we went back, from a staff perspective and looked at the policies. We discussed the option of possibly going in and redoing all of them. That would cause us to restart the comprehensive planning process because again, we've already gone through it. This was the final step in getting these adopted. What we looked at is what could be altered so that that way we would address the majority of the concerns identified by the County Council. And we made some changes to policies. Rather than just doing away with it, we reverted back to the current policy that is in the adopted comprehensive plan. So there would be no modification, it is maintaining the same standards that we already had. But, there was concern in regards to the expedited review. Volusia County participates in the state housing initiative program. It provides funding for many of our programs. One of the things they you will see is that the affordable housing advisory committee and the County Council has approved strategy in that group that we would be utilizing expedited review process is one of our necessary elements for compliance with ship funding requirements. So, we need to maintain those policies in our comprehensive plan to ensure we are consistent with what is required for us to continue to receive the ship funding. We went over the policies. We also have in their, a table that identifies all of the changes that were originally proposed and what we identified as either reverting back or going forward with the recommended changes. We are bringing this forward to you, we hope that by adding these policies in we will be able to meet the requirements of the state by also implementing the previously approved housing initiative that was approved by County Council, and also addressing the concerns identified at the Council on December 5. Staff is here to answer any questions you may have. JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you, Clay. David Santiago. DAVID SANTIAGO: Moved to approve ordinance (Unknown Name). JEFFREY S BROWER: We have a motion to approve, second by Jake Johansson. Danny Robins? (indiscernible) DANNY ROBINS: Thank you, Chair. A couple questions, Clay. What were the development of reductions? SPEAKER: That was a recommendation that came out of the initial, large workshop we had for affordable housing...Waive up to 40% of dimensional standards that would be a clickable to these projects if they were designated for a set period of time and identified a specific population so that we knew we would be hitting our affordable housing goals. And if so, then, we would entertain the ability, like a setback, a building height, those types of things. So that that way there could be flexibility in the development standards that would help initiate that affordable housing. We were originally going with 40%. What you are seeing is 10% because we heard that there was concern about differentiation between affordable and market rate. So, we felt it was necessary to do this. 10% is consistent with what y'all has approved as far as administrator variances. DANNY ROBINS: Thank you, you mentioned you made some in-house policy changes. What policies did you change. SPEAKER: Not in-house. If there was a policy we could change without jeopardizing our ship funding we simply reverted back to the original language in the comprehensive plan. DANNY ROBINS: For the ship funds, we went over this in the staff meeting, where obviously, I think everybody's should get equal treatment for this. What are our options, do we have to have the expedited permitting? SPEAKER: Yes. One of the things in order to identify -- participate in that program, you have to have a mandatory set of programs in place to be eligible. One of them we have identified is the expedited review. This was identified through your staff through the affordable housing committee, agreed with it. They basically have made it as part of our process and it has been adopted formally by the County Council. DANNY ROBINS: And, I will try to wrap things up. Is there any other options that we can take or any other pots of money or any other grants that do not have that stipulation where we would have to show favoritism to a group or a class of people? I think we are past that in history. I find it odd that we are willing to do that for one group and not the other so I am trying to find another avenue. Is there other grants that wouldn't have that sort of requirement? SPEAKER: I will have to defer to our community assistant staff, Carmen Hall, who would be able to give you a better idea was to we, as a county, utilize multiple pots of money from both federal and state to try and get into provide for affordable housing. Ship provides one of those funding sources. The reason they are looking at expedited review is because any times it is involving private property that is trying to be utilized for affordable housing. And so, they are understanding that further delays to the permitting process would cause greater cost to the developer of the affordable housing. Again, it is an effort to reduce from a government perspective the cost that is just simply transferred onto the end-user. SPEAKER: We already receive those funds so it would be in addition to our current allocation for our policy. DANNY ROBINS: When it comes to this, we are expediting permits and we have permits in the queue… And we have a wave of equal standards. Just so my colleagues know my head is at, but thank you for answering everything. JEFFREY S BROWER: Dempsey? DON DEMPSEY: What would happen if we voted against this? SPEAKER: The existing policies remain in place. We would have to look at what we have. I know there is still an existing policy about expedited review… It is more up-to-date and consistent with recent language. But if you deny this, the existing planning would remain in place. We would just continue on with going forward and we would have to go back and work through the affordable housing advisory committee and pointing and building regulation to address some of these issues. We basically restart the process again. DON DEMPSEY: Page 7… It depends on how your numbering it, 14 or seven. On point 6.8. It says in there… You see it? Paragraph 15, page 7 otherwise known as page 4 of 14… SPEAKER: What is the policy number? DON DEMPSEY: 15, oh, sorry. What… Page 7 on the bottom center. I'm sorry, it is the table. It says to encourage infill, increase affordable housing stock using nonconforming lots for principal structures and accessory dwelling needs may be improved administratively by the planning and development services director. How does all that happen now? SPEAKER: We are deleting that. We're deleting that so all developers are treated equally. If you have a nonconforming lot, you cannot develop. DON DEMPSEY: But this would allow nonconforming lots to be developed? SPEAKER: Yes, sir. DON DEMPSEY: And this also encourages… The use of infill? For nonconforming lots, so we have a more dense population? SPEAKER: No, sir. It means you identify existing urban areas where you have vacant land and land underutilized. You try to put an encouragement so those are used ahead of anything going out into the Greenfield or basically leapfrogging out of the urban area. DON DEMPSEY: Otherwise, inherent says there would be density bonuses. Is this for higher density residencies? Get some sort of spiff? SPEAKER: We currently have density allocated in our comprehensive plan. It is based on the type of land use so therefore, it could allow for say duplex and single-family. He could allow for multifamily and some of the duplex or triplex areas. It is giving the opportunity for folks who are developing affordable housing to bring additional density. DON DEMPSEY: That's all I have, thank you. JEFFREY S BROWER: Johansson? JAKE JOHANSSON: I just want to verify that the policy to encourage infill, you are deleting it so it is no longer a factor? And… We had this conversation at our staff meeting the other day. I'm with Minister Robbins on this. I want everybody to be expedited… I… I want to put a developer hat on and develop a non-affordable housing area, and I want to develop an affordable housing area. I am the same guy doing the same stuff in different areas, and this one will be expedited and finished quicker than this one. But the rules that we are using to decrease the cost of affordable housing also apply to what might not be affordable housing, because it is over the cost of 120% of AMI. I want to encourage the county and staff to help keep the price of every house as low as we can get it by expediting our permitting process as best we can, and I understand that we have some challenges with our department and getting things out not in a timely manner but an expedited manner. So I would encourage to look at ways to make it the same across the board. When we talked a bit about options and for my colleagues, I get the sense, I may be wrong, I get the sense that we can consider ship to be something bad but I want you to consider that ship is a great program for people we work with every day. Police, firefighters, nurses and teachers. It is not… Do not stereotype who uses it for housing. I think it is very important and for all affordable housing. 120% AMI puts this into a lot of our friends and relatives, keep that in mind. SPEAKER: In response to the timeframe, please keep in mind there is pending legislation how fast we have to get out specifically single-family building permits. Some of those requirements if they are made real, the cost will go up because we will need multiple staff in order to be able to meet a three or five day timeframe to get a single-family building permit out so we will be expediting all permitting for single-family if what is in some of these different bills gets passed. As that goes forward, we will be able to report back to you as to what is going on from that perspective, because right now, it's something we are looking at very seriously because it has a severe impact on our staffing or contrasting work. Assistance and getting the permits out. We will be addressing that but… The policies you are seeing were developed over a three year period that culminated in July 2022 so if the Council does not agree with those, that is fine, we just need to know that because right now it is how your staff is proceeding. We are finding for the July 2022 decision in the pathways forward and strategies for affordable housing is what we are basing our day-to-day operations off of as it pertains to affordable housing. If that is not worthy Council wants to go we need to know that. JAKE JOHANSSON: This is an unfortunate example of a staff working hard to do what the Council told them, in that the Council is changing the direction of the wind a little bit and me jerking in another direction that is unfortunate and may be needed, maybe not. It is important for us to… To move slowly, in a little bite of the elephant at a time, can get us where we are needed to go if that is what we need. Thank you. DAVID SANTIAGO: For clarity purposes, irregardless, correct me if I'm wrong. Irregardless of pending legislation, in order to participate in the ship program for Volusia County residents by state law we have to have some type of expediting process, is that correct? SPEAKER: Again, the program expedites permits. DAVID SANTIAGO: So, to participate… I know we will like it but we will delimit those funds or turn them away. SPEAKER: Our Council has approved that as the policy, 2023 the Council approved the strategic housing policy. DAVID SANTIAGO: I want to make sure because we have to do that. Going back to number 15. On page 7. As Don brought up. You are proposing to eliminate that section. What is the effect of that? SPEAKER: Where we were trying to go, there is picking up some of these remnant parcels that are in… Within Volusia County around the (unknown name) area. Some of these areas near the beach, in say Springhill where we have vacant lots or some other properties falling into disrepair where they cannot be redeveloped because there is not a good lot in the area of the zoning. They can be reused… DAVID SANTIAGO: If we eliminated it would allow for any time. I want to make sure I am clear. SPEAKER: To encourage infill increase affordable housing stock. Santiago that is the purpose, OK. SPEAKER: If you want to make it open for everybody we could sit there but then… Why would we have the nonconforming standards? DAVID SANTIAGO: I get it, it is a noted tool. Mr Chairman, I think we are still in questions. I don't know if we want to put the to debate or not. JEFFREY S BROWER: OK, everybody has their questions answered? OK, go ahead David Santiago. DAVID SANTIAGO: I get the exception for this thing but we are kind of in a box here. I think. To eliminate any exceptions, to, not exceptions, sorry. The speed up process could jeopardize SHIP funds many of our residents participate in. It is derived from doc stamps people in our counties pay into the fund to be able to be utilized for these purposes. Our residents pay the tax for that purpose so I would hate to do anything to jeopardize that. The other part is, Jake I think you said the staff did what the Council had asked them to do? I do not see any policies being proposed as detrimental to the county so I think there comes a time where we have to stand by our staff and support the efforts they did. Nothing stands out to me as bad, that we should not do it and sometimes we have to step up absent something being really bad I do not see or hear anything that would be bad. So I would encourage to send a message doorstop that affordable housing is important and we used to have a gentleman who came here all the time, I forget his name. (Laughter) DAVID SANTIAGO: But he would often talk about the price of housing, especially for young people how they are priced out of the market and it has to do with policies that the state and local governments do that affect that on many levels, not just this, so we need to do what we can to make it reasonable. JEFFREY S BROWER: Before I call on anyone else, we have four members of the public want to speak. You want to hear them first before your debate? I will leave it up to you. OK, go ahead Danny Robbins. DANNY ROBINS: I agree with some of what you are saying there but I kind of want to share something for everybody. I will take… I will take a right on that. On one condition. We create the same policy to mere for everyday people to mirror the same standards as in line with the shift funds in turn of the 40% reduction in in terms of the expedited permitting and also whatever else goes in there and as we hire more people, guess what? The permit fees and that other stuff, if we get it cranking it is going to pay for itself. I like it, then it is reducing bureaucracy for everyone. I could accept that, Danny, I have no problem with accepting that, right? JEFFREY S BROWER: I would like to hear what Don has to say to mac (Laughter) DON DEMPSEY: There is a first! JEFFREY S BROWER: Don Dempsey. DON DEMPSEY: I get it, this is money we do not want to walk away from. I get that anytime we can take federal funds or state funds, we should grab it but I mean, Volusia County, I think, is in a unique situation. Last meeting we had to hear about poor Troy's interior of his car and what he has to endure one he drives into town, all the traffic problems. A lot of us campaigned on responsible growth. The last thing I want to do is incentivize more growth, faster, quicker, more people, more density, bonuses for density. I mean, the traffic in the (Unknown Name) area, DeLand, the traffic is really bad and I do not think the roundabouts are going to be the answer. If we are going to incentivize more growth, more density, more potential flooding, if that is your belief that that is what is causing a lot of our flooding issues is overdevelopment, well, this is exactly what we are doing is adding two more development. And so, I think we should just say, "Thanks, but no thanks." We have a lot of people already. Development's are going up everywhere. We have about 4000 houses permitted to be built that have not got their COs yet. There is a lot of growth going on just going on in this section of DeLand by Kettler and 44. The last thing I want to do is the infill development and nonconforming... Guys, I think enough is enough for a while. Let us let things play out and stop this mass development chase that I think we are heading towards. Thanks. JEFFREY S BROWER: OK, Clay? CLAY ERVIN: I need to clarify. This is coming from the document that the Council has approved and is part of our strategy for affordable housing that has been submitted to the state. Strategy A, the processing of approvals and development orders for permits for affordable housing projects are expedited to a greater degree than other projects as provided for in statutes 163 through 177. So, we have already adopted and have in place, as of December 5, 2023, a policy that will prevent that motion, part of that motion. JEFFREY S BROWER: OK. Yes, before I ask the question, Suzanne? SPEAKER: Two things, the Council may recall, because we have had a number of speakers come in and ask you to allocate resources to affordable housing, the part of our strategy is to take advantage of those monies that come to us from the state and federal designated (indiscernible) as opposed to our general fund dollars here in the county. So we are careful to not use our local taxpayer dollars and take advantage of those do to us through SHIP, the Sadowski fund etc. much of which does not go to new development but to homebuyer assistance and other programs that help our firefighters and workers achieve their housing needs. So, I just wanted to put the SHIP funding in some context. The other context that I feel compelled to make sure we understand is most of the development occurring for affordable housing and just housing in general in the county, is happening in our cities, in our urban areas where I think, we might agree that is the appropriate area for it to occur. I think I asked Clay earlier this week how many affordable housing projects have we offered the expedited permitting to in his out years time in his role of Volusia County? It has been the equivalent of one project. I know it is getting a lot of discussion from a philosophical level but the number of projects seeking that, well, are practically nonexistent. We do have some Habitat for Humanity homes and some Homes Bring Hope, that have come forward and not asked for expedited permitting, and will be entitled to it because they are really at the single-family building permit level. I hope that helps put some perspective to the discussion. I wanted to make sure he mentioned it. JEFFREY S BROWER: I'm glad you did. I have a question for you, she just dealt with it. I think David might have a question for you but I was just going to say, Don, your argument is really tempting. If I thought that it was true, I would join you but there is not a rush of developers trying to build affordable housing. Infill is using lots that are available in the urban areas where there is already infrastructure, so we are using infrastructure already in place instead of having to new -- run new infrastructure. But like deputy County Manager just said, this is a trickle of people. These are reasonable incentives, I think, for people to fill -- build affordable housing in places that we have available. Clay? CLAY ERVIN: Clarification, staff had recommended reduction of that 40% to 10%. Whatever the final decision is going to be, just to clarify that in the motion so we know whether or not it is 10% or 40% and if it is applicable to everybody or just to affordable housing. As I said, we currently have an administrative variance that this Council approved for all projects that can utilize up to 10% of setbacks they are applying for. So that is already on the books there but what we are looking at is reducing it to 10% for affordable housing as well. JEFFREY S BROWER: OK, David Santiago? DAVID SANTIAGO: So, Clay, going back to Danny's request, where he wanted it more standardize for everyone, as he suggested, we could amend 10% for everyone. I know the shot clock, I will use that, we may have a challenge on that based on our submittal to the state, and my understanding that correct? CLAY ERVIN: Right now we are facing issues in regards to getting single-family permits out in a timely manner, all permits out in a timely manner. We believe that one form of the bill or not will make it through. We have to look at what we are going to be doing in regards, first of all, I would say, hire contract staff to try to catch up. And hire permanent staff... DAVID SANTIAGO: Let me clarify my question. Danny suggested amending the student apply to everyone on the standards. DANNY ROBINS: I was saying I can go for it, I want everybody to be equal. CLAY ERVIN: It will equalize everyone on the shot clock. Pardon me, the last time I heard it was three days to intake review and issue RAI for additional information or a permanent... DAVID SANTIAGO: If we were to amended that way and the legislature passes the bill, is it safe to assume that we are not in any jeopardy for the SHIP program funds? CLAY ERVIN: I do not know. As the strategy says, is that for a single family, in and out? (Multiple speakers) DAVID SANTIAGO: Thank you, Clay, for that clarification. Donna, I wanted to respond. When it comes to the SHIP funds, the Sadowski fund, it is not necessarily some Tallahassee money. You could call it that because they are the ones who collected, right? Our people here in our county pay into that and when they pay it, and they are at closing, they are told, they should be told that this is a tax that you are being assessed for this particular purpose which your county benefits from. I worry jeopardizing that and sending a message to Volusians, that they are going to pay this tax but no one... Generally speaking I am with you. But this is money that people pay for a purpose. SPEAKER: The total is over $100 million a year. What is the total? JENNY SICHEL: I do not know. Maybe she can answer it. SPEAKER: So, our current 2023, 2024 allocation is about 4.5 million. We are anticipated to receive over 3 million in Volusia County next year. DAVID SANTIAGO: Thank you for clarifying, too, because the majority of those are for existing homes. The problem I think that you are mentioning is the bigger developments, right? How that sprawl is happening. But on the infill side, at least for the county, have not seen many of those come through in the county as we have been here. I do not see that as a major issue. In my last point, Mr Chairman, Danny, I want to see how we can get there. I like what you said about applying all of the other standards to everyone. I think that jives with the mindset of this counsel. Can we get there absent, that shot clock, this is a question for Clay, can we adopt Danny suggestion absent the shot clock change, and then adopt a change later on, Danny? Amend that in later on? Applying that to everyone after the legislature acts? CLAY ERVIN: We have an April 30 workshop where our staff will be coming and talking to you about permitting, zoning and the whole kit and caboodle then. By then, state law will have shook out. By then we can speak to more intelligently about what options we can offer and cannot offer. The simple fact is this, there is no limitation on the number of amendments we need to do anymore so therefore, after April 30, if you would like us to go back and review our comprehensive plans and make amendments to those to equalize the process, we can do that. The reason I am bringing this up is we are facing a deadline on this because remember, we were at adoption back in December 5 because of what is going on. We have until March 31 to complete and basically get it to Tallahassee. Otherwise, it will be considered withdrawn. DAVID SANTIAGO: So my last question, if I understand you correct, if we were to adopt this today with almost all of Danny's applications, applicable to everyone, to accept the shot clock, what I'm calling the shot clock, you are saying that in April, when we get your update and get the legislative update what the law change.... At that time, if we so choose, we can set a (indiscernible) amendment to modify? CLAY ERVIN: I think you said what I said. DAVID SANTIAGO: So we can move forward and mee (Multiple speakers) JEFFREY S BROWER: to clarify, your motion was to accept this according to staff recommend visions. DAVID SANTIAGO: And I think Danny was suggesting an amendment that was not gone through yet. JEFFREY S BROWER: We will need to deal with the amendment before we vote on the main motion. So Jake Johansson? JAKE JOHANSSON: To verify, item 4 is just affordable housing policy now, right? CLAY ERVIN: Yes. JAKE JOHANSSON: If I'm clear, we are asking you to make affordable housing policies kind of everybody's policies, right? Yes? Which is separate. So, let us remain on task. If we like with the affordable housing policies are so much that we want to include everybody, let us approve the affordable housing policies today, and we will talk at the workshop. That might just be a staff policy and it does not have to be a full amendment. I do not know, but I think that is a great idea. I am all for it. But let us get through this and work through it. And if we are kind of in debate, I heard something I want to ensure as an elected official, that I am clear. That our general thought here is that we are going to manage development, not stop it. And if we are managing development, the best place to manage it is not to continue the sprawl, but to use infill. And I heard, "I do not want infill." I think it is the best idea, part of clustering, part of using infrastructure that already exists. "By the way, it is not in the city, it is in the county by and large." Something we have limiting control over. Lastly, I want to point out that time and time again, counties and cities are unilaterally agreeing on things that may make sense to them, but our state officials take a look at it and go, "Oh, hell no." And they preempt us. Every decision we make you regarding growth and Volusia County of which are state currently enjoys the development, enjoys the people coming here, we have to deal with. We need to deal with it responsibly. So, if we are all appear trying to maintain Volusia County at its current state without development, we are going to get preempted. We already have with the Live Local Act, and other affordable housing things. So, let us take control of this and do it right, and the way we want to do it and not the way the state wants to do it by shove it down our throats as they have with other issues that have preempted us. Thank you. DANNY ROBINS: It is hard not to be philosophical, Don. I hear what you are saying, but something you have to remember to is you mentioned Kepler Road in Deland. It was not by mistake, that was planned for that area and every plan imaginable under God between the land in Volusia County, Clay and his team did a good workshop or presentation, I want to say you are half ago, maybe two years ago, we talked about the triple of development in Volusia it is absolutely true. There are several pictures painted out there that are not true. But his presentation hit the nail on the head when it came to our growth in the county at one point, 90%. 6000 people per year countywide, 99% of department is happening in the cities and also probably the most since I've set up here, the Chairman and I, maybe five developments or less projects? Several were already preapproved have happened. I get what you're saying but I don't want to give a good partner a black eye for something that was in their vision and is still in their vision but I just don't want us to slug them and beat them down as if they are doing something wrong or even when our opinions are there. At the end of the day, it is hard not to, in my opinion, put strings attached to this vote. Where I do agree with you, Don, want a sure thing into depend on the state like Jake said, to take the bull by the horns and make a decision we can make even though it is a separate item but my vote is contingent on that. I want to support and vote up on this but I need a quality to get me across the line for my people and the people I represent. I don't think it is fair, at this point, and I do not know now. I did not know now what I do in the past and that is on me. I want to get us there. I really do. But I wanted not to be conditional on the state, I think we need to strike the iron while it is hot and that is how you get my vote. Thank you JEFFREY S BROWER: Don Dempsey. DON DEMPSEY: All this flooding, I believe it is real. I rode your bikes through there in the subdivisions in those areas and I can see it now. I don't know what the cause is. I don't know if it is nature or urban development. I don't know. I'm not here to take sides, but I know there is an issue and JC was here earlier talking about his property, and I believe everything he says is sincere. You know, affordable housing, I guess, is a relative term because… I'm heavily involved in the real estate market and I am active in the real estate market for 20 years and, I mean, I have seen condos in the same location range from 30,000 a condo up to 180,000 to 110 and back down to 30, and now they're back down to 140. I don't like when one government sees a problem, or perceives a problem, it feels like it has to get involved. To quote Reagan again he says, "government does not solve problems that subsidizes them." If we would let laissez-faire do its thing, let capitalism to its thing, supply and demand do its thing, and just let it all play out. But if we start picking and choosing winners and losers and who gets extra here and from this pot of money or this part… The government needs to stay out of this stuff and just let the market do its thing. We do not have 4000 houses on the cue about to be put in the same area where we just had a chamber full of people complaining about traffic and flooding. Even if you don't believe in the flooding, the traffic is a real problem. That's why voted against it. Because I see the traffic. Troy sees the traffic traveling into these meetings. It's a real issue and if we incentivize more development… And pat ourselves on the back because it is affordable housing, and feel good about ourselves because we are helping the less fortunate, I get it, but we are still increasing density and adding to the problem. We need to just let the market play itself out and quit letting government pretend we are the cure-all for all of the issues. I'm a hard no. Whenever we have an opportunity stay out of people's lives in a free economy, we need to. DAVID SANTIAGO: Nice move trying to use Reagan again, huh? I used to earlier. You almost got me for a second. The reason I say 'almost' is because… our arguments, given the fact that government, in general, has not overreached in policy making and rules and procedures. All use the development topic. We have all of these rules placed out there from us and other agencies that raise the price of development. That's part of the… The cost drivers. You know, we have had subdivision projects coming for us and they say, "we need to do this and this and that". Well, they just did and they added $20,000, $15,000 to the cost of the lot. Not everyone can afford it, and those are drivers, not free-market drivers. Those are responses to government requirements. That is why the way this is written, and I'm OK with reducing, like you said, those for everyone. It's the entry barriers or obstacles that raise the cost of homes… This, by itself, gives some relief. It's not necessarily a free-market thing. Now, if we do what Danny says in the next wave after our April meeting, then yes, we are doing it for everybody. I'm OK with that, but this particular policy before us, I do not think is necessarily getting in the way from that perspective. I lost my original train of thought. You threw me off with Reagan. I was going to go there. (Laughs). So, I'm lost for words. I forgot my original thoughts. DANNY ROBINS: Thank you, Chair. I can relate to a lot of what you are saying. I want equality, but if you want to stop the subsidies, we need the inventory. This is the most basic form of supply and demand my opinion that drives the market. We don't want to subsidize but don't want to build either so how do we expect things to become affordable? You have stuff in the market, they are not building things for their health, OK? People are moving here. I don't like it. That's why I live where I live. My own slice of heaven. I think we have to be realistic and be productive and I'm willing to go for it. (Multiple speakers) DAVID SANTIAGO: I remember what I was going to say, Danny's last comment. I support your effort. I think we need to do it in a separate phase after this. You have my commitment. I'm only one of seven, but you have my commitment. I think Jake alluded to dealing with it later on, so I think we put this to move forward and meet the deadline we are required, and then we open it up. I'm open to it. I won't let you down. JEFFREY S BROWER: OK, let's hear from the public before we deal with the motion and any potential amendment because we have an interesting group… I am looking forward to hearing their various opinions. We will start with Melissa and then Jessica will be next. SPEAKER: Good afternoon, Melissa, from District 4. Have you ever had to decide between buying groceries or meeting your rent? I have. I am sure my friends are shocked by that. They know me, assembly buttoned up, when it comes to planning and budgeting, and they are right. But in spite of being careful with my money and making good decisions, I have faced that difficulty simply because money I was owed didn't arrive in time. It had a cascading effect on my finances and I could not buy food. The situation did not last for long and it was back when I was working my way through UF but I recall very well, as a human, how it felt to have done everything right and by the book yet still find myself needing to make that tough choice. That is the reality facing many working people, retirees, and students in our community today. A former backlot, in large metropolitan areas, for people had to pay upwards of 50% of their incomes for housing whether renting or buying. I never thought I would see it here. But we have become known as one of the last affordable places for folks to retire or by a second home near a beach. Market forces have driven up real estate, pricing local workers out. In Florida, housing is considered affordable if it cost no more than 30% of a household's gross annual income. How many in our community have to pay out more than that to have a roof over their heads? What must they do without? When I was chief marketing officer of United Way of Miami-Dade I learned about a wonderful tool to understand the economic reality of people in a specific community. The Alice Report. Using local data, it shows how much money is needed for families, retirees and singles to get by, even precariously, like with my example, and how much it takes to achieve financial stability. People in Alice earn more than poverty wages, but not enough to consistently meet their financial needs. In Volusia County, they are about 28% of households and that is in addition to the 14% officially and poverty, this is largely driven by housing, the cost of having a roof over your head for you and your family. Any Volusia family whose combined wages are less than (indiscernible) will fall under that area. I share all kind of statistic with you but I'm talking about human lives, so I urge you to bring a balanced approach to the housing by adopting the revisions proposed by the land development review affinity group that were originally presented to the Council in August 2023, thank you. JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you. And, (unknown name) if you want to come sit in the front row? Then you will be next. SPEAKER: Good afternoon, Port Orange Florida. I will start with what is called the boot's theory of social economic unfairness. It's a political theory that says a man who can afford $50 had a pair of boots that would keep his feet dry for 10 years. The poor man who could only afford cheap boots would spend $100 on boots and still have wet feet. This is not a situation where people cannot pull themselves up by their bootstraps, their bootstraps would break. That is $3000 a month for rent at 30%, $3000 a month at the 30% allowance for housing is $900 a month for housing costs. Who has $900 rent? The median sale price in Volusia County is $3667 (?) assuming a down payment that is $2166 a month that does not include insurance, utilities or other necessary items. They have $834 a month for $200 a week to provide food, transportation, insurance, gas, and medical expenses. According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics the average spending on food at home is (indiscernible) a month and utilities is 300 a month. You can see there is not a lot left at the end, we understand why so many households in our community are cost burden. Affordable housing is identified as a community service and type of infrastructure in many jurisdictions, acknowledging the housing deed must be treated separately from typical housing frock. While costs continue to rise the wages not increase with these. (indiscernible) percent do not earn enough to meet their needs according to the else report. That is 92,781 children whose parents are contributing to our community but are still strained. It is our veterans of whom 82% are cost burden. The original proposal brought before you is the combination of years of planning among public, private, and NGO sector to bring affordable housing to our community. Will our counsel fully adopt the proposals from the land affinity review group which will originally presented to this council in August and December 2023? SPEAKER: Nico Husseini, and DeLand. There with me, I am frustrated right now. I am a development attorney but this has nothing to do with development. I am a daughter of immigrants who came here for a better life. Like a lot of people, to live in our community, they were raised in our community, they want to come back and live here and help work for the community, and do better. Our nurses, doctors, firefighters, policeman, all kinds of individuals that were raised here and want to live this community. How do we do that? The nurse that helps you the hospital, where is he or she supposed to live when their first getting started? To say this is about development or that the market will simply handle it itself is pretty appalling, in my opinion. We are supposed to be a community of individuals that help each other. I am not saying give a hand out. That is not what I'm saying. I'm saying help each other. This is about in Phil development. Mr Chairman, you said it perfectly. This is about taking certain lots in certain areas, like Mr Ervin said, certain plots that are nonconforming or do not meet standards, and using that for housing stock, that we do not have any of. You heard what Clay said, one project in eight years in the county. We are supposed to be prioritizing affordable development and affordable housing. We are not. We are not. You are hearing develop and attorneys talk about this. This is close and near and dear to our hearts. Look, we are on the other side of various topics, there are some things we do not agree on. But this is for the betterment of our community. This is for infill housing, almost always, and to get those individuals that we all claim we want in our community, the people that make lives better here and make it a joy to live here, come back so that they can live here. So they are not going somewhere else. Another city or county where they have adopted these comprehensive plan policies to make it easier for nonprofits to partner together and to have these houses built. So respectfully, I request that you take the hard work of the affinity groups, of your staff, of Mr one of one, Clay Ervin, who is one of the absolutely best individuals we've had the pleasure of having it working with. Take what they have -- are saying, what they have worked on, what you have told them to do. It is a big deal. This will make a big difference. This is not about development, this is about human lives and making our community better. Please take the original proposal and accept that. Thank you for your time. JEFFREY S BROWER: Farouq Husseini. Are there any more Husseini's at the back? (Laughter) SPEAKER: One at a time. Good afternoon, Farouq Husseini, Ormond Beach, think you so much for allowing me to speak. I appreciate everyone's time. Part of RCI homes and working for over 40 years to make our community better. Some of you know that I started because they were hungry kids. When Nina and Nico were in fourth grade, that is how I learned we have homeless children our community. Never knew. Expanded as needed. Then we are in schools and see what happens. Then later on, we realized, I realized that the only way I can help stabilize certain families is making sure they have a house to live in. That they not stressed that they have to move day today, house to house, because the rents go up. So, I completely agree with what Nico and Jessica said. Both of whom, by the way work for (Unknown Name) for free. I really appreciate the fact that you have put this on your agenda. It is very, very important for community. You know it is a priority for the legislature. You know it is (Unknown Name)'s priority of affordable housing. This is for infill housing. At my work I take lots that are sitting there forever. The City of Daytona Beach has given me 15 lots for free, so far, waving permit fees so that I can go and be at home -- build homes, not through icier homes, although I do abuser staff so they can get plans a cause for free. Many people. Like I abuse the student here. Many, many, many people donate their time. Many businesses, the only way that we can address big, complicated, community issues is government working with nonprofit with the help of business. And I'm doing my best and I know the businesses are doing their best because (indiscernible) does everything for us for free. Because we get paid for free so we can build affordable homes and our family foundation pays for all of the overhead. You know how much we sell the houses that (Unknown Name) sells for? Whatever the person can afford. Whatever the teacher, the nurse, these are not people coming from other states that you are giving a house to. These are employees of Halifax South, (Unknown Name), Daytona State College, (Unknown Name), we have 10 partners. It is surprising to me that you take fault with us who are trying to help the people who take care of us, the nurses that Mr Reinhart, you do not want your nurse to sleep in the car before they come and take care of your children. Thank you very much. JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you. Lori? Lori (Unknown Name) SPEAKER: Thank you, chairman. Thank you, counsel, stat. My name is Lori (Unknown Name), the CEO of (Unknown Name), the job I have held for 23 years. Every day I work with people who, as you have been described by the speakers who came before me, are challenged. These are people who are working, some are working two jobs to try to make ends meet. But as I'm sure you are all keenly aware, the wages in our county have not equaled the rise in housing costs. Yes, it is very true that most people that we encountered have debt who are working people in this community, holding jobs as patient tax, phlebotomists in the hospitals, CNEs in nursing homes. They work certainly in tourism and they work in trucking, manufacturing. They work essential jobs in this community. And they are struggling to make things work for themselves and for their children. So, you have heard from Mrs Husseini, I also represent a nonprofit. The cost of building houses, as you brought up, councilman, a lot of it comes from the regulations that we have to pay for, and things that are required. But speaking for my nonprofit, we are dedicated to our mission, so we are going to figure it out. The need for affordable housing grows everyday here in Volusia County. I want to just take a moment to address the fairness question. The market cannot fix this. The people who are building moderate homes, luxury homes, there is a profit margin and that. There is a very, very small opportunity for any profit in affordable housing. We are going to do what we do because that is who we are, but we all need help. You need as many people building affordable housing in this community as you can encourage. So they need those incentives. So when you talk about, and I can appreciate you wanting to talk about fairness, but the situation is unfair to start with. It is your opportunity, because of the work from a lot of people in this community over a long number of years, and a very dedicated staff that you have, that you have before you the revisions that were proposed by the land development review affinity group, which were originally presented to this council in August 2023. Is really what I would ask you to support. That balances that. It is never going to make it equal. The for-profit builders are always going to be OK with that but it just tries to level it little bit. (Bell rings) SPEAKER: So, it is a question of fairness in dealing with the situation that is inherently unfair. Thank you. JEFFREY S BROWER: Mark Watts, you are the last speaker unless Nico would like to go? (Laughter) SPEAKER: Members of the Council, I appreciate the opportunity to speak. Mark Watts with (Unknown Name) four blocks away. Excuse me... Some of the comments of me, made me want to get up and share some stories over the past 15 years of my career dealing with affordable housing because I appreciate the direction to reduce red tape, to streamline things. When it comes to the general develop and process we have ongoing meetings, some new meetings on the agenda, to get together and talk about this very thing. About how we clear the red tape for all projects so that everybody can get through the process quicker. But, with regard to the item before you now, I would encourage you to follow Councilman Johansson suggestion that adopt what is in front of you. Adopt what the affinity groups came up with. Because three years ago, I sat on the stage, in the opening session of our affordable housing discussion and my, to everybody in attendance that day was affordable housing needs the thumb on the scale. Every available tool in order to meet the demand that exists now. That is just continuing to grow. Government is in the marketplace. Government joined the market place in 1926 when the Supreme Court decided Euclid versus Amber, zoning land of element relations, all those things were legitimized. Private property was no longer something that laissez-faire government. Government is in the marketplace. When you're talking about private development versus affordable development they are very different things. A few minutes ago you approved a bond issue for affordable housing projects. That financing that comes through those bonds requires that the developer of that property owner for the next 30 years and keep it as affordable housing. Most projects that are financed and the come to the regular developing process, do not have that same restriction in place. If you come in here as a private land tone -- owner and build a home, you will not have a term that says you cannot sell it for 30 years. They are different. The marketplace is different when it comes to for the housing. And we, as a community, should've stopped every available tail to continue help encourage affordable housing to be developed. Melissa Lammers commented a few minutes ago (indiscernible) how many have been in that situation? Were you have gone out to seek a program to be able to put food on the table? We have an obligation to serve those members of our community that need that help. And so, I think, this is a good step in the right direction. It is not the final step and it is not one we cannot come back and revisit but I encourage you, adopt the policies that have been proposed. We spent three hours this morning talking about advisory groups. You have, in front of you, the product of three years of work. Adopt it, please. (Bell rings) JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you. Jake Johansson? JAKE JOHANSSON: One of the members of the public...so there is no money to be made in public housing. When somebody approaches us… What are the benefits they get from building under the live local act? SPEAKER: They could get tax abatement for… Depending on how they mix affordable housing they could get up to 100% of a reduction. JAKE JOHANSSON: 100%? SPEAKER: Up to. JAKE JOHANSSON: So people can make money? SPEAKER: Yes, (indiscernible) JAKE JOHANSSON: So even though some don't, some do. That's all I had for questions. I will go to debate if we need to get through. DAVID SANTIAGO: I think we've been in debate, we need to vote. JEFFREY S BROWER: The motion on the floor was to accept the work the staff had done. Is there still… An amendment? DANNY ROBINS: No amendment at this time, I like it and will look for what we are talking about here. We keep calling it affordable housing, it's workforce housing. It's where some of our own employees live. This is much better than going to ICI homes and telling them, you are required when you build 300 homes to build 30 somebody could… $30,000 a year employee. This is a better way to do it. I appreciate the hard work all be put into the committee, you are right. They worked for three years now to come up with this. So the motion on the floors to accept… Adopt ordinance number 23 – 23. SPEAKER: Mr Robbins? DANNY ROBINS: Yes. DAVID SANTIAGO: Yes. DON DEMPSEY: No. JAKE JOHANSSON: Yes. TROY KENT: Yes. JEFFREY S BROWER: Yes. The ordinance is adopted. 5 - 1. Thank you all for coming in. That takes us to… We get to skip number five, thank God. Oh, we are skipping number six… Can we skip five? Appeal denial variant case… SPEAKER: Good afternoon, this is an appeal or a property owner made an application for an ordinance to setback requirements for a swimming pool considered an accessory structure there are specific standards for that. The property as you may be aware was subject to earlier variances due to the size. They canceled it here a prior appeal for the single-family unit itself. The appeal was not upheld. It was denied and so it was able to go forward and build the previous variance. This went forward to appeal with recommendation of denial from staff and it is coming to you with a recommendation of denial from the PL DRC. Again, this is an area where we are dealing with an accessory structure, a swimming pool and pool deck associated area applicable to a corner lot. It is considered to fronts. Therefore we need to meet the 20 foot setback. It is coming to you from there. This is an appeal of the record as it was presented at the PLD RC so the determination here is whether or not the PLD RC heard in their interpretation of the evidence and presented it at the meeting and if they did to… Uphold the appeal. And allow for the variance to occur. Or deny it in they have to meet the requirements as they would be applied to the accessory structure. Anything I missed? SPEAKER: (away from mic) as Clay stated, the appeal is limited to the evidence presented. No new evidence may be presented at the topic. There are some pieces of evidence, which is for the applicant submitted after the PL DRC. You have to disregard that. There are letters of support in the record. Your decision based on the record before it is you can reverse the decision, confirm the decision, you could modify any order. After the public speaks if there are any corrections we can address things you can disregard because it is considered new evidence. JEFFREY S BROWER: Is this a quasi-judicial hearing? SPEAKER: It is, so if you have any prior communication you need to disclose that. OK, Danny Robbins. DANNY ROBINS: Thank you. If I could, I know the beach is an interesting layout in place and these corner lots from the get-go are a white elephant. Any lot really is rare. I have tried to handle this and look at it since we started but I did not see anything in the report… I want to try to get everybody to a yes in these tough decisions. Was there anywhere noted, what hardships this would create? Comments from neighbors? What was the reason for the couple people that may be posted? SPEAKER: The testimony I think I said it was a concern with overdevelopment of the site. The adjacent property owners were not supportive original variance in the first place, they felt this would be compounding overdevelopment on the site. That is the best summary I can provide to you. DANNY ROBINS: OK. Was there anything that would backup to support those allegations? Or opinions? Anything we can use? SPEAKER: Just the testimony of residents adjacent to it. Everything that was provided to staff and everything relevant to the regulation communication has been included in your agenda packet. So that is how the peel the RC organized at the meeting. DANNY ROBINS: Is there any structure or home with a pool like that… A lot of the lots are small. They take up a big footprint. Are there any others or we could say this is just like Joe Smith a block away? Anything like that we can use? SPEAKER: While the beach in this area… There are a considerable number of lots that are 50' x 100' so there have been variances for pools and accessory structures. This is unique in that it has a B 8 which is a commercial zoning and does allow a residential permitted use and it is at a 45 feet, typically your corner lot if this was developed under newer standards would have increased widths. Again, we require them to be 15% more than the standard width of an interior lot to accommodate additional setback on the corner side. Something as we can see, unfortunately I cannot increase the size but there is some give a similar nature at that corner. DANNY ROBINS: I don't have a problem with it, especially seeing it's not just wanting something because you are not wanting it, I don't know if that holds a lot of weight. I will make a motion to grant and approve the variance. DAVID SANTIAGO: Second. JEFFREY S BROWER: Robbins makes a motion to approve, seconded by Santiago. This is a public hearing and anybody who wants to speak, if you have already turned one and you are fine. If you have not turned one in. Mark, do you want to speak first? You have five minutes. MARK WATTS: I was scared when you already had a motion but I appreciate the time. Again, Mark Watts from (indiscernible). Also Jessica Gale who worked at the plant on on the initial application as well. I have a few things I want to walk through, I think this is a distinct situation and it is also one where I believe there was an error in the decision that I will walk through. So as Paolo and Clay explained to you we are here on appeal, it's not how we normally appear to you. We're looking back at the record created that brought us here. The request here is for a variance to the front yard for a structure to be constructed in what is the rear yard. We will walk through that picture. The additional variances for a reduction of the front yard setback by 10 feet and to allow an accessory structure and what is defined by the code as a front yard on the corner lot. It is consistent on what was authorized under the variance in 2021. We think there are a few ways in which the PLDRC's decision varied from the criteria they are supposed to follow. In particular if you go back and look at the discussion and items they focused and on for voting to deny the variance application, they were focused on the height of the structure and its proximity to the western boundary. Neither of which were subject of the variance application in front of them and both of which comply with the standards in the B 8 zoning classification. This is the survey and your staff materials. It was presented to BPL DRC. You can see here basically if you look on the top of the screen there is a north, that is where Kingfisher Avenue comes along and creates a double front edge lot with South lactic on that side. As a result here is what the classification does to this property. It creates a front yard on multiple sides and then to side yards, it does not actually have a rear yard. The prior variance because it related to the house constructed at that point in time approve the modification you see there, the modification to push the front setback to the 10 foot line. The variance requested is for that area. It is for the area the pool would need to occupy in order to basically stay flush with what you would typically have with the pool behind your house and what you would other define as your backyard. So looking at, what does it mean with regard to what is on the street? Here is a house under construction there now and you see the shaded area to the right. This is the picture in your staff report and all it does is overlay the variance granted before, everything you see shaded blue previously would have been the front yard that existed off of Kingfish. With regards to height, that was the focus of the discussion and PLDRC. That is where the first came into being, there were several comments made in the deliberations about the height of the structure being the thing that had they known it would be built that high maybe they would not of greater the variance in 2021 and it has helped him supporting the 90 variance requested most recently. But it complies with the zoning. It is the same height allowed for every other property. If you look behind there, the structure is the same type of structure as the condominiums behind it. You have a first level that is not occupied will because of storm surge requirements. You keep the first level with non-living space. You have two residential living space floors above that. Here you have a rooftop, deck area. It complies with the standards. This was the other thing that the PLDRC focused on. Proximity to the condominiums located to the west. If you go back there is the orange line there. Right now you have got essentially what was treated as a rear yard, 20 feet. Accessory structures can go within 5 feet. Side yard setback is also 5 feet. We are asking to comply the law and regulations there. We just need to deal with the fact that because of the nature of this parcel, if memory serves in 2020 when you were talking about this I think this was one of very few corner lots you had within the county. So interestingly as Clay showed the plots, each one of this has the right to an accessory structure within 5 feet of the lot. Is a condition that if you approve this variance, all three lots will be treated exactly the same. So, the improper basis we think PPL DRC relied on. Number one, complaints and concerns about the height of the structure, complaints about the western boundary line, neither of which were part of the request for variance in both of which were seeking to comply with. Opinions expressed about the potential for construction, if only you had bought different property you would not have to come in here and ask for a variance for what you are building here. The fact of the matter is variances exist to allow a specific piece of property to be developed in conformance with what would otherwise be the expectation. This is the only parcel our client owns, they don't own the others and have the ability to come in and build something different on those. We think on those bases, the PLDRC erred by focusing on the wrong issues, focusing on issues not in front of them with regard to the application. Now interestingly, as I mentioned we comply with the other standards for the V 8 and height becomes one of the distinctions. The maximum height is actually 115 feet. We are staying at it was 35, the residential standard but this allows so many more intense things. You can do nightclubs and bars and fire stations on the property, single-family is one of the least intense things you can do. All the application is seeking to do is allow it to be developed in a manner consistent with adjacent parcels. I want to introduce Joanna, she had a few things she wanted to add to introduce herself and make a couple of comments and then go over time for questioning and if I could reserve a few minutes to come back up and respond to any comments. SPEAKER: Hi, thank you for having me today. I am the homeowner of this cystic 600 S. (Unknown Name) I am a nurse at New Smyrna Beach in the downtown area. I am excited to be joining the Bethune community. I wanted to thank you for how hearing the proposal today I am only looking to build a small, single family home pool. It will match the extending width of my home, and will not expand beyond those boundaries. I have worked with Anderson Dixon engineering as well as (Unknown Name) construction to prepare for an oceanfront built. This is been a big project for my entire team. We've been careful to follow all county zoning rules. We have also gotten DEP approval before starting the project. As a part of this variance appeal process I have been up introducing myself to some of my neighbors. I have gotten several voices of support from neighbors in the immediate Bethune area as well as New Smyrna and other areas of Volusia County, so I appreciate getting to know my neighbors. I do want to say that I am a normal, responsible, single-family home owner. I in no way intend to have a pool that is disrespectful to my neighbors in terms of noise concerns or anything like that. I do see in my immediate area, the condominiums to my West, they have a community pool that they use as a private pool for their building. There were other single-family homes that have pools in my area. Without the experience I do not think it would be possible to put a pool in that small the structure in the back so I really appreciate your consideration. Thank you for hearing me today. JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you. SPEAKER: I will stay here for any other questions. JEFFREY S BROWER: Why don't we hear from the public. Becky Carpenter? Who are you? You are Glenn. Come on up, Glenn. Glenn Reba, Reha, OK. SPEAKER: First of all, I will apologize because I was not prepared to talk today. It was other people's jobs. I live at 6612 S. Atlantic, which are the condos adjacent to this piece of property. We have been watching this project go up. And it is amazing how they jammed this house into a 41 foot wide lot and 100 feet. There is absolutely no room left, whatsoever. To my understanding, as I heard earlier, an appeal must be based on the records and not new evidence that shall be introduced. If I am reading the notes that were sent me earlier. Outside of the PLDRC, their own staff, on a five-point basis during this variance (indiscernible), I will just carry this a bit further. The PLDRC actually turned it down 6-1. So, there is obviously concerned about adding more space and covering up more dream space with the spool. One of the things brought up, I heard quickly, I hopefully will not step out of my bounds here, but we are talking about a D8 lot. In today's market that would not be a D8 lot anymore. So the 35 foot, is basically where all the other homes are there. This is not like she built a small, shotgun house. People can see around it. It did eat up the whole, entire lot. So, that is what we have to say about it. We are very concerned that we will be short term rental. We do not know that for a fact that we are concerned with that. With that, thank you for your time. JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you. Mike, is it Tingler? OK. Tell us your name. SPEAKER: My name is Mike Tansler. I live at Bethune Beach, right across from Joanna. We are also building a new house. I have no problem at all with her building a little plunge pool on her lot. I do not see what the fuss is. I am just hoping that you will approve her variance. Thank you. JEFFREY S BROWER: Vicki. David Harper? Tom Johnson? David Harper is not here. Tom Johnson is not here. Paolo, any correction so far? SPEAKER: We have a few, I believe, Mr Watts said something to the effect that there is only one of the few corner zoning lots left. I'm not sure that was ever included in the record. One of the speakers mentioned the rationale of covering up the green space. That is also new. In the rational for the B8 zoning was not produced in the record. I think the last speaker, Mr Tansler. That was opinion and not anything factual. SPEAKER: If I could go back up to one of my slides for a second. I just wanted to briefly address, I think, the comment about following those existing rules. I think one of the reasons you got the recommendation you did was because of the staff, at least, hamstrung and tied by what those existing rules are. Here, your existing regulations really affect this property. If you look at the white area here. That is the developable area when you apply the setback revelations that otherwise affect this property. I think you recognized, the PLDRC recognize previsit, it needed some relief in order to be put to use -- reasonable use. Had we known there was a plan to include a pool, that original variance would also have included the area you see here. That we are asking you to approve your today. With that, we appreciate your time today. I will answer any questions you have in regards to the request. We are not seeking any variances to lot coverage or any other things but simply that accessory use. Jeffrey McDavid Santiago? DAVID SANTIAGO: I do not see any harm in approving these people's pool to be there. It is a very easy decision for me. Thank you Mr Chair, I am ready for a vote, if Michael leaves her. JEFFREY S BROWER: Johansson? JAKE JOHANSSON: I have a question for Clay real quick. It says on page 5-15 that variances one and two will require the proposed woman pulled to meet setbacks and that it could be redesigned to meet the setbacks without need for a variance. Is that true? That it could be? Or that there is no way it could be? SPEAKER: I will use his image to show where the pool could be constructed. JAKE JOHANSSON: The one without the green spot? CLAY ERVIN: Not the green spot. So basically this area here. Regardless of whether it is a pool or anything else, that is the 5 foot setback as Mr Watts talked about. This applies to printable structure and accessory structures. This would apply to accessory structures. And print will structures. JAKE JOHANSSON: Mimics question, is it standard or nonstandard that everybody has a front yard, side yard and backyard, side yard? CLAY ERVIN: This is typical for a corner lot in that corner lots... JAKE JOHANSSON: Nobody has a backyard in the corner lot? CLAY ERVIN: The way our code is written, that is correct. JAKE JOHANSSON: "Come to my backyard, oh, I do not have one." CLAY ERVIN: A large side yard. SPEAKER: Say it, Jake, what the what? JAKE JOHANSSON: I have to go back and see if I have one now. So, I will ask you all about that, my question will be for you tomorrow, is, do we have any ordinances that state you shall have something in your backyard of which these people can't, but that is a different discussion. We will have that. OK, thanks, that is all I have. Oh, and this is unincorporated? CLAY ERVIN: Unincorporated. SPEAKER: To clarify, again, the way our code defines with the corner, side yard, that they do have two front and two side, as opposed to say, to front, and this being the rear yard and this being the side yard. That is in our code right now. Just to clarify. JEFFREY S BROWER: Any other questions? Troy? TROY KENT: Just because one of the neighbors said it, I just want to hear from the applicant, if you do not mind. Are you planning on utilizing this is a short-term rental? SPEAKER: It will be a primary residence. TROY KENT: Thank you very much. That is the last question I had. Are you OK with the comment, chairman?? Yes, hold up just a second. JEFFREY S BROWER: Paolo, was that permissible? SPEAKER: I believe that was discussed, and argument point in the first variance, the purpose and use of the property. We had to say that you cannot look at the ownership. If they do, hotel or motel, in a B8 zoning district, it is the only district that allows both single-family and hotel, motel use. SPEAKER: Thank you, Troy, I could see he wanted to speak. SPEAKER: Thank you, Paolo, for Japan. I would say welcome to Volusia County. It looks like your architect and you and whoever else has done a good job of putting something there that you are proud of and that you can utilize. So, I wish you the best of luck. JEFFREY S BROWER: Jay, are you good? JAKE JOHANSSON: No, I want to clarify. Unincorporated Volusia County, Bethune Beach, it will not be a vacation rental, correct? Because you cannot have vacation rentals there. Correct? SPEAKER: From a code perspective. The zoning is B8. If they opted to try to put a hotel, motel, which is a use allowed by right, there is a different code, a different application for the building code for a commercial building as opposed to a single-family. This is been constructed as a single-family pursuant to the single-family requirements within the other B8 So they cannot utilize that structure for commercial use. Any occupancy less than 30 days is considered a hotel, motel. If we receive complaints there will be follow-up and ensure enforcement is ensuring proper occupancy of the building. (Multiple speakers) SPEAKER: That is correct, single family residence. JEFFREY S BROWER: OK, I do not see anybody else. The motion on the floor, we are being asked to either reverse, our firm or modify this variance. The variance was denied. Your motion was to approve, correct? DAVID SANTIAGO: I seconded it, to approve the variance. JEFFREY S BROWER: Does everybody approve? When you say variance, it throws it off. DAVID SANTIAGO: I know. JEFFREY S BROWER: The technical wording, you're upholding the appeal of the applicant for the variance, thereby approving it. So she can build a pool. DAVID SANTIAGO: Do you want to uphold it? (Multiple speakers) JEFFREY S BROWER: Whatever Clay said. I just want to make sure everybody knows what we are voting on. SPEAKER: Mr Robbins? DANNY ROBINS: Yes. DAVID SANTIAGO: Yes. DON DEMPSEY: Yes. JAKE JOHANSSON: Yes. TROY KENT: Yes. JEFFREY S BROWER: Yes. Item 7. Orders 2024 – 02, small-scale comprehensive plan amendment for commercial future land use designation. Go ahead. SPEAKER: The property owner has acquired this land. As you can see from the aerial, it currently has a land designation and this shows the current and future land use that we are dealing with. They have acquired the property. There is an existing home since 1972. It is a nonconforming structure. They would like to resort to residential use. They are asking for a change to urban low impact and zoning, which is the subsequent item. Staff reviewed it. It is consistent. As you see from the images in front of you, all around it is residential. This will not create an inconsistency. It will create spot zoning and it will allow for residential use. It will allow the size of the lot to conform with the zoning which is the subsequent item. It went to planning a lendable regulation commission with the recommendation of approval from staff. It is now coming to you for a recommendation from them as well. If there are any questions, staff is available. JEFFREY S BROWER: Motion to approve, Danny Robbins. Second is by David Santiago. Any questions? Debate? All in favor say, "aye". (Multiple speakers) JEFFREY S BROWER: Any opposed? JAKE JOHANSSON: Aye. JEFFREY S BROWER: Motion carries six to zero… 5 to 0 unless he comes out. DAVID SANTIAGO: Motion to approve? JEFFREY S BROWER: Motion to prepare Santiago, all in favor say, "aye". That is also approved five to zero. JAKE JOHANSSON: Last week, we talked about absent members and asking them to vote when they got back. Are we going to do that when Troy gets back instead of logging the voters five to zero? From a… Maybe we can get a ruling on that. If we are here and are called 'present' and we cannot be excused from any vote for any reason. SPEAKER: As long as he heard the contents of both items on speaker… JAKE JOHANSSON: Got it. I just want to make sure we, you know, that we do not omit somebody's vote… Without reason. SPEAKER: The answer I gave was because it was quasijudicial. JEFFREY S BROWER: Troy would you like to vote? TROY KENT: Yes, very much. JEFFREY S BROWER: So the motion carries, six to zero. Next is a proposed vacation which sounds timely. Proposed vacation… Of the plat of assessors subdivision. SPEAKER: Good afternoon, County engineer. Item 9 is a request by Bloodsworth, it is an open roadway, there is a structure built across it back in 1972 and this would alleviate the encroachment created by the structure. The county has no use for this particular road and recommends approval with no issues with utilities. JEFFREY S BROWER: Thank you, David Santiago? Motion to approve by David Santiago and second is by Danny Robbins. Questions? Comments? Debate? All in favor say "I." (Multiple speakers) JEFFREY S BROWER: Any post? Vacated, six to zero. Item 8. DAVID SANTIAGO: Is a public works show now. JEFFREY S BROWER: Resolution 2024 rezoning from general commercial to urban single-family residential… Zoning classification. (Multiple speakers) SPEAKER: We are on 10, zero. JEFFREY S BROWER: I have to turn my page, not just flip it. Update, uh-oh! Update on the paid off Beach parking in beach tolling contract… Solutions. SPEAKER: Good afternoon, Ben Bartlett, public works director. We received instruction to continue Fayette Beach Public Works program and we need some direction from Council today on a few items to include in our solicitations that are ready to go out on the street for vendors to run programs for us. Very quickly, I will run through a little bit of what we are looking at as far as off beach parking goes. We are looking at license plate recognition, we will have fixed and mobile LPRs throughout the parking lot. We will include credit card kiosks, mobile payment is available for a variety of means. We include real-time status of lots for the beach app. And as directed by Council, we are looking to provide passes to Volusia residents. This is an overview of our parking lots with the LPR cameras document in vehicles for the purposes of ensuring they pay and enforcement. As far as the toll goes, technology, license plate recognition technology, fixed LPRs at beach ramps, low-volume ramps, or looking to be automated so we can have them open all the time throughout the year. Again, ramp status on the beach status so they can come in and see if the ramp they are headed to his open or closed. We are trying to automate openings and closures, as opposed to manual and the high-volume reps. We are looking at accommodations and human toll takers because we know there will be a lot of people headed to those reps who may not have paid and we need to get them on and off the beach. A quick rendering of what we anticipate of a typical situation, you would be looking at for a beach ramp under the new program. Real quick, one hangup we had in the initial solicitation was a change that allows the county to enforce parking. Currently, the legal staff is working with the Sheriff's legal staff on a MOU that would allow a third party vendor to enforce that parking citation. Then, we are looking at multiple types of options the Council can choose from, from a tiered schedule. So, summary does not pay at a parking lot they receive a citation in the mail kind of how you would from like a test situation when going through a toll and do not pay, or when it is not registered. So, you get a citation for an amount of money greater than the toll. Sorry, the parking fee you would have paid normally. And if you do not pay that after X amount of days, it increases to a certain amount. We are looking at a vendor or company that can, if you have multiple citations, it could keep you from registering your car, not just in Florida, but in other states. Finally, another option, for somebody with multiple citations, if they get picked up in the lot, you have the option to tow their vehicle. We will discuss it later on when working through options at the discretion of what you want to do. Another item we need direction, honesty credit card phase and sales task. Currently, beach tolls do not pay sales tax. The credit card processing fees are included. Typically, what you see at parking situations is the sales tax, because they are cashless and what we are proposing is also cashless. The processing fees are added on to whatever we set the rate at. We are looking for direction from the Council regarding these types of fees. On revenue and expenditures, this was a discussion, part of the discussion every time we talk about the fees and tolls but the beach itself should cost about $26 million to operate. Of that, $26 million 15 million or 15% is subsidized by the general fund. About 30% or $7.8 million comes from user fees and what we collect on the beach and we have other revenue associated with concession areas and the science center and so on. Legal considerations. I'll run through this real quick. Any changes to the beach access fees and tolls will require a 3-5 count of a vote. These fees must be reasonable by the charter so anytime you give a discount for residents, like an annual pass, it is essentially the same feed the non-residents are paying. The general fund is essentially buying that amount down and, like I said earlier, the beach access fee is treated as a toll. If those would be changed where they are offered complementary, for some reason, then sales tax would have to be implemented because it could no longer be considered a toll. So, revenue. Spreadsheet you see here, we will bring it up in a more interactive form as the Council makes decisions on how they want to go through fees. We could plug those in right now and show you the revenue. Currently, on the upper part of the spreadsheet, you can see there the tolls we estimated the passes sold for the next oncoming year based on a three year average and the current beach toll schedule, in there, and that is the projected revenue. What we did changes our current estimated total contract, we pay about 31% of the total revenue which you subtract that out and it gives you the net based on the solicitation we are looking at we estimate 27% on the costs to collect the beach goals and we will know for sure after we get the proposals back and see the cost. But based on the consultant we brought in for the consultation that's what we suspect. On the parking side we estimated the number of passes sold, our consultant looked, they have some pretty accurate numbers as far as pump each parking in the people who visit our beach. And we looked at other municipalities throughout the state that also offer beach parking and came up with these estimates based on the data. The main one I would like to point everyone to is the off beach daily parking pass that would be nonresidents paying for a parking pass. If you take the 2600 spaces we have… Identified for off each parking and multiply that by 365 days a year the number you see here at 306,000 is roughly 32, 33% of people. It's a pretty conservative number, it is an estimate and we are dealing with human behavior so when the parking program is implemented we will have a better idea obviously of how many are paying the day pass but based on the data we have this is what we are estimating and for purposes I have put in $20 for the off each daily pass and $100 for the annual nonresident pass. The resident pastor zeroed out. That's reductions in charges so that's what I went with there. Finally, last slide, what are we looking for? Direction on off beach parking, I assume we will continue with the complementary annual pass for residents in the parking and the beach access, toll schedule should counsel decide they want that and we will need direction on the credit card sales options. With that I want to turn it to the Council and we will have that spreadsheet for any questions you might have.? We have the two consultants Chris and John who can speak to the technology or the parking side of this if you have any options there as well. JEFFREY S BROWER: Does anybody have questions? David Santiago? DAVID SANTIAGO: I want to start with a comment and then questions Mr Chair. Staff, he did a great job on this, most of us got to see the presentation before this, we are impressed with the technology being deployed. At the same time, I wanted to share to the council, I want to insert a new idea into this that has never been discussed... I wanted to play a prank on my friend here. (Laughs) I want to complement my friend Troy, this is your baby. CLAY ERVIN: Are you serious are messing with me? DAVID SANTIAGO: I am assuming you. (Laughs) I know this is your baby and we are bringing it back. I told stuff that I was gonna do that. Looking forward to the discussion and the options. Thank you Mr. Chair. TROY KENT: Strike one David Santiago. (Laughs) I agree with his first comment, good work by staff on this. So my first question is, who is going to take all the risk with the equipment? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: The vendor. The vendor will be providing all the equipment, all the maintenance. Essentially a turnkey option. TROY KENT: That 2nd piece, the maintenance, that ocean is unforgiving, the salt is unforgiving, the conversation you and I had, the vendor, whoever is going to be, feels very confident and the product they have today, they can handle this. BENJAMIN BARTLETT: Our consultant Chris Wilson, spoke with a lot of the – the focus is on technology and equipment, spoke with the manufacturers, find out who can handle the salt. TROY KENT: I am not a huge fan of QR codes, I could possibly be accused of – someone could be like, put your foot in front of the QR code, I do not want to talk to them ever again. I just don't feel like their super user-friendly. What is the easiest way, I am thinking about not just my parents but many of your parents and many of our residents out there, what is the easiest way for the off beach parking for our residents to be able to have access to parking these parking lots at no additional charge? Because they're already paid for it? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: We are not just doing QR codes, there will be signage where they can use a beach app, the vendor will be required to have a customer service center were someone was to go in person during regular working business hours. If someone was to go in person, during regular working or business hours, and register that way, they can. We even thought about folks, not everybody has a smart phone. There's even an option to do a text, to pay that way. TROY KENT: To register, make sure we're on the same page here. For the residents, that there is an ease-of-use for them, to be able to park there. I liked in the presentation there's license plate readers. What can we do, as a council, someone isn't aware of this, if they get a ticket and they weren't aware of that. I want to make sure we have a way for Volusia County residents to back the ticket off of them, and not hammer them with that, maybe the first couple of times. Do we have anything in the works to do that? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: Absolutely, there is a customer service center, they are paying for it through their taxes. They can bring their citation and within the X amount of days, or call the service center or have an online component where they can register and then get the ticket. If that is something that council desired, the system is set up to do that. TROY KENT: There's an option. I keep notes from the meetings in the last time we talked about this was March 21, 2023, and back then, the beach pass, we sold 56,000, $25 apiece. I thought I had to find $1.5 million because I never want to come to the council and bring a burden without having a solution. I felt like this was more than a fix to find that $1.4 million that I felt like we needed to find to offset for our residents. The next piece, can you punch the numbers in here? It looks like current parking and if we do this off beach parking, we are going to be 11.9 million, which is almost double what we currently have now, almost. Can you change – so – if we are looking at charging $20 a day for off beach parking, we are currently charging $20 a day to drive on the beach. That is a premium. To park on the beach is an absolute premium and in my opinion, I feel like that should be $30 a day, and for our visitors, and if they don't want to pay that, that is OK. Parking our off beach parking at $20 per day, if you don't want to drive on the beach and/or park on the beach. In that same vein, if we are at $20 per day and the annual pass is hundred dollars per day, to keep the same ratio, if we go to $30 per day, the annual pass, I believe for non residents should be $150 a day, can you punch that in? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: ... That would bump your revenue up significantly. TROY KENT: Do me a favor. Take the residents at 0. BENJAMIN BARTLETT: at zero, the annual pass drops to 20, which is the inlet park pass, and that is the revenue there. With those changes your net revenue increases, I think, by $2 million. If you want to switch to the other tab, it's 11.9 in the original scenario, if you go to what you just change, sir, 13.4. With those changes at the total net increase of $1.5 million, and that is making the day pass $30, the nonresident annual pass 150, and is zeroing out the annual resident pass. TROY KENT: Gotcha. To me, council – if I understand this correctly – we don't need a super majority vote today. We are not making that happen. We would just be sending this back to staff for them to bring back a resolution for us to vote on because I would be very concerned to go forward with this without a full council, without Mr Reinhart here. I've got to tell you – that is exciting, to me. That our residence, and I will say the rest of my comments for debates because I do have some, there are other questions. Thank you. JEFFREY S BROWER: Danny Robins? DANNY ROBINS: Thank you, do we have the company we put the RFP out to today? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: We have John Ogilvy and Chris Wilson, if you questions about the technology or or numbers you can ask them. DANNY ROBINS: This is perfect scenario I have learned here and in the past, I don't want to rush a good thing. And count our chickens before they hatch. We saw with the jail, we did subsistence fees, calculated this, after year and 1/2 or two years, not so much. I don't want that to happen again. But it happens. There's a lot of things we cannot account for, storms and other COVID, because we have an election year, anything is possible these days. How did they come to some of those assumptions on the numbers? I like the numbers, I just want some more concrete. SPEAKER: Chris Wilson, prime consultant for the project. We looked at a month by month utilization of the County spaces, switch at the spaces that were included in the county, 2600, and put – we don't have a firm date on that but put monthly peak and off-peak and that assumes to be a roughly 53% utilization of the spaces. We made an assumption there is a 60% factor of those spaces used are going to be done with day passes as opposed to annual. Those are the factors we use. We look at it on a month by month basis to get 53%. DANNY ROBINS: Alright, thanks. That's all. BENJAMIN BARTLETT: These are estimates, the beach tools are hard numbers that we have and as we move through the parking program we have the hard numbers, as well. At this point, in order to give council an estimate on the revenue, fairly conservative number as we said, if you take those numbers. DANNY ROBINS: Are we voting on the RFP today? Not voting on any of this other? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: Paolo will have to come back with an ordinance that changes whatever that implements the parking fees, if there are changes, council decides to make on the tolls. We are going to use the information provided today, in our solicitation so that the vendors have an idea of what they are going to be charging, and in addition we have a couple of the things we need to talk about, as well. The citations, and on the credit card fees. We will work those in. An obvious lay when we come back, there still can be a discussion on that. DANNY ROBINS: The reason I ask, I didn't want to get ahead of ourselves, I would like to get this – I will save my comment. I have number questions. BENJAMIN BARTLETT: We will have more accurate information on the cost of the program. DANNY ROBINS: How quickly get up and running if we decide to move forward? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: The beach tolling contract is up October 1. The plan that we have laid up, solicitations hit the street, select vendors, come back to council probably around August to select those vendors, and then we are going to look to implement the program starting October 1. The beach tolls, the automation will take time, but it's written and they basically have to take over the current operation, and we anticipate to get everything, equipment ordered and all of those LPR's and everything set up will probably take about 12 to 18 months. Figure the next beach – we have this current season, we have the following currencies and, the season after that, the beach tolling season. After October 1 they will take over what they are doing now and then they will swap equipment. The parking what we are looking at, again, going into effect October 1, we can get the signage and everything up right away, they can do mobile LPR enforcement right away. We can have all of those things ready to go, and there will probably be six-month leadtime for LPR's and all of those things ready to go but we can have the parking system up quick but it will take about six months to get a lot of the fixed equipment implemented. DANNY ROBINS: In your experience, and council, how long do you think we should – say, for instance, we do get the program up and going in 18 months. How long do you think we should give it, ideally, to see what actual revenues we bring in before we go to the next step in terms of zeroing out beach passes? And free beach access and all of that stuff? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: What I would say to the question is, with parking revenue, the beach revenue, we can kind of see where that is going to go. The parking revenue, you know you're going to get – I would say probably within the first year, you're going to have a good idea of what we are seeing. How people's behavior and just now that we are charging for parking. If it will adjust at all, but, you know, the usage rate and things like that, I would say one good beach season will give you an idea what peak beach season is. I would say within 12 months of implementing the program, you would have a good idea and we did a 3 year average. It ebbs and flows. You know, like you said, different weather events can affect things in all of that. We probably have 10, 12, 15 years of each day to rely on to see how that goes. The more data you get, the more accurate information you see. But I see trend lines. DANNY ROBINS: Did you go back during the COVID days a couple of years back, did you go that far back? That is actually reality no. We have to discuss it because… BENJAMIN BARTLETT: What we saw during COVID was a record amount of visitors to the beach because they cannot do other things. COVID was an outlier and also, you got storms and hurricanes and push that number down. JEFFREY S BROWER: The vendors and the only agreement, meeting the equipment, have you talked to them and we need to discuss today or follow-up meeting the length of their contract? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: Our plan is to go 5 year initial term with the opportunity for five-year extension. This allows them to recoup the cost of the capital agreement within the first 5 years, and if they are doing a good job, we can we opt for another 5. JEFFREY S BROWER: You mentioned some of the less used approaches will be open all the time, does that mean we will be able to drive onto the beach at night, non-turtle season? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: (Laughs) When I mean open, it means during off-season. We typically close, select beach approaches during the day because we have 2 men it with a human being and you might get 15 people going through their. Unless the Council decides to change the beach code. There will still be gates there but they will be open during the off-season. JEFFREY S BROWER: No tollbooth? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: Correct. JEFFREY S BROWER: OK. That is all the questions I have. Jake Johansson. JAKE JOHANSSON: Can we go to page, PowerPoint slide 10 – 9. Page 9. As I understand, net revenue of $13 million, with the beach revenue, the way she just have it presented, page 9 Karissa. Right now on the left, I take it that revenue drives expenditure to the dollar, right? We have $26,476,576 that is what we have budget. The blue part, that is what we are making bigger and hopefully making the green general fund subsidies smaller? By that, we are going to 13? So $5 million? Should do a $5 million chunk out of the green fund subsidy? Many people told me, this will pay for the beach, it's not going to pay for the beach, it's for the business of updating the parking, and allowing some people to part a little freer. My next question to you or to Jessica is, how much does the beach really cost? You cannot say $26 million because that is what we are spending. That's what we would get. How much should we spend on the beach? I want to play devils advocate, I want to drive on the beach for free. But I do not want to shortchange the beach. If we have cost for restoration and all other things, should we as citizens be paying that $25 so we can do more coastal restorations? So we can do more beach things? I do not know. BENJAMIN BARTLETT: Beach restoration is something that obviously been a topic in the news lately. We have been fortunate to get about $80 million in beach restoration fund that we are currently implementing, we are pursuing a study that would lead eventually to other beach restoration projects if the Council decides to go in that direction. Those projects require a match, that is something that we never have undertaken before. Depending on the size of the project, those matches can be substantial. That is not something that you would see in this chart. But I would say, this is an accurate representation of the current cost of the beach and what we spent on it in terms of the capital costs, you know operations and maintenance beach safety, all the sea turtle conservation stuff. This is a representation. I would kind of refers what you are saying, I would say these are the cost, we get the revenue that you see on the pie chart, the green portion it matches. JAKE JOHANSSON: Thank you very much. That's all that I have. DAVID SANTIAGO: Thank you chair. Did the estimations include fine revenue? The Excel spreadsheet we were working with, did it include potential fine revenue? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: From the navigational district? DAVID SANTIAGO: No, sir. Fines. BENJAMIN BARTLETT: One thing on the finer citations is you can have that tiered citation level. The more you incentivize the vendor in terms of letting them keep a portion of those citations, obviously the county would have some or maybe some extra, whatever you can leave to the vendor, it it incentivizes them to be more aggressive on enforcement. And also, it will probably drive down the overall price of the program, the fixed costs that we pay just for them to collect. DAVID SANTIAGO: Does the consultant have any projections on what average fines are an exact this? Is it 10% utilization? 2%? SPEAKER: John Ogilvie, CEO of the parking. Are you asking about financial projection or percentage? DAVID SANTIAGO: Either or so we can consider plugging in an estimated conservative number. SPEAKER: Absolutely. In an environment similar to this, the average number of violations, people that don't pays about 8 to 10%. DAVID SANTIAGO: OK. I have to give you a number of what it would cost. 8 to 10%, thank you. I was going to say what is that number. But we haven't decided what the fine is. Ben, the one thing I struggled with, I don't need to put on the spot here. The 12 to 18 months for an implementation, can you reexplain that to me again? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: The vendor will take over the toll contract on October 1 from the current vendor. You will really see a difference initially in how they articulate the tolls. The fees can go into effect, all of that, the vendors have to be required to submit a transition plan. DAVID SANTIAGO: Can I pause for a second? How long before the vendor takes over that the vendor know that he or she gets awarded that vendor? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: Hopefully within 60 days. We will make a selection will bring it to council on August, that will give them September, and of August, to basically take over the contract. I will come in and hire everybody else, what you see with similar type of contracts and then they are you are not going to see anything different on the beach – so to speak – initially. They are going to order all the equipment that they have to do to get the ramps set up, what you're going to see, they can swap out 2 of the ramps, come in with the whole thing ready. They will come in and help you with everything, all the equipment, and believe one night or leave that night in the new equipment will be there and it will be automated. DAVID SANTIAGO: I want to do it a nongovernment timeline. I want to do it a private investor timeline, if we approve this. 12 to 18 months I think is too much to me. Obviously, they have 60 days out. If we are to pass this, the vendor will know that we have implemented this, when they submit the bid. It is 60 days prior to them taking over the job, they already know they are the awarding. They have 60 days there. Can we put in the RFP that 12 months from the time that they are noticed of the awardee, that all the ramps are ordered? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: We can and we can even make it a requirement with the toll takers. We can make that a requirement, by 12 months, you have to have all the rooms open, if they don't have the equipment in time or whatever, they have to keep the toll takers other. We can achieve the automation. There is some lead time, we talked amongst ourselves, there is some leadtime on some of the equipment, I tell you, it is signal equipment is the same thing. The leadtime stuff. We can definitely put that. DAVID SANTIAGO: That is my thought. 12 months, they have 60 days – I want to the private sector mode. If I shift into a little comment, I wanted to – Troy, I want to put a couple caveats on my thoughts. I am not a fan of the Mulligan as you described. If we have signage based on what staff put out there, right? And someone just ignores our signage and this is my thoughts, you all have to pay the fee for the day, you know what? You can now register for the rest of the year to not have to pay going forward. But I don't want to incentivize this, it's probably a bad term. I want people to respect the signage. It is pretty clear, you pay, and you don't, that's an additional revenue source. That is just my thoughts on the Mulligan side. And then to go to Danny's point, I have some concerns similar to you, Danny, that we have the projections, I wanted to throw out the idea to the Council when it comes to the resident not paying for beach premium access. I supported. But I think we should put some rails in there with some type of sunset. Hear me out completely, the authorization clause, Alright? I say that tactically so, it gives us time, I think we have to look with the finance guys out there to find out if we take a dive on this, if it does, I hope not. I think the numbers are conservative, but if we have to take a dive on this, we can act on it, having not reauthorized and our finance folks can tell us if in 12 or 18 months – I do not know the number. So that it aligns with our budgeting conversation so that we know, it did not work out for the free parking because of the costs and we will just allow it to sunset and not reauthorize it and in our finance team can incorporate those numbers for the next fiscal year. It can be a little bit of a risk the first year. I think it will be good, it will include some guardrails, the some of my colleagues – including me – will be comfortable with. BENJAMIN BARTLETT: We could come back once we have some data in a years time. Around budget season. DAVID SANTIAGO: I rather do it differently, I'd rather do it, it sunsets and the reason for that is, it allows us to govern that a little bit less than I have to choose my words carefully. It puts us in a different posture to deal with it. Simpler. JEFFREY S BROWER: It is a scheduled event. DAVID SANTIAGO: Unless we take action to reauthorize. That is where I prefer. I think it will make life easier. Whether it is 12 or 18 months from now. I'm specifically only talking about the resident side of the free parking. If we prove this, we would say something along the lines when this implements, Volusia County residents will have free premium beach parking for up to – for the next 12 month or 18 months. That is the message. And then we decide whether we reauthorize it at that time permanently or whatever. You see where I'm going? Do we want to discuss the other directions? You need direction on credit card fee, charge it, charge the taxes? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: Charge the credit card fee. JEFFREY S BROWER: Troy Kent. TROY KENT: Still have a couple of questions. To our consultant, how confident are you in these numbers? Here is why I ask. The numbers you came up with, back on March 21st 2023, I came up with numbers that I scratched on a paper napkin, it is actually a legal piece of paper. But, your numbers are my numbers were not very far off. How confident are you, there has been a question raised of, a little concerned with the numbers because my numbers were very conservative. I feel like your numbers are also conservative. Can you touch on that? SPEAKER: I would agree that they are fairly conservative. The financial figures the estimated took financial year 21, 22 and 23 and understanding the storm impact on 23 and do a three year average and that is a numbers you're looking at. Does not account for inflation or anything like that. We are confident in the numbers we have used to provide that. From the parking perspective we are confident it is a conservative number as well as far as utilization across other municipalities in areas we have seen similar programs implemented. TROY KENT: Thank you for that. I have heard the comment a couple of times, I'm glad you're back Councilman Santiago. Now we can start the five-minute I'm in debate. The comment a few times that we give it to residents for free. I have to get away from it myself because our residents are currently paying for this right now, they give us the budget and are paying for it right now. I say, we are going to allow them to use it at no extra charge. They are already paying for this, and Councilman Santiago, as far as the no mulligans – what I was talking about is the first section – I'm sorry, the second section, the off beach parking. The off beach parking – I never envisioned that we would charge our residents for off beach parking, ever. That residents would park there at no extra charge, because they have already paid for that. The Mulligan would be for them, if they did not register, they did not know. I'm thinking about why parents, not knowing, but they will know because they are my parents, but those individuals I don't know that pay and park, and they get the citation but are Volusia County residents – that is who I am concerned about making sure that we have a plan in place to be able to adjust that, one time, maybe two times, and help them get registered, so they can park there. New Smyrna Beach – you have to register to park it New Smyrna lots. I don't know how well, or how little they reach out to the community to do that. I'm not sure. I want us to make sure that we have a great education campaign, where we are letting our residents know, so that was strictly – that comment was strictly for our residents. If you are a nonresident and you pull in there parking and did not pay, no Mulligans. Absolutely, just want to make sure touch on that. Council, I want to say, I'm not opposed to the sunset, because I can read the room. Sometimes, not sometimes, a lot of times, this is a give-and-take, this is working together. It gives an opportunity, at least, to try and to see how well this can work. I believe, if we allow our residents to drive on the beach at no extra charge, this is a huge win for Volusia County residents. This quits giving away one of our most valuable asset to our visitors. This helps our most financially vulnerable residents. I am one of six kids, my dad worked for 35 – 40 years in this town hanging wallpaper and painting, I'm just telling you a true story. My mom was a stay-at-home mom, raised six kids. My mom would take her six kids and put us in the back of the station wagon and bring us to the beach, and us six kids thought it was a day at Disney World. She bring a loaf of better jar of peanut butter and we had a good day. There's a lot of families like that. It's a huge win for our residents on the Westside, in Deland, Deltona, Pearson. I am fortunate – my family, we can walk to the beach. If you live in Deltona you are not walking to the beach. If you live in Deland or Pearson, you are not walking to the beach. This helps some tremendously. The financial stimulus for our county, and our Beachside. People will spend money at the restaurants, go to the beach shops, get their fuel over there, etc., etc. There's a ton of positives I see with this. When I sat down with staff and the teams meeting, and we went over this information, I was super impressed because this helps us solve what I see as a problem. It brings money that we did not have, that is paid by people outside of Volusia County. Now looking over at Mr Dempsey, who railed against this, and your own right, and I did listen to it. To get anything accomplished we have to work together and give it a try. I am excited to help each and every one of you with all of your initiatives, and I just ask that at the least, we let staff bring this back to us with a full council, and let us all put our two cents in. (Bell rings) JAKE JOHANSSON: I've got a couple of follow-up questions. Ben, we talked about in the briefing, how people could register. We are having this conversation about the Mulligan. How hard is it going to be to register? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: We are going to put the word out. (Multiple speakers) BENJAMIN BARTLETT: We're going to make it easy as possible. JAKE JOHANSSON: Is an option to register online? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: Yes. JAKE JOHANSSON: That takes the Mulligan out of it, or should, if I drive anywhere, and I see residents free, register online. I should be able to, like my kid, to park in the parking zones, log on and register, and get my free ticket. BENJAMIN BARTLETT: There will have to be a process.. (Multiple speakers) JAKE JOHANSSON: What is my kid going to do, he's going to say the heck with it and pay the 30 bucks and then try to do in a time and forget and we're going to make a lot of money on my kid. That's besides the point. The other thing, with the sunset, I want to go over the timeline with you to make sure and sharp on this. September 24, any piggyback opportunities out there? Too early to ask? Piggyback... BENJAMIN BARTLETT: For selecting a vendor? JAKE JOHANSSON: Yes, to do it quicker. BENJAMIN BARTLETT: This is a pretty customized system. JAKE JOHANSSON: If we select somebody in August, they take over in October 2024, we give them until October 25 to put everything in and start using it. BENJAMIN BARTLETT: The parking will go live October 1. The signage, all of that stuff. JAKE JOHANSSON: October 1 of? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: 2024. JAKE JOHANSSON: With people, with out automation? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: We're talking beach tolls. There are some concerns about the estimates for the usage for parking. The beach tolling numbers we know these numbers, we know everybody that comes on the beach. (Multiple speakers) BENJAMIN BARTLETT: The parking will go live October 1 and there will be human beings with mobile LPR cameras to do the enforcement. We will see the revenue come in pretty quick. I would say will probably take some time to ramp up. JAKE JOHANSSON: So, can we plan on taking a look at the numbers and tweaking the number if we record around March or April 26 before we go knee-deep into the 26 – 27 budget? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: Sure. JAKE JOHANSSON: March or April 2026 to adjust the 27 budget accordingly, or not? No is going to be the answer here. JESSICA FENTRESS: Jessica Fentress, Volusia County coastal division. Peak seasons, if you want to do that got check before the season we recommend redo it in January 26, so you have a full season under your belt to implement a message before you hit the February March spring break. JAKE JOHANSSON: Got it. BENJAMIN BARTLETT: If you want to change it we have to message it out. January gets to peak season, off-peak season, should even confirm. DAVID SANTIAGO: Are using for the sunset potential? JAKE JOHANSSON: That's a scheduled time to look at it, you don't have to use the word carefully. Schedule time to time to the budget not an ad hoc elected official try to get rid of beach parking. BENJAMIN BARTLETT: We can write into the ordinance comes back to you that the fees will revert February 1 of 2026. DAVID SANTIAGO: Unless we reauthorize it. JEFFREY S BROWER: Quick question, who were spreading the tickets? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: A meter maid going out putting things on people's 's windshield? JEFFREY S BROWER: If someone parking doesn't pay, who writes the tickets? SPEAKER: This is specific to off beach, there's two different elements for the improve surface lots, where they had the fixed LPR cameras, the software automatic lay detect if a vehicle is in violation and there's a human in the middle process call center that will verify the correct vehicle that was registered against the vehicle that was in violation, and they would issue the ticket remotely. On the mobile site so any of the lots that are not improved, areas in the lower part we observed in New Smyrna Beach, where there's grass or sand area for offstreet parking, those would be covered through mobile enforcement and able to issue a citation at time of violation and follow-up through the process in counsel. JEFFREY S BROWER: No law enforcement involved? PAOLO SORIA: One of the slides, and the Sheriff's office with the MOU, so after the change where the county itself can no longer have law enforcement authority, there's a statute that allows for essentially civilian enforcement of parking infractions, but it's the sheriff's authorization who does that. Not the county. Unlike in a municipality, the municipality itself can hire parking enforcement specialists. Under the County Sheriff scenario, only the sheriff can do that. Hence the statement about the MOU and process, with the sheriffs to delegate that parking enforcement specialist and civilian authority to whoever our vendor is. These are not law enforcement officers, they do not carry a gun, they cannot arrest people, they cannot stop people. Essentially they cite you for parking. TROY KENT: How we had a conversation with the sheriff about this? PAOLO SORIA: The sheriff is not interested in doing parking authority. Yes we have talked to this. JEFFREY S BROWER: With two other people our discussions or debate mode? Danny Robins for questions. DANNY ROBINS: If we can go back. Estimated passes for residents is 31,595, how many residents to be have countywide? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: Mr Robins, if you look at the annual combo pass for residents, and add those two together, because some people by the combo pass which includes the beach pass and the inlet parks, that's approximately 59,000, 60,000 total resident passes we sold on average. DANNY ROBINS: How many people do we have in Volusia County? PAOLO SORIA: 280,000 households. That is just families, and that as per the last census. JAKE JOHANSSON: My household has four passes so I cannot see the numbers there. DANNY ROBINS: I just want to make sure because of the gap there, we are not where the sunsetting comes in, we are waiting to go ahead and reevaluate. I just want to put those additional fees and burdens back on the tax, it just will make a bad situation worse. Thank you. JEFFREY S BROWER: David Santiago? DAVID SANTIAGO: I will attempt to bring this in for landing. I will will start to I moved to authorize staff to proceed with the solicitation of bids for the technology and process enhancements as outlined to incorporate 12 month timeline in the bid for installation of technologies as described in the presentation. To assess the creditor fee to the purchaser on top of the taxes. BENJAMIN BARTLETT: For both beach tolls and parking fees. DAVID SANTIAGO: Yes sir. And included with that, Paolo you can stop me, I don't know if you need this in this motion, to update the fees for beach access, for nonresidents to be $30. BENJAMIN BARTLETT: Just it as shown on the screen or you can change. Whatever you want. DAVID SANTIAGO: If somebody wants to amend something, they can. $30 for nonresidents... Daily rate, annual pass, raising it to $150 to implement within, the proposal when it comes back to us a reauthorization of the program of waiving of the resident fee to expire January 31 of 2026. Unless we authorize. To include fines, I'm going to throw out their colleagues, we did not talk about it but somehow get it debated. A fine of $100 for anyone who violated and I know you need guidance for how much of that fine does the vendor keep. I think the way been presented to us, if we can up that number based more than the actual that can offset the cost on the other side. I will go out on a limb and say 35% keep for the vendor on the fines. The reason for throwing that number out there so that the vendor can consider that in their proposal when they submitted to us and what potential revenues are. I think I got it all. BENJAMIN BARTLETT: You gotta establish the parking fees as well. DAVID SANTIAGO: Residence, no charge for premium beach parking and off-site parking, no charge for residents. That register. BENJAMIN BARTLETT: And then the daily pass for nonresidents. $30 for getting on the beach. DAVID SANTIAGO: $20 off beach. They are going to have to listen to the tape later. I think I got it. JEFFREY S BROWER: It is a lot. TROY KENT: The staff needed a ton of direction with this. I applaud Mr. Santiago for breaking it down the way that he has. The sunsetting, I just want to make sure that my mind is right, we are talking about for the beach driving, the premium on the beach. Not the off beach parking, I want to make sure we are all in agreement on that. I don't want our residents, if this council or future Council decides to make a change with that, they need to really have a big public hearing here because people on Volusia County will lose their mind rightfully so. DAVID SANTIAGO: Only for premium on beach parking. BENJAMIN BARTLETT: I apologize, there is also off, if someone was to purchase off beach annual pass – nonresident. I have it shown as 100. It up to council. DAVID SANTIAGO: I think it is fair. TROY KENT: That goes what the beach currently, we change that from $30-$150, keeping that ratio, I think it is fair as well. DAVID SANTIAGO: At $100? Anything as you need? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: I would like to make a comment on the citation fees, one thing I would recommend on the Council's discretion, obviously, we set it at $20, someone doesn't pay to get a citation in the mail. You can start at 50, if they don't pay within 30 days, you can pay 100. The portion of that, that the vendor keeps, typically industry standards are a little higher than 35%. I would like to have Chris talk real quick about the citations. SPEAKER: On the citations side, the vendor would be closer to the 55 or 75%, for the efforts to collect those citations. Industry standards would be higher. DAVID SANTIAGO: They would collect that? Or the collection goes to them? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: They would collect the money, if they park and pay, they would've paid 20 bucks. With a citation, it is $100. We get the $20 back, and then the Delta, the vendor would keep 65% of that. DAVID SANTIAGO: And that is industry-standard. I think it is a high number. BENJAMIN BARTLETT: It is, I tell you, it is a high number. It incentivizes them other enforcement and drives down this because you see under estimated collection expense because they know that is something that they can control and get more of you that way. It will drive down the cost of the overall system. TROY KENT: Thank you. You mentioned the 150 and go up from there, is that because I am sure there is some science behind that, people will pay that quicker. They see, if they don't pay it by 50 days, is that the reasoning behind it? There is more success? You gotta sell me on you guys keep a 65% of this. (Laughter) TROY KENT: I am looking at you like you are that guy. SPEAKER: I am here to provide industry expectations. You got 2 choices, is the way is normally done, you can have a maximum fee that is reduced if someone paid earlier, that would be the reverse so $50-$100, random numbers. $100 if you pay with the next number of days, it is $50. That also will certainly generate a significant number of people or you can do it… TROY KENT: Which one gets the money paid quicker? SPEAKER: Maximum amount with a discount if paid within X days. Same number basically just flipping it. This comes down to the line between customer service and revenue generation. I would recommend, because these are going to be sent in the mail, I would say the industry average minimum is the discount kicks in within 14 days. If you pay within 40, you get the lower rate. Or 21 or 36, or 7. There are municipalities that do as little of 7 to 10 days. If you add that amount of time to get the citation in the mail, that is 3 to 4 days. It entirely up to the Council's discretion. DAVID SANTIAGO: $50 if paid within 14 days and $100 within 30 days? Or $100 you will get a discount. SPEAKER: I would say that is an industry-standard. There are numbers that are much higher, it also typically has to do if there are state regulations. Basically, you want it to be enough. That is the goal, for everybody to pay before they leave and have a great time. DAVID SANTIAGO: One question, if we change it to 65%, is that 65% after we get paid ours? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: After we get the 20, they get 65. DAVID SANTIAGO: OK. BENJAMIN BARTLETT: We want to make sure the minimum. DAVID SANTIAGO: Mr. Chairman, I want to change that portion of my motion on the fines, the fine will reflect as follows: discounted rate of the $50 to pay within 14 days, 30 days or after is $100 and the vendor will keep 65% after the collection of our portion of the fee of the party. TROY KENT: I will gladly 2nd that. JAKE JOHANSSON: You said $100. 30 days or longer, that is actually 15 days or longer. BENJAMIN BARTLETT: The fee is $100. Unless they pay within 14 days. DAVID SANTIAGO: Thank you Jake. TROY KENT: I will 2nd that. DAVID SANTIAGO: I got a B in math. JEFFREY S BROWER: You second motion? GEORGE RECKTENWALD: Are CFOs is maybe 65% (Indiscernible). SPEAKER: I have a concern that with the vendor being in control and talking about the mail time and delay time to get it processed out that 65% of $50 is less than 65% of $100. What is the amount they keep depend on the amount of time it takes to pay? There is a potential of a perversion there, the vendor has an incentive to take it longer so they can keep the 65% of $100. DAVID SANTIAGO: That is a good point. I want to make sure that that's not the vendor would – I want to be sure that the system does not get gamed. JAKE JOHANSSON: If it takes the vendor 3 weeks – DAVID SANTIAGO: I think they can pay online. JAKE JOHANSSON: They don't know they got caught until they get the letter, right? DAVID SANTIAGO: I was just going to ask that. What do you think will be better? SPEAKER: If you base it off the postmark date, there's nothing to be gained there, or if the fee were a percentage of a flat fee, of a certain number, regardless of when the resident paid. DAVID SANTIAGO: Only as it pertains to the 5. BENJAMIN BARTLETT: It is 65% of what we collect. So they keep 65%. SPEAKER: It can be easier to based off of postmark date. I think they were mentioning that the fine would be how long has it been to the violation, appeared be based off when they send the bill. DAVID SANTIAGO: Thank you for that. I will amend my motion to incorporate what Ryan just said, as it pertains to the fines, 65% of the postmark date. TROY KENT: The 2nder is fine with that. JEFFREY S BROWER: OK. Any debate on all of that? DON DEMPSEY: I know this only applies.. I am sorry. I will speak up. This only applies to the beach on those? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: It actually only applies to the beach. In the parts are different. DON DEMPSEY: The combo pack? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: The inlet parks are paid for through the port district, we are not proposing any changes to the fees on those. If someone wants to enter the inlet parks, they can still get the annual pass at $20 or if they want to pay the day pass of $10. DON DEMPSEY: We are still charging Volusia residents to use the little lake fields, correct? BENJAMIN BARTLETT: I believe they have to rent them out, I am not sure on that to be honest with you. DON DEMPSEY: The charge Volusia County residents $30 per hour on the little lake fields. It is $20 per hour without lights. Is that right? Is what it says here. I want to know, I have been pushing for ballfields for quite a while, until we get those, are we also amenable to waiving the cost of using Little League field in Volusia County to County residents? Just to use the fields per hour? 20 bucks per hour to take your kid out and let the practice and Little League. As long as we are in this mode of trying to the County residents use… GEORGE RECKTENWALD: I want to know what revenue we are adding to the park budget. DON DEMPSEY: We can charge more, we charge 30 per hour for County resident and non-County residents 35 per hours. To use those. Why can't we raise the non-County residents to $50 and let the County residents use the ballfields for free? In that same vein, to go and use and DeBerry and Lake Monroe Park. Camping fees is $25 per night for a 10. $40 per night for an RV. JAKE JOHANSSON: Great point but not this agenda item. DON DEMPSEY: If the debate is beach access, that is fine, but I want to make sure the Westside is going to get the same kind of love, that's all. I will support you, Troy, that's the way we're headed. JEFFREY S BROWER: The Westside is going to go to the beach, too. If this is important to you, Troy says it's important to everybody, so let's bring it back as a separate item and look. DON DEMPSEY: Can we asked staff to look into that, to some of these others. Yes, I want to make sure my foot there's other areas we are going to offer free uses for residents, let's spread it out. JEFFREY S BROWER: It is not free, it's just no additional charge. DON DEMPSEY: To taxpayers. DAVID SANTIAGO: I'm open to the ideas, let's come up with proposals or ideas. SPEAKER: Quickly, our parks are free to use for individuals, it's when you are a league in scheduling practices, you have to go out and pay the fees. Anybody can use any field that for individuals. DON DEMPSEY: There are backs up, my son had to pay... JAKE JOHANSSON: Can we get back on task? JEFFREY S BROWER: We are heading that way and he wanted to clarify that, thank you for the clarification. Looking back at this, at the motion, everybody's name just cleared. We've got a motion for a whole list of things, that you seem to be happy with. You can deal with that. BENJAMIN BARTLETT: We are happy because we got direction, that is something that the council goes for and we can move forward with solicitation. JEFFREY S BROWER: If there is no other debate – I thought you hit your – OK. I don't think we need – well... I hope we don't need to call the roll. All in favor say aye, any opposed? You have direction, go to work, thank you, well done. That passes 6 to 0, Karissa. Item 11 is District 1 and District 3 and district 5 appointments to the Children and Families Advisory Board. I don't think we have enough applicants, do we? KARISSA GREEN: You have one applicant for each of the districts. You have missed Jana Register for district 1, Tanya Webb for district 3, and Larisa Ivanova for district 5. This board is having an issue meeting quorum, so we do encourage someone to apply. JEFFREY S BROWER: Do we have district one nomination? KARISSA GREEN: Jana Register is district 1 applicant. JEFFREY S BROWER: Do we have district 3 nomination? SPEAKER: Tanya Webb. JEFFREY S BROWER: Is there district 5? SPEAKER: Larisa Ivanova. JEFFREY S BROWER: Don, do you know Jana? SPEAKER: (away from mic) JEFFREY S BROWER: We have Jana Register district 1, Tanya Webb, District 3, Larissa in district 5. TROY KENT: You need a second? KARISSA GREEN: Yes, please. TROY KENT: Happy to second all of those. JEFFREY S BROWER: Troy seconds each nomination. Any questions or debate? All in favor of the nominees, say aye, any opposed? That also passes six to zero. KARISSA GREEN: Next you have appointment to the Educational Facilities Authority, five-year term of Michael (unknown name) expired March 1, 2024, did not wish to be reappointed. Raymond Strother and Vince Ryan are the new applicants. JEFFREY S BROWER: Anyone? The nomination? KARISSA GREEN: Correct. JEFFREY S BROWER: You need one person, right? (Multiple speakers) JAKE JOHANSSON: I would like to nominate Vince Ryan. DAVID SANTIAGO: Second. JEFFREY S BROWER: Jake Johansson nominates Vince Ryan, second was by David Santiago. Any questions? All in favor say aye. That nomination as pastor 6 to 0. Do we have any public participation? I don't see him here. John? He is where? Can we call him? It is not John Nicholson. OK. Mr. Josh, is it Josh? Josh Trumans? Joel. Come on up. SPEAKER: Like I was saying this morning, the person who is over Mr. Hutchinson – the main person, I don't remember his name – but he told me that they did not even take... I submitted people that had this same things wrong with my property, to their property – vehicles, fences that are too high, that are not on right, all of this good stuff. They did not investigate any of them. His words to me were, I did this two years ago. His words to me, do you want me to take a look at a few of those now? I says, what are you, on drugs? It has been two years? You do not have no problem investigating me within seven days. But, they could not do them. They are discriminating against me. If I have to follow the rules, everybody in here has to follow the rules. You cannot have a grill in your yard. By code enforcement. It has to be in your garage. OK. You cannot have chairs in your backyard. Chairs have to be in the garage, unless you are sitting in them. This is what the code enforcement – who the hell comes up with the rules like this? Do you people have no chairs in your yard? I will bet you do. I waited here all day long to get my second three minutes. I still got 58 seconds. Nine hours to address you, and nobody on this court here, or your board is going to do anything about it. But I've got to tell you something – it is not that hard to look up where everyone of you live, and see if you've got shit wrong with your house, and I can turn you in, too. TROY KENT: Point of order on the language, we have women and children listening. SPEAKER: Excuse me, that is all you get in on this. JEFFREY S BROWER: OK. George, we have all of this coming up as part of one of our workshops. We are looking at – we are looking at codes and permit requirements. Anyway, you don't have to answer that. County manager. Closing comments. GEORGE RECKTENWALD: Thank you, just a couple of things I wanted to bring up. I hope all of you received in your email and I know some of you get stuff in different ways, but we upgraded our weekly briefing, we consolidated and updated so you should have received a weekly briefing from my desk, it looks like this. Really pleased with Michael Ryan and his team, they have upgraded that substantially, so it is a nice thing to look at what is going on in the week. Secondly, I want to point out some outreach events we have going. Emergency management group out there, Clint Mecham, the company there are out in town hall outreach events, at the Deland library April 24, 5 to 630, the Daytona regional Library, May 1, 5 to 645, Ormond Beach, May 9, 5 to 645, Deltona Library, May 22, five to 6:45 PM, New Smyrna Beach library, May 29, five to 6:45 PM, and Port Orange library, June 12, 5 to 6:30 PM. We have upcoming hurricane Expo at the Fairgrounds, where people can go and see vendors that had hurricane related supplies for our citizens. Lastly, I want to throw a shout out – the folks, the partners there, and Ponce Inlet group. February 29th we met the deadline to have all of our easements, there were 50 of them. It was a Herculean task, but it allows us now to be eligible to use the 700,000 yd.³ of beach sand that is being dredged from the inlet. That will help us out immensely, and this will help – this particularly sand will be slated to go north of the inlet. Construction is anticipated in this coming fall/winter 2024. Mayor Prensky, their elective officials, skip White, Mike Milano and the manager and town staff all went out and really beat the doors down. In our shop Shanna (unknown name), Keith (unknown name) and the gang at right away, Jane Lewis, they work very long and difficult project to get that done. I did not think they, quite honestly, a lot of counties around are struggling to get this type of work done with the core, and they are not able to meet those requirements. Of course, the leader of the whole project is our Jessica Fentress who knocks it out of the park, every time. Appreciate that. That is all I have. JEFFREY S BROWER: Mr. County Attorney, nothing? OK. Danny Robins. DANNY ROBINS: Thanks, Mr Chair, real quick just want to make sure that we get what I had talked about, or what we had talked about earlier about the standards mirroring the affordable housing, but for everybody on the April 30 discussion. Do I need to put that, Chair, into motion or are we mutually agreed we will address that on April 30 meeting? JEFFREY S BROWER: Does anybody have an issue? DANNY ROBINS: Just to discuss having the same standards apply to everyone else, whatever the building standards are, and permitting come back for discussion. In the workshop, April 30 workshop. I think. At what time? OK. Did we have any update, I know we got sent back with a couple of things for supper we had some ordinances that were coming back, there was a gun ordinance that was outstanding, we had sex offender stuff coming out. And then some parking, we have an idea? SPEAKER: It's coming back next week, but it may be the first thing of April just because of the schedule. What was the other one? DANNY ROBINS: The truck parking? SPEAKER: The connex boxes are on your follow-up box list, they're going to the planning and review committee this week and back to council next week. DANNY ROBINS: Excellent. Thank you. Accolades. George, staff, I think those are good. Get ready to put those out. And the rock stars and bends department, and then the road bridge, addressing some of the stormwater issues. And all the way down in District 3 and is that granite that you all are using for the culverts? That is good stuff. Tons of compliments from constituents and then to customer service, applied for the customer service guys. We had some emails coming. Thank you for that. Other than that, that is it. Thank you guys. DAVID SANTIAGO: Great compliment from public works, it's actually Ben's birthday, in case you didn't know. I got a few items. (Laughs) Normally and pretty quite at this time. In follow-up to what some of Danny's inquiries, on some pending stuff, I do not know how long ago it was just to sit on council to bring a certain item back up. We can talk about the medical lien ordinances, several months ago. I want to – unless there's any objections Mr. chair, to bring that back. I wanted on the April 2 meeting so we can make a decision on that. It was the Medical Lien Ordinance. It was going to be 2 options for us. TROY KENT: Do you want to 2nd Chairman? Or is the staff OK? JEFFREY S BROWER: Is it possible for staff to bring it back April 2? MICHAEL G DYER: We are waiting for feedback from Halifax but we can proceed at that. DAVID SANTIAGO: They can come and speak in person. I wanted on April 2. Unless council objects. Thank you. What else? Thank you Mr. Chairman that. There was one thing, maybe that was concerning to me, not wanting but one thing that made him a note of, from the public testimony today, the gentleman that mentioned that she left. I get it. That he wanted to get a solar panel permit and is not being issued because he's got a pending fence permit? I don't know – I feel a little uncomfortable with holding somebody up another permit based on a previous permit issue. You can elaborate if that is. CLAY ERVIN: What we are going to do, will give you a full evaluation of what happens, so that way, all the concerns that he was identifying I clarified. Including that. DAVID SANTIAGO: Alright. I want to make sure he was in policy. I have another thing here for you. There was something else that came here today during testimony on the variance, when we did the pool variance. Mark said something interesting to me into us that I have heard in the past, I think his words were, I will paraphrase to be safe. He said the staff is oftentimes hamstrung on various request because of the 5 criteria? CLAY ERVIN: Yes sir. DAVID SANTIAGO: I wanted to see what the Council things on when we can explore options. The way the ordinance is written, almost every single one I think comes to us as a denial, I wonder if there's opportunities for us to loosen that belt a little bit and say 4 of 5. I want to see in a method because we do with these variances all the time and will usually just saying that it makes sense. I don't know if there is appetite to say that the applicant meets the 4 or 5 or come to start from recommendation of approval. JEFFREY S BROWER: Is that control tricky by counsel? Or no state law? CLAY ERVIN: We brought this forward about 2 years ago in the Council and ask if you would want to have, or just majority of it or where there is specific month you wanted to have to meet. It doesn't often bring it back. DAVID SANTIAGO: I think this is a more – I don't want to talk about another counsel – this council will be supportive of change in the area. CLAY ERVIN: We will research that, if you don't mind, with a lot of the stuff that is pending, is it OK if we come back and say May or June? DAVID SANTIAGO: That is fine with me. JEFFREY S BROWER: What year? (Laughter) DAVID SANTIAGO: Mr. Chairman… I am done. Thank you everybody. JEFFREY S BROWER: OK. Don Dempsey? DON DEMPSEY: Do we know where we are with this study on the ballparks and everything? SUZANNE KONCHAN: Mr. Burbach is out of town today, I don't have it readily available. I think we are within 60 days of receiving that part of the study that I don't have the day memories. I make sure that I get that information to counsel. DON DEMPSEY: That is all. Thank you. JAKE JOHANSSON: I thank you, sir. We had a discussion couple months ago. About possibly combining the hospital authorities, we have 3 of them, I have had a few informal conversations with our County attorney and I think since we have all this spare time on our hands, can we add that to the list of things to put on the Council agenda tracking? To get on the future? MICHAEL G DYER: In essence, part to be of the legislative platform. And referendum is required. That is something certainly is a policy position. JAKE JOHANSSON: Perfect. I want to get on the to we can get it on the referendum during the election so we can push through that and get some more government on the way. Thank you. JEFFREY S BROWER: Troy Kent. TROY KENT: Thank you Chairman. George another meeting, no consent agenda item will pull. Your stuff is more concise, better job of information that is being provided. Nonconfrontational items, I give you and our Chairman also set the agenda, I give both of you credit for the streamlined, excellent work. Ben Bartlett, you worked your tail off, mad props to you and just because he is sort of looking at me but not really, Clay, you can shake your head all you want. They told you you were the best in the business, you heard it appear but when you have a land-use attorney who is excellent, by the way, singing your praises. Goodness gracious! He is getting love all around. And enough of those accolades. I just want to say, since this council has made the changes at the ocean center I want to brag for just a quick moment about a couple of things there. This council decided to make positive changes so there would be events for our residents to attend. With the hiring of Lynn Flanders, the director of the Ocean Center, with your leadership and the skills that you bring to the table, from your time up in the Atlanta area, we have had Cat Williams this past weekend, we have it again this Friday and Saturday. I think it is the 7th and 8th motocross again. There will be bull riding on March 16 and just announced today at noon hugely popular, extremely successful, sell out many crowds comedian Bert Kreischer has signed to be on the Ocean Center to be on Father's Day Sunday, June 16, another feather another, George for you and your team, and Ms. Flanders, of course, you and your team. Super exciting news and it is giving our residents and visitors something to do in our community. And of course, I am excited about the ripple effect where people will go out to dinner and some will get hotel rooms, etc., etc., etc. It is a beautiful center and we need to showcase it and use it as much as we possibly can. Last but not least, a huge thank you to this council for agreeing to come back with defined areas for our parking fees, off beach and on our beach at a premium for our residents and visitors alike. Thank you very much and have a great evening. DAVID SANTIAGO: Aren't you glad I came up with that idea with the free parking? TROY KENT: If it wasn't for your idea, Councilman Santiago, I just don't know what I would do. (Laughs) But yes, thank you. JEFFREY S BROWER: OK. I'm going to pass today. At 4:27 PM, the meeting is adjourned.